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  1. #61
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    tradition in fs us over with- it's a technical world now- the U.S Just didn't get the memo- gold would need a triple axel in the next Olympics- not gonna happen

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by marialynn View Post
    tradition in fs us over with- it's a technical world now- the U.S Just didn't get the memo- gold would need a triple axel in the next Olympics- not gonna happen
    Oh please. Russia is a joke in the eyes of the world right now

  3. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by marialynn View Post
    tradition in fs us over with- it's a technical world now- the U.S Just didn't get the memo- gold would need a triple axel in the next Olympics- not gonna happen
    Which lady has a triple axel coming up?
    "Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility." - Ambrose Bierce

  4. #64
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    Why this talk of the 3A?
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

    from Speedy Death

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by princeton123 View Post
    Well, I think it's safe to say no Russian ladies are winning that gold in Pyeongchang so maybe she doesn't have to do all that much.
    The most accurate insight indeed. All she needs is the audience on her side by keep saying that Yuna is her idol. If she puts two clean programs with 3-3, and the audience go crazy for her, she will get the medal.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by screech View Post
    Just my opinion, but personally I find Gracie a bit bland. I enjoy her more this year than last year (where I found her still pretty junior-ish), but I think she needs to put more visible passion into her programs. She has the technical aspect, but I'm not really 'wanting' to watch her yet.
    Totally agree. She's a beautiful, classic skater. To me her long program was like skating to music to background music. She needs to find something with more passion, depth, edge. The first time I started cheering for her was at the team event, because really I had no choice. I wanted the US team to medal. That being said, I started to gain an appreciation for her. I think she's starting to get too cocky in her interviews. Would like to see her continue to focus on the skating and backing it up with wins before she starts talking a big game like patty from Canada.

    She knows she's the shit (well from the US). I just hope it doesn't get to her head too quickly.

    As for Lipintiskaya, I think her body is going to go through some pretty major growing pains. Sotnikova, maybe she's already gone through most of them.

    As for the triple axel, here's Elizaveta Tuktamysheva

    This was from 2010. Not sure if she still has the jump. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdkDLBmBFBU

    She didn't fare too well at Russian Nationals this year http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pVUI71m4sw

    Other than that, I'm not aware of any other female attempting one other than Mao.

    Elizaveta's build is what I foresee in Julia's future. If that's the case, I think Gracie won't need to worry about her.
    Last edited by ronniev; 02-25-2014 at 05:35 AM. Reason: URLs added

  7. #67
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    Short answer: Politiks.

    Long answer: Gracie needs to develop her nuance and sophistication, artistically. I know using these words are frowned upon in describing skating during the IJS era, but she needs to skate more complex programs conceptually or choreographically, and relate to her music better. Right now, she's skating through the music.

  8. #68
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    There's something great about Gracie: She is coachable. She improved by leaps and bounds under the right direction in just one (long, fragmented, stormy) season. We all seem to be claiming for a finished product right away. Just give her and her team some time to develop (and get rid of the flashy lipstick ). She's already on the right track.

  9. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by canbelto View Post
    Get away from Lori Nichols? I know that sounds snide but Gracie needs choreography that builds upon her excellent technical skills. Her choreography now is a bit bland and ice princess-like. She needs choreography that showcases her huge jumps and fast spins in a more exciting way. Her technical scores, as has been pointed out, are already very high.
    I don't think that is going to happen. Frank and Lori have a strong relationship.

    I do think they need to start developing her musically. She needs a more musically diverse set of programs. But I don't think Frank Carroll is too keen on that. I don't recall any of his skaters using jazz, blues or rock music. I'd be willing to bit that Frank would allow her to skate to music with lyrics next season.
    "“My bronze feels like gold,” said the bronze medalist Carolina Kostner

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by topaz View Post
    But I don't think Frank Carroll is too keen on that. I don't recall any of his skaters using jazz, blues or rock music. I'd be willing to bit that Frank would allow her to skate to music with lyrics next season.
    ?? Under Frank, Michelle did competitive programs to Eric Clapton, the Beatles.
    And Miraculous Mandarin was classical but it was atonal and completely atypical from the music most skaters used

  11. #71
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    I'd like to see her try something with an eastern European flair..like "Two Guitars" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fgAMKdxGjQ

    This would actually been a perfect piece for the Sochi Olympics.

    It's the music Shannon Miller used for her 96 floor routine. Yes I know that's gymnastics, but it's pretty interesting music and I haven't heard any other skaters use it. A lot skaters go the Spanish, Tango, or Middle Eastern route for character pieces. Would be a nice change to hear/see something like this. The last skater I remember doing something similar was Christina Czako. Wonder whatever happened to her.

  12. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by ronniev View Post
    Elizaveta's build is what I foresee in Julia's future. If that's the case, I think Gracie won't need to worry about her.
    Not necessarily. there is plenty of skaters who were tiny and thin before puberty and remained that way even after. Sasha Cohen...

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceAlisa View Post
    Why this talk of the 3A?
    For me personally it's missing Mao Asada, and realizing she's really the only one in the past 15 (aside from Nakano/Nelidina) years who has always had one. Now skating has progressed so much technically.. I think Gracie out of the current crop has the technique most likely to have one. I'm expecting one of the Russian ladies to have it soon as well, it's basically the next step technically from what we've seen and Mao Asada has proven it can be done at any stage of development as a skater if the technique is there. This crop for the next 4 years is going to be insanely competitive, especially on the Russian side (but also US) and I can't imagine with it being an option to get ahead in the short program we won't see a lot more ladies start training it.

  14. #74
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    I think Gracie is a frontrunner for 2018. She has the technical goods, and would be even better if she could correct her flip edge. She's improving her artistry. Mao and Kim are retiring. None of the Russians has any chance in Pyeongchang. I think the Gracie and the US girls will be the contenders for 2018.

  15. #75
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    kar- I agree- I love mao for at least trying even if she risks falling-at least the girl tries- I am convinced by the next olys that both Russian and Japanese ladies will have the 3axel because they are progressive-the u.s will still be offering up frank carroll's safe little princes's

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    Quote Originally Posted by marialynn View Post
    kar- I agree- I love mao for at least trying even if she risks falling-at least the girl tries- I am convinced by the next olys that both Russian and Japanese ladies will have the 3axel because they are progressive-the u.s will still be offering up frank carroll's safe little princes's
    If Frank Carroll can qualify princes to go in the women's event, then he is a lot more progressive than you are giving him credit for.

    And seriously, if the 3A is going to be more important in the next Olympics, I think there would have been more than one lady at least trying it this time around.
    You should never write words with numbers. Unless you're seven. Or your name is Prince. - "Weird Al" Yankovic, "Word Crimes"

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by marialynn View Post
    kar- I agree- I love mao for at least trying even if she risks falling-at least the girl tries- I am convinced by the next olys that both Russian and Japanese ladies will have the 3axel because they are progressive-the u.s will still be offering up frank carroll's safe little princes's
    But the Russian ladies aren't even going to end up on the podium in 2018

  18. #78

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    I'd love to see more women try for the Triple Axel, but I think there's a real reason why it hasn't caught on as much despite it being the hot jump of the late 80s/early 90s and with two Olympic cycles of Mao Asada attempting them. Of course, it's not all physical, as the IJS is very responsible for rewarding correct jump technique, full rotations, height and distance, and maximizing your limited number of jumping passes. Skaters first need to get the jump technique down before they start putting forth a disproportionate amount of training time on getting the 3 Axel.

    Adelina didn't win OGM due to having a 3 Axel, she won due to the quality of her jumps and maximizing her points with combinations. Her spins also put her over the top. Having the 3 Axel hasn't helped Mao win any titles for the past 3 seasons.
    "Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility." - Ambrose Bierce

  19. #79

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    My concern about the 3A is that even Mao couldn't land the thing consistently, and it killed her gold medal chances at multiple competitions. If she'd had a coach who had made her take it out and work on improving other things instead, maybe she wouldn't have fluctuated between 1st and 6th place all the time. The 3A obviously meant a lot to her personally and she wanted to go big or go home, and I respect that. But Frank is the kind of coach who values consistency above pretty much all else, and I get the feeling he would never send Gracie out wit ha 3A unless she had a 95+% success rate. By the time Mao got to the Olympics, her landing rate was 50/50 if that. Some coaches may get inspired to pad their skater's technical arsenal, but I bet that a whole lot more will just get the heck away from risky jumps and work on making out other areas instead. Much, much, MUCH safer and reliable.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by marialynn View Post
    kar- I agree- I love mao for at least trying even if she risks falling-at least the girl tries- I am convinced by the next olys that both Russian and Japanese ladies will have the 3axel because they are progressive-the u.s will still be offering up frank carroll's safe little princes's
    But the Russian ladies aren't even going to end up on the podium in 2018 You are convinced about the Russian ladies' skills in 2018, just like Sasha Cohen ubers were convinced she was going to do quads in competition after 2002

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