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  1. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by smarts1 View Post
    I might get flamed for this because there are some Michelle ubers on these boards, but Ashley is similar to Michelle. Jump and spin wise, nothing will blow your socks off (except Ashley's loop), but they're consistent and play the game well. I think Ashley will defend her National title again this year. The judges will give her a big PCS margin and none of the other girls will chase that.
    Uber here to make a comment LOL.

    Ashley is similar to Michelle I think in her determination to want to win-you can tell the difference between 2010 and prior, to after 2010. Ashley has a fire in her. I admire her for the changes she has made in the last 4 years. She has been determined to be the US #1. In that respect, I agree that she is similar to Michelle-especially now by putting it all out there when she skates. She wants to win, wants to be the best, and she is letting everyone know. IMO she is the only lock for a spot on the Olympic Team and it is due to nothing other than her hard work the past 4 years. She really grew as a competitor. She stepped it up from being a second tier skater to a podium contender. We have not had that since Michelle and Sasha.

    But IMO her actual skating is nothing similar to Michelle.

    I think Ashley has a great shot at broze at the olympics where as bronze (and silver) was seen as a failure for Michelle. For Ashley, it would be a success. Kind of the same as Joannie.

    .
    Last edited by UGG; 12-08-2013 at 03:45 AM.

  2. #282

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    Best international technical score (TES) for last two seasons - 2013/14 season TES is bolded

    Short program:
    38.53 Gold (GP Skate Canada 2013)
    37.77 Chen (JGP Kosice 2013)
    - JR in U.S.
    36.39 Wagner (Grand Prix Final 2013/14)
    35.89 Wang (JGP Czech Skate 2013)

    35.44 Zawadzki ((U.S. Int. FS Classic 2012)
    33.96 Gao (GP Skate Canada 2013)
    33.84 Miller (Junior Grand Prix Final 2012/13)
    33.64 Glenn (JGP Czech Skate 2013) - JR in U.S.
    33.35 Edmunds (JGP Mexico Cup 2013)
    32.45 Nagasu (GP Rostelecom Cup 2013)
    32.36 Zawadzki (GP Rostelecom Cup 2013)

    31.97 Keiser (JGP Bosphorus 2012)
    31.80 Hicks (U.S. Int. FS Classic 2013)
    31.30 Cain (Nebelhorn Trophy 2013)

    31.12 Cesario (JGP Austria 2012)
    31.11 Baga (Cup of Nice 2013)
    30.59 Lam (Finlandia Trophy 2013)
    30.52 Cesario (GP Trophee Bompard 2013)

    30.38 Long (JGP Sencila Bled Cup 2012)
    28.90 Siraj (JGP Riga Cup 2013)
    27.67 Zhang (GP Skate Canada 2012)
    26.55 Bell (JGP Mexico Cup 2013)
    24.64 Pierce (JGP Tallinn Cup 2013)
    - JR in U.S.
    20.93 Flatt (GP Skate America 2012)

    Free skate:
    65.28 Gold (World Team Trophy 2013)
    63.83 Wagner (GP Skate America 2012)
    62.95 Edmunds (Junior Grand Prix Final 2013/14)
    62.31 Hicks (GP Skate Canada 2013)
    62.28 Chen (JGP Kosice 2013)
    - JR in U.S.
    61.81 Wagner (GP Trophee Bompard 2013)
    60.64 Gao (GP Skate America 2012)
    59.03 Cesario (GP Trophee Bompard 2013)
    58.90 Wang (Junior Grand Prix Final 2012/13)
    58.36 Glenn (JGP Czech Skate 2013) - JR in U.S.
    58.04 Keiser (JGP Bosphorus 2012)
    57.95 Nagasu (GP Rostelecom Cup 2013)
    56.16 Miller (Junior Grand Prix Final 2012/13)
    56.09 Gold (GP Skate Canada 2013)
    53.95 Gao (GP Skate Canada 2013)
    53.54 Long (JGP Kosice 2013)
    52.95 Bell (JGP Mexico Cup 2013)

    51.61 Zawadzki (GP NHK Trophy 2012)
    51.51 Cain (Nebelhorn Trophy 2013)
    50.09 Pierce (JGP Tallinn Cup 2013)
    - JR in U.S.
    49.25 Wang (JGP Baltic Cup 2013)
    49.15 Siraj (World Junior Championships 2013)
    48.65 Lam (JGP Courchevel 2012)
    48.57 Zhang (GP Rostelecom Cup 2012)
    47.44 Flatt (GP Skate America 2012)
    47.16 Zawadzki (GP Rostelecom Cup 2013)
    46.71 Baga (JGP Lake Placid 2012)

    Senior Ladies at 2014 Nationals without a current international score:
    Franchesca Chiera and Joelle Forte

    Reference thread in GSD: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...revious-season
    Last edited by Sylvia; 12-09-2013 at 10:48 PM. Reason: To add TES high scores for Wagner, Gold, Gao, Zawadzki, Cesario, Wang from this season
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  3. #283

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    Quote Originally Posted by smarts1 View Post
    I meant technically, not artistically. Jumping wise and spin wise the two don't stand out much and just do the two good enough, but they're nothing spectacular.
    Michelle belonged to the 6.0 era. Very few were doing strange spin positions in those days. There was no reason for her to spend time on that. Her jumps were not in the Irina/Midori/Tonya class, but they were not tiny like Tara's either. She used correct technique and her jump consistency was her biggest strength under the 6.0 system.

    Michelle was much more consistent, and she had a natural talent which you could see even when she was just 12 or 13 years old. Ashley has worked hard and I commend her for that. She has come a long way but she does not hold a candle to Michelle's ability to deliver under pressure. Also her basic skating skills are nowhere near Michelle's. I admire her persistence and I hope she will do well at the nationals and in Sochi.

    I would also add (although this would fall under the artistic category) that Michelle's musical interpretation was among the very best. Ashley does well interpreting certain kinds of music, but she is not lyrical like Michelle.

  4. #284
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    I would also add that Michelle's landings both edge and posture (straight up and down) were some of the finest ever. I never even knew how well landings could be done until I saw Michelle's landings at '98 Nationals. This isn't often mentioned about Michelle's skating and it should be.

  5. #285

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    Polina Edmunds has an official website now: http://figureskatersonline.com/polinaedmunds/
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  6. #286
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    I can't help but be a bit frustrated at how things turn out for promising skaters like Edmunds. They spend like a year waiting in line for assignments. Had she gotten an assignment or two last year, she could very well have been in a stronger position for Sochi.
    The practice of treating jgp as senior Bs among US ladies is really keeping young promising jrs from competing for experience at a less pressure situation. If Edmunds does place at nationals, she will jump from jgps to Olympics, too big a jump, IMHO.

  7. #287
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlai View Post
    I can't help but be a bit frustrated at how things turn out for promising skaters like Edmunds. They spend like a year waiting in line for assignments. Had she gotten an assignment or two last year, she could very well have been in a stronger position for Sochi.
    The practice of treating jgp as senior Bs among US ladies is really keeping young promising jrs from competing for experience at a less pressure situation. If Edmunds does place at nationals, she will jump from jgps to Olympics, too big a jump, IMHO.
    Yes she will be at a significant disadvantage as she will be the only lady who did not have a chance to get rep points or refine her senior programs on the Grand Prix (besides Yuna but Yuna at least has senior experience and was at senior events this year; Yuna also has rep). I doubt USFS will send someone starting out with such a disadvantage. USFS should do what russia does and get our ladies out on Grand Prix as soon as they are age eligible,

  8. #288
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    It pains me to hear Polina Edmunds in the same sentence as Sochi. She is Junior through and through, and at this point has no merits at the Senior level apart from triple jumps and triple-triples, which are gangly and not attractive like some of those from her senior counterparts. She is perhaps the most gangly skater in US ladies skating, Junior and Senior.

    Give the girl some time, sheesh. She could hopefully be quite good in 2-3 years minimum, but right now she belongs on the JGP.

  9. #289
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbd1235 View Post
    It pains me to hear Polina Edmunds in the same sentence as Sochi. She is Junior through and through, and at this point has no merits at the Senior level apart from triple jumps and triple-triples, which are gangly and not attractive like some of those from her senior counterparts. She is perhaps the most gangly skater in US ladies skating, Junior and Senior.

    Give the girl some time, sheesh. She could hopefully be quite good in 2-3 years minimum, but right now she belongs on the JGP.
    I agree, I don't know why so many people seem so behind Polina for Sochi. USFS would be doing something it has never done before for the Olympics. I don't think they would be so irresponsible so as to have a junior make their intl debut on the senior level at the Olympics. We cannot compare her junior scores- made in shorter times under different pressure situations and different competitions- with the ladies now on the Senior Circuit. Many times - sadly maybe even most times - ladies who do well on the Junior Circuit often do not do well on the Senior Circuit.

  10. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbd1235 View Post
    It pains me to hear Polina Edmunds in the same sentence as Sochi. She is Junior through and through, and at this point has no merits at the Senior level apart from triple jumps and triple-triples, which are gangly and not attractive like some of those from her senior counterparts. She is perhaps the most gangly skater in US ladies skating, Junior and Senior.

    Give the girl some time, sheesh. She could hopefully be quite good in 2-3 years minimum, but right now she belongs on the JGP.
    Gangly, but overall still much more pleasant to watch than Hicks. I am hoping her jumps don't go down the drain the way Meissner's did. She doesn't have the best technique and quality to her jumps and they always look URed and lack flow on landing, and I almost feel like she is a minor growth spurt away from losing it all. I keep wondering how she was able to get away with it for the whole season. Perhaps callers at the junior level were less strict.

    But since she didn't even get to skate in a GP or senior Bs the way Hicks did, I agree she is most probably not in USFS' list for Sochi at all. I can see her making 4CCs if she has a great Nationals but I think the primary plan is to have her and Karen Chen go to Jr Worlds.

    A likely scenario is this:

    Olympics / Worlds: Wagner, Gold, Nagasu or Gao or Cesario

    4CCs: 2 of Nagasu, Gao or Cesario, Hicks

    Jr Worlds: Edmunds, Chen, Wang or Miller?

  11. #291

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    Wow, sounds like some people are worried that Edmunds might earn an Olympic spot.

    There are at least 10 ladies I'd be proud to have represent us at the Olympics. All the ones Marco mentioned for sure, including Wang or Miller, who iirc don't have senior experience either. It's unlikely that even our number one lady (Go, Ashley!) will medal, so letting them all skate it out at Nationals is the best policy.

    Send the best three at the end of the night, and I'll be exceedingly happy for whoever they are.

    I'm just hoping they all skate like they want it and it's not a nerve-ridden splatfest!

  12. #292
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    Not sure if you are talking about me, but at least for me I am not worried.

    Besides Wagner and Gold, Nagasu, Gao, Cesario and Hicks have all skated strongly at least once this season. Nagasu and Gao in particular have had experience at ISU Championships, Nagasu also medalled at a GP and is probably the most well known of all 4 skaters. Cesario has been the most consistent so far this season and Hicks has actually won events this season. As much as I dislike Hicks' skating, I have to regard these 4 as the frontrunners for the 3rd spot.

    And obviously the one who didn't make Sochi will make 4CCs. So unless one of these 4 bombed pretty badly at Nationals (and it's possible), Edmunds can sneak in for a 4CCs spot if she skates well enough. To get an Olympic spot however, she will have to have all 4 tanking and then skate rather solidly herself, which isn't that likely.

    It seems fair on one level to have the skaters with the best results on the night make the team, but I also think consistency across the season should be taken into consideration, so that you don't get people peaking only at Nationals and then tanking everything else afterwards (the break-throughs of Mroz, Dornbush, Miner at Nationals come to mind).

  13. #293

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    Nope, not talking about you--I agree with almost everything you said.

    I like the *idea* of consistency playing a role in team selection, but I also like that skaters get to compete head-to-head at Nationals with the same judges at the same point in the season.

    I also think in general that you have to give the break-out skaters a chance. I don't think Mroz and Dornbush and Miner all tanked at their first worlds, and I did think they deserved their assignments, even if none of them did as well as they hoped over the next few years.

    Really, I just hope that how they skate on the night is rewarded.

  14. #294
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    I didnt say I am for Edmunds for Sochi, merely that USFS is slow to get jr skaters their jgp assignments so skaters end up taking more time toget ready for big assignments or going from nobody to being a big star like Gracie.

    Quote Originally Posted by cbd1235 View Post
    It pains me to hear Polina Edmunds in the same sentence as Sochi. She is Junior through and through, and at this point has no merits at the Senior level apart from triple jumps and triple-triples, which are gangly and not attractive like some of those from her senior counterparts. She is perhaps the most gangly skater in US ladies skating, Junior and Senior.

    Give the girl some time, sheesh. She could hopefully be quite good in 2-3 years minimum, but right now she belongs on the JGP.

  15. #295
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    I could see Polina sneaking into the top 5 at nationals this year with two good performances but I'm very doubtful she or any of the other junior level skaters will be awarded that 3rd spot unless there are a number of epic implosions this year. Mirai, Samantha, Agnes, Christina and Courtney are shortlisted for that 3rd spot...I'd truly be shocked if the spot went to someone other than one of these ladies.

  16. #296
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    I think there are too many girl ahead of Polina to score a top 5 finish. Maybe top 10.

    She is going to junior worlds. She competed very well with the Russian juniors. Like someone said earlier that was the plan. It should be Polina and Karen. Maybe add the new skater Chasandra Chiera. She posted some good score. Also Chiera is in desperate need of ISU points. Otherwise we may not see her on the senior Grand Prix until she is 25.

  17. #297
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    Chiera cant go to jr worlds because she doesnt have a qualifying score. Knowing USFS my guess is she would end up doing jgp next season no matter what happens in Boston

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    Oh darn, I did not know that. Like I said 25 by the time she gets to senior GP. USFSA needs to make some changes. We seem to do everything backwards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jlai View Post
    Chiera cant go to jr worlds because she doesnt have a qualifying score. Knowing USFS my guess is she would end up doing jgp next season no matter what happens in Boston
    I'm sure Franchesca Chiera would be thrilled to be on the JGP next fall.

    Amber Glenn scored really well in her JGP debut this fall; she would be a worthy competitor at Junior Worlds if she can win the Junior ladies title convincingly. (Yes, it will also depend on how the Senior ladies perform/score at Nationals.)
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Not sure if you are talking about me, but at least for me I am not worried.

    Besides Wagner and Gold, Nagasu, Gao, Cesario and Hicks have all skated strongly at least once this season. Nagasu and Gao in particular have had experience at ISU Championships, Nagasu also medalled at a GP and is probably the most well known of all 4 skaters. Cesario has been the most consistent so far this season and Hicks has actually won events this season. As much as I dislike Hicks' skating, I have to regard these 4 as the frontrunners for the 3rd spot.

    And obviously the one who didn't make Sochi will make 4CCs. So unless one of these 4 bombed pretty badly at Nationals (and it's possible), Edmunds can sneak in for a 4CCs spot if she skates well enough. To get an Olympic spot however, she will have to have all 4 tanking and then skate rather solidly herself, which isn't that likely.

    It seems fair on one level to have the skaters with the best results on the night make the team, but I also think consistency across the season should be taken into consideration, so that you don't get people peaking only at Nationals and then tanking everything else afterwards (the break-throughs of Mroz, Dornbush, Miner at Nationals come to mind).
    Even if Polina places between number 4-6 at Nationals, she's going to Junior Worlds, NOT to 4CCs.

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