View Poll Results: Does it bother you when Olympic team event medalists are called "Olympic medalists"?

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  • Yes

    78 24.53%
  • No

    169 53.14%
  • I may get used to it in time

    46 14.47%
  • Depends who the skater is

    25 7.86%
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  1. #61
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    Because inferior skaters can medal over superior skaters who 1) have weaker teams 2) may not even get to compete
    This is true of every team sport. Replace skater with whatever word is germane to the sport.

    (And I know a number of people who would say that PE is harder than calculus... But to go to your example, I've seen multiple high schools where the valedictorian took the perfect grades in easy classes strategy. They still got the honor, and resulting scholarships, over much smarter students who learned more in AP classes.)

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skittl1321 View Post
    This is true of every team sport. Replace skater with whatever word is germane to the sport.
    Yup, but sports fans definitely know the difference.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skittl1321 View Post

    (And I know a number of people who would say that PE is harder than calculus... But to go to your example, I've seen multiple high schools where the valedictorian took the perfect grades in easy classes strategy. They still got the honor, and resulting scholarships, over much smarter students who learned more in AP classes.)
    This sounds unlikely. At many schools, there is often a tie (sometimes between as many as 20 people) for valedictorian, so they might break the tie based upon the difficulty of the curriculum chosen. At other schools, advanced classes are weighted more heavily so that students can get higher than the traditional 4.0 if they take AP, honors, IB classes. Schools aren't dumb enough to give it to someone who took all easy classes.

  4. #64
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    Who cares. Any real fan of the sport knows what kind of medal they won and can judge its value for themselves. For someone who doesnt follow or have awareness of that sport, the people could lie and make up something altogether and you wouldnt know the difference anyway, so what is wrong with factually stating what is technically true- Olympic gold or Olympic medalist.

  5. #65
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    Schools aren't dumb enough to give it to someone who took all easy classes.
    Apparently some are. Our district weighted honor over regular, but not AP over honors. My friend was #2 to a case like I described in a neighboring school.

    They also had to put rules down about transferring from an easier school (where it was easy to get good grades) to a more difficult one the last semester senior year because they were sued multiple times.

    I don't know if it was the state or district but valedictorian got a year of free tuition, so it was a big deal and those top students definetly played the game to keep their GPA top. AP classes could kill it (or being in a sport that required a class).

    When I taught I saw it become even more common.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by AxelAnnie View Post
    I think it is cheating..
    I don't see it as cheating or even as lying, but it would be attempting to deceive if directed at folks who don't pay that much attention to skating or likely even remember there was a team event. Let's be honest. Some of these skaters weren't good enough to get anywhere near a podium on their own but got dragged into the medals by having some strong teammates. (Say thank you, Jeremy and Kaetlyn.)

    I notice that in their promotional materials, SOI is not calling the US skaters bronze medalists, they are saying "team bronze medalists" (except Davis & White of course).

  7. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by Susan M View Post
    I notice that in their promotional materials, SOI is not calling the US skaters bronze medalists, they are saying "team bronze medalists" (except Davis & White of course).
    Not on the U.S. and Canadian SOI sites, though:
    U.S.: http://www.starsonice.com/the-skaters.html

    A recent thread in GSD was titled "Kaetlyn Osmond - Olympic Silver Medalist?"
    Quote Originally Posted by fsfann View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by fsfann View Post
    Oh lordy, you guys are right. I don't even think of the team event... but I guess that is correct!! I still can't wrap my head around that!
    Last edited by Sylvia; 04-15-2014 at 12:19 AM.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  8. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by Susan M View Post
    I don't see it as cheating or even as lying, but it would be attempting to deceive if directed at folks who don't pay that much attention to skating or likely even remember there was a team event. Let's be honest. Some of these skaters weren't good enough to get anywhere near a podium on their own but got dragged into the medals by having some strong teammates. (Say thank you, Jeremy and Kaetlyn.)

    I notice that in their promotional materials, SOI is not calling the US skaters bronze medalists, they are saying "team bronze medalists" (except Davis & White of course).
    I was at SOI in NJ the other night. The team bronze medalists were initially introduced in the following "2 time US Champion(s) and Olympic bronze medalist(s)" for Ashley and C/S. "4 time US champion and Olympic bronze medalist" for Jeremy. "US ladies champion and Olympic bronze medalist" for Gracie. "Olympic bronze medalist" for Jason. When they did second numbers, it was just "Olympic bronze medalist." There was no team qualifier at any point and I really wouldn't expect there to be at US tour.

  9. #69
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  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by iarispiralllyof View Post
    Because inferior skaters can medal over superior skaters who 1) have weaker teams 2) may not even get to compete



    Yes I'm rallying against all people who are athletically inclined. Never mind the fact that most people will agree that in general Calculus is a harder class. Btw I'm not asking for examples of people who had asthma or physical problems and struggled with PE, I'm talking about the norm not the exception. Are we really going to debate as to whether PE or Calculus is harder?
    Excuse me but I don't have asthma or any physical problems. How dare you assume that I have some physical disability or a disease! Athletics is simply not my strong point. I am very good at Calculus and other Math courses. Your condescending attitude is very troubling.

    I have already addressed the less talented members of a TEAM- an idea that you seem to bother you a lot. A TEAM wins as a whole, regardless of who has more talent. The less talented ones have their contributions also.

    With this, I am going to stop arguing with you.

  11. #71
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    It seriously doesn't matter. The general public does not give it much thought. Yes die hard skating fans will know the difference. As for not so die hard skating fans...after they read someone won an Olympic medal, they will forget about it 10 seconds later. Ashley Wagner Olympic bronze medalist, Carolina Kostner Olympic bronze medalist. Ask a non skating fan from the US 10 min later and they will say Nancy Kerrigan won the whole dang event.

    You win a medal, you win a medal. I am sure people like Jeremy look at their medal and know they did zero to contribute to it, but at the end of the day he was still part of the team. He is kind of like the football players who just sit on the sidelines during the entire superbowl but still get a ring if their team wins.
    Last edited by UGG; 04-15-2014 at 01:29 AM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    Excuse me but I don't have asthma or any physical problems. How dare you assume that I have some physical disability or a disease! Athletics is simply not my strong point. I am very good at Calculus and other Math courses. Your condescending attitude is very troubling.
    Seriously? I wasn't accusing YOU of having a physical disability. I was telling you that I didn't need you to bring up such examples to prove your point as they would be the exception, not the norm. I'm far from athletic myself but I always received A's in PE because my PE teachers always handed them out like candy if you showed up every day and at least tried. That may not be the case for everyone, but that would certainly never happen in a Calc class. In general most people would agree Calc is a harder class.

    While I can accept differing opinions, this is the first time I've seen people so passionately championing PE's difficulty level in comparison to Calculus (a random analogy I just thought off the top of my head that is now being dissected).
    Last edited by iarispiralllyof; 04-15-2014 at 02:28 AM.

  13. #73
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    SOI broadcast did specify that those skaters who won only a team Olympic medal were referred to as 'Olympic Team Medallist'.

  14. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    How is it cheating? When the Lakers won the NBA championship, should only Kobe Bryant and Pau Gasol get the rings but not the players that came off the bench, those with less talent and less minutes?

    A team was created and a new event was created for these Olympics, and hopefully future ones. I was skeptical at first, but when I actually watched the event, I was sold on it. More skaters got Olympic medals, and it was a different event, thus adding variety to it.

    I don't know if this really happenened several decades ago, but I can envision figure skating as compulsory figures etched into the ice, by individuals. At some point they introduced a pairs event, and later an ice dance event. That was different, as was the free skating. I don't know if people protested against these new disciplines because they were not 'individual' and they were not etching compulsory figures into ice.

    Would you say all these were contrived just because they did not exist inititally?
    Not what I am saying at all. BTW - I said I knew it was not cheating.

    Your example proves my point. Everyone on the basketball team contributes to the team effort. They practice drills together, travel together, etc., etc., etc. A country's figure skating "team" does nothing together except press promotions, and represent the same country.

    Has nothing, in my mind, to do with new or old.
    DH - and that's just my opinion

  15. #75
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    I have no problem if they are called the Olympic team gold medalists or team silver medalists, I think it's same in gymnastics. But for the market value, I have no problem if they are called Olympic medalists in shows.

  16. #76
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    An Olympic 'Team' medallist is still an Olympic medallist just as much as an individual medallist. Silly of anyone to think otherwise.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by UGG View Post
    You win a medal, you win a medal.
    And if you are Michelle Kwan, non-skating fans just go ahead and assume that medal was gold. Both of them...
    Which is probably why she is most often announced as "Two time Olympic medalist" and not "Bronze and Silver Olympic medalist". The description works better in her favor.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skittl1321 View Post
    And if you are Michelle Kwan, non-skating fans just go ahead and assume that medal was gold. Both of them...
    Which is probably why she is most often announced as "Two time Olympic medalist" and not "Bronze and Silver Olympic medalist". The description works better in her favor.
    But she is a two time Olympic Medalist...there is nothing deceiving about it. Same as how there is nothing deceiving about saying someone who won a team medal at the Olympics is an Olympic medalist.

  19. #79
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    It's fascinating to see that even a poll of uber post season fans, largely feel that it doesn't bother them. This to me translates into "the general public" then has no idea whether the medal is of the truly rare individual event variety, or the team type. This will translate over time (pretty quickly I should think given the public's short memory) to a dilution of the market power or 'value' of the Olympic individual medal, and having a Team medal will be held in pretty much the same high esteem. Interesting.

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