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  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe View Post
    Liza went from a tiny birdlike girl to a very muscular, compact woman with ample hips, no defined waist and short, sturdy legs. She struggles with adapting her skating technique to her new physical reality, and it can't be easy. It's no wonder she has one injury after another. What I find charming about her is that she keeps smiling even when her skating isn't going well, and she has such a lovely smile.

    I don't know what to make of Gachinski. It's as if he has no confidence at all. He goes out there and you can almost hear him thinking 'well, here goes nothing' and it's a self-defeating prophecy. I cannot remember the last time I have seen this guy smile.

    Her problem is physical and his is mental. I'm not sure a new coach can solve either problem, and leaving Russia would probably be an even worse disaster for both of them.
    This.

    Artur may need a sports psychologist. I don't know if he can ever recover mentally. I hope he does because he is so talented. I don't see how anyone can blame Mishin for his problems.

    Liza simply needs time to adjust to her new body. She is not the only compactly built skater. Slutskaya, Ito, Harding did not have lithe bodies and they used their power to their advantage, and Liza can do that, given enough time. It's just not going to happen this season. So everyone needs to be a little patient. Her jumps have power and she has a good jump techique. Mentally she is a fighter and does not give up on a program. Not every talented athlete has the mental toughness, so Liza could make it even in the highly competitive Russian fed.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by kosjenka View Post
    I love saying her name and if i were to move to Russia I would change my name to Elizaveta Tuktamysheva - Tuk for friends.
    It is a superb name

    Quote Originally Posted by kosjenka View Post
    Seeing her at post competition party - she has something crazy in her eyes. I wish to see that on the ice as well.
    And what do you mean by THIS?!

  3. #23
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    I think that there are two problems with Mishin.

    The first is that he thinks only jumps matter and he admits that. The result of that philosophy is Tuktamysheva and Gachinski really lacking in the PCS department, which gets reflected in their scores (and subjectively, their programs are simply terrible and I'd rather watch paint dry).

    The second is that from what I know, he's too focused on perfect jump technique. Whilst I would be the last person to advocate teaching bad jump technique which is not going to be sustainable in the long term (look under: very successful Junior skaters with no senior success) with this kind of 'all-or-nothing' approach, it might be hard to achieve consistency. Sometimes you need to cut skaters some slack and adapt so that you work out something which works for them, even if it isn't text-book.

  4. #24
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    They need a skating skills specialist to work with them on the regular basis, idk whom, but finding someone ain't impossible. This may happen if Mishin shifts his priorities just a little bit.
    And they need a good physician, maybe Raitsin. Well, he's in Moscow, but at least he could consult them.
    And the thing I totally don't understand, why not send Tuktamysheva to Gachinski's designer?

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe View Post
    I don't know what to make of Gachinski. It's as if he has no confidence at all. He goes out there and you can almost hear him thinking 'well, here goes nothing' and it's a self-defeating prophecy. I cannot remember the last time I have seen this guy smile.
    Arrrrgh. Sorry, but this gets me personal.
    He should not smile in his current programmes, they are serious and tragic.
    Off-ice he smiles enough. Anyway introvert people are just like this, do not smile much and that's normal. Not smiling all 32 teeth like in a toothpaste commercial doesn't mean one is terribly unhappy all the time.
    And Gachinski, although he was born in Moscow, is a true Petersburger, calm and reserved. Remember Menshov. Does he smile a lot?

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by navire View Post
    Arrrrgh. Sorry, but this gets me personal.
    He should not smile in his current programmes, they are serious and tragic.
    I was not referring to smiling during his programs, but afterward. I don't ever remember seeing a smile on his face. And yes, I can recall Menshov smiling and looking really happy, but I can't picture a happy Gachinski. It is sad to see such a young person looking so gloomy all the time.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by navire View Post
    Arrrrgh. Sorry, but this gets me personal.
    He should not smile in his current programmes, they are serious and tragic.
    Maybe this is the problem. I know skating to fun musics can help getting consistency. Maybe he needs a music with joy and energy, instead of serious and tragic themes.

  8. #28

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    Does Mishin pick music for his skaters or they have some say in it? When a skater loves the music, usually it helps the skating (big exception: Elena-Anton; they sometimes hated the music they skated to- Tamara picked it for them-, but skated beautifully).

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe View Post
    I was not referring to smiling during his programs, but afterward. I don't ever remember seeing a smile on his face. And yes, I can recall Menshov smiling and looking really happy, but I can't picture a happy Gachinski. It is sad to see such a young person looking so gloomy all the time.
    He has no reason to look happy after skating badly. If he cringes, that means he cares.
    Previous season was awful, right, but now he looks mentally better. He jokingly apologized to the public after the FS in Moscow. And gave a funny interview to the official site.

    Quote Originally Posted by briancoogaert View Post
    Maybe this is the problem. I know skating to fun musics can help getting consistency. Maybe he needs a music with joy and energy, instead of serious and tragic themes.
    Once he had a cheerful FS. It was so funny and crazy one can burst into laughter just seeing the photos. And he won his Worlds bronze with it. But everybody said the choreo was idiotic. Well OK, no more idiotic choreos...

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe View Post
    I was not referring to smiling during his programs, but afterward. I don't ever remember seeing a smile on his face. And yes, I can recall Menshov smiling and looking really happy, but I can't picture a happy Gachinski. It is sad to see such a young person looking so gloomy all the time.
    I haven't seen Artur smile at a competition since Euros 2012, and even then he wasn't smiling much. I don't think I've seen him smile at all after that - you can probably thank the Russian Fed for that. He does smile in his instagram photos.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    Does Mishin pick music for his skaters or they have some say in it? When a skater loves the music, usually it helps the skating (big exception: Elena-Anton; they sometimes hated the music they skated to- Tamara picked it for them-, but skated beautifully).
    IIRC it was Artur who chose the Anna Karenina music. He loved it and had to persuade Mishin to let him do it, which Mishin duly did. Yuri Smekalov (sp?) is the choreographer.

    Quote Originally Posted by navire View Post
    Once he had a cheerful FS. It was so funny and crazy one can burst into laughter just seeing the photos. And he won his Worlds bronze with it. But everybody said the choreo was idiotic. Well OK, no more idiotic choreos...
    The Bolt is still my favourite LP of his. My favourite SP is his St Louis Blues one - that was also fun and lighthearted, and he skated it well.

  11. #31
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    I watched Liza's and Artur's performances at the Russian Nationals. From a Russian Champion Liza went down to 10th place. Her PCS scores are way lower than the top ladies. Yes, she made mistakes on some jumps, but the low PCS scores indicate that the programs that she skates to are not what the judges and the specialists want. She can do much better, but I think she is stuck in Mishin's world of tasteless programs and non-existing choreography. And Artur does not show any signs of enjoyment. I really hope they leave Mishin. Their technic is fine, they need fresh packaging and someone that will help them get their confidence back. Their season is over, and it was their worst ever. Very sad.

  12. #32

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    I admire Mishin as a coach but he has really failed Tuktamysheva this year. The fact she has reverted to her Adios Nonino SP two consecutive years is unforgivable.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by alchemy void View Post
    I admire Mishin as a coach but he has really failed Tuktamysheva this year. The fact she has reverted to her Adios Nonino SP two consecutive years is unforgivable.
    Yes, that is a huge red flag for me. A good coach should be pushing her outside her comfort zone and teaching her to interpret many different styles. So many years of that terrible Adios Nonino program tells me that either he doesn't care about her, he doesn't care about her programs as long as she gets the jumps in, or that he has no idea what to do with her. That is not an Olympic calibre program by any stretch of the imagination.

  14. #34
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    Veretennikova says she adviced Liza to change her SP, when they met at Golden Spin of Zagreb this December (she's coaching abroad now), and eventually Liza followed her advice.
    http://itar-tass.com/sport/863270 (in Russian)

  15. #35
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    Maybe both Tuktamysheva and Gachinski would feel happier with some other coach, but they still should work really hard. Gachinski has a good freeskate programme, and he is able to interpret it well. They both need a coach who can get them more confident.

  16. #36

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    I'm sure Mishin has a team of people to help choreograph and package skaters to emphasize non-jump elements, but he really needs a Marina Zueva type of person on his team to work magic (without the history of kicking the tech. coach out and taking over their students fully).
    "Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility." - Ambrose Bierce

  17. #37
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    It breaks my heart to see Artur in this position. He has a certain "dark" aura that looks perfect for more dramatic music like "Interview with a Vampire" that he used in 2011/2012. I find his FS this season to be beautiful.
    Gachinski certainly knows how to jump and is capable of being artistic. At this point I think that moving to Tarasova's radar of influence could be beneficial to him...

  18. #38

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    I can't help but remember back a few seasons ago when Tuk turned senior and I think her first Grand Prix was Skate Canada. I thought Rod Black was going to have an orgasm over her and he went on and on about her future and her domination for years to come. Puberty can be cruel and so untimely! I certainly don't know enough about her current situation to give advice, but she has a special something and I hope she is able to reach her potential. Plus, I love her name too.
    pug lover

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by puglover View Post
    I can't help but remember back a few seasons ago when Tuk turned senior and I think her first Grand Prix was Skate Canada. I thought Rod Black was going to have an orgasm over her and he went on and on about her future and her domination for years to come. Puberty can be cruel and so untimely! I certainly don't know enough about her current situation to give advice, but she has a special something and I hope she is able to reach her potential. Plus, I love her name too.
    The other sad thing for her is even if she had skated 2 perfect performances at Nationals, the way Lipnitskaya and Sotnikova skated, she probably would have finished only 3rd and still not made the team. She would have made the European team, but based on the seasons of Lipnitskaya and Sotnikova, unless Tuktamysheva had beaten one of them at both Nationals and Europeans, she was not going to make it. I guess she would have had to either skate alot better all season or skate better at last years Worlds and finish with the bronze medal to reach the magic 13, to even have a chance at the team.

  20. #40
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    I really feel for Liza. A few seasons ago, many foresaw her being on the podium at Sochi. Cometh the hour and she isn't even an alternate for Euros. It must hurt

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