Last edited by Ziggy; 01-31-2014 at 02:37 PM.
Didn't the "perjury" occur after hours of interrogation?
In the US, perjury is when you lie under oath, so in an affidavit or a deposition or when testifying in a trial.
Keeper of Nathalie Pechelat's bitchface.
long list of people who were exonerated after being falsely convicted, some of whom died in prison or not too long after being released, and I'm sure that's just the tip of the iceberg.
I don't know enough about this case to say anything about Knox's guilt or innocence, but I am inclined to be sympathetic first of all to Meredith Kercher's family. Still, if Knox is indeed innocent, it doesn't matter if she's a nice person or not - spending years in jail for something you didn't do sucks.
Also: Arizona's home page? Seriously, Vash?
The BBC article sums up the whole story quite well and in quite an objective manner as well:
You can feel free to replace 'perjury' with 'lying to the police' and 'changing her story' if you want, though. My point is that it didn't help her case and it didn't exactly make her look innocent.
Last edited by Ziggy; 01-31-2014 at 02:41 PM.
But the number of people who have been exonerated before they were executed is enough evidence to me that we shouldn't be executing. Those people were only NOT executed because of tireless work by others; how many people does that not happen for?
If Knox is innocence, I absolutely feel horrible for her. Feeling badly that someone's life has been ruined doesn't mean you don't also feel horribly for the girl who lost her life and her family who has had to deal with it. If Knox was not involved she should not be made to suffer just because Meredith's family needs closure. She has already served her time for lying.
In law school, I did a lot of work on innocent defendants and the whole "phenomenon" of how innocent people get convicted in the US. Many of them confessed after being subjected to duress, or were implicated by others who had been subjected to duress, or were implicated by solid witnesses who really believed they were the one that did it, when in fact they weren't.
So based on what I learned, I am not inclined to think someone who lies to the police during an intense interrogation or after an intense experience to be a person of bad character. It is nothing like a lie in the course of a normal day. Sometimes it's not even affirmative statements but repeating what the interrogator stated in hopes that would bring the process to an end. After what I've learned, I can't even view it as an indication of guilt. It's all very messy.
Keeper of Nathalie Pechelat's bitchface.
The initial conviction had to be vacated after the DNA evidence was proven to be unreliable. So the case went to the Court of Cassation, which has decided to send it back to trial. The trial ended with a guilty verdict. Knox and Solecito are lodging an appeal and the case is going to go to the Italian Supreme Court, which is the highest instance, and its verdict will be final.
Anthony Graves (also here) and it's clear that some people were convicted and sentenced to death on the flimsiest of evidence. But even if there weren't so many exonerations, I'd still be opposed to the death penalty.
One could also speculate that in every country, given an unlimited number of tries, a verdict could change. If the lawyers change, if the experts change, if the jury changes, if the judges change, and so on.
For most crimes there's statute of limitation, which doesn't stop once the trial has begun. This is why italian trials are designed to be so long: it's a get out of jail card, that everyone with enough money to stretch things along can buy. Berlusconi's justice troubles accentuated the issue, since he wrote laws meant for this exact purpuse.
There's no statute of limitation for murder though. So further appeals can always be asked for and granted. Only the Supreme Court can state a definitive sentence: validating, changing partially or totally the previous one; and the Supreme Court's job is only on merit and method (is the sentence legally sound? is it logically sound?), they cannot issue a trial of their own. If the Supreme Court feels like thay don't have enough to sentence they can order a further trial. In Knox case, the Supreme Court issued 14 points of the second degree trial sentence that they found not logically and legally sound, and that's what this last trial was about.
I'll briefly write about one of those: Amanda's first false declarations.
When the investigation still hadn't supsects or taken turns, Amanda said that Lumumba had killed Meredith, and that she was in the house and heard the whole thing, she described it in details that match what happened, and were later on confirmed by killer Guede.
The second degree trial disregarded entirely her declarations, perahps, they said, pressured out of Know.
Supreme Court noted that, although those declarations could be hold as substanl truth, they could not be disregarded either.
Because Amanda told them to the police; later on, when she was alone, she wrote them down in her own hand writing and gave the papers to the police; and again later, she repeated the same things to her mother, when the two of them thought they were having a private conversation. So pressure could be seriously questioned.
Also, she was sentenced guilty of defamation against Lumumba (definitive sentence) based on that declarations, which, evidently, were considered valid in that trial.
So, in short and not complete, this is one of the 14 issues the Supreme Court asked for more.
Last edited by loulou; 01-31-2014 at 04:10 PM.
I love how most Americans are experts on this case based on some CNN reports and an Interview on [insert tripe morning show].
I'm quite confident that the Italian courts can decipher the evidence ....It's regrettable that it took so long, but pleasing that mistakes can be acknowledged and rulings over turned accordingly.
Amanda Knox is now a proven murderer. . .
Last edited by poths; 01-31-2014 at 04:42 PM.
I really feel for Amanda and Rafaello. No one should be sentenced without clear evidence, ever. In this case, there are absolutely no clear evidence (if any) against Amanda and Rafaello. Guede was sentenced and his DNA was all over the murder scene with no trace of Amanda or Rafaello. The end. No sympathy for Kercher family anymore, their bitterness will not bring Meredith back. My heart goes completely out for these two young people who's lives have been ruined because of people feel need to reach some kind of sick atonement.
I have personally felt how it feels to have your family member to be drag trough courts for something they did not do. Years after years. This happens to innocent people all the time. Living in suspicion and shame and uncertainly really breaks you down mentally. It ruins more than one persons life: the whole family is torn apart. And only because people have need to have someone to blame. All those years made me a very sick person and I don't know if I can ever get better. I hope things turn out better for Knox and Sollecito family than they did for my family.