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  1. #21
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    I haven't heard of anything like this happening before. Is Masters a required competition for French skaters? When a federation is unhappy with a skater for doing something wrong, don't they usually just fine them monetarily (i.e. Rachael Flatt for going to Worlds injured)? This hurts the FFSG's image and the French team in the long run by depriving Brian of an opportunity to compete his programs in front on international judges during the Olympic season.

    Also, if they were considering this since the Masters competition, couldn't they have withdrawn him earlier so that Skate America organizers could line up an alternate with more advance notice?

  2. #22

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    I think if the reason Joubert cited for not attending this competition was inadequate preparation, then the French fed had every right to say, "Well, if you're not adequately prepared TWO WEEKS before Skate America, you're not going". However it would have been nice if they'd said something earlier. Can the alternate get there in time?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by marysy View Post
    I haven't heard of anything like this happening before. Is Masters a required competition for French skaters? When a federation is unhappy with a skater for doing something wrong, don't they usually just fine them monetarily (i.e. Rachael Flatt for going to Worlds injured)? This hurts the FFSG's image and the French team in the long run by depriving Brian of an opportunity to compete his programs in front on international judges during the Olympic season.

    Also, if they were considering this since the Masters competition, couldn't they have withdrawn him earlier so that Skate America organizers could line up an alternate with more advance notice?
    No. Not always, even if there was an explicit rule about competing in the Masters, and if there was an explicit rule, then Joubert wouldn't have been surprised that he was withdrawn. (Flatt violated a USFS rule outright.) Maybe, not the Gailhauget would agree, or if he did, that he would care. Possibly: 5 October was not 14+ days before the SA Team Leaders Meeting on Thursday, 17 October, during which time a replacement is allegedly mandatory, and the GP Announcement says nothing about replacements for withdrawals between 7 and 14 days before the Team Leaders Meeting, which, for SA, would have been 4-9 October. The SA organizers might have been happy about the later withdrawal, because it costs less $$ if they don't have to replace him.

    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    Can the alternate get there in time?
    USFS could get an alternative to Detroit logistically, a major US airline hub, by Wednesday, but since the WD was within 7 days of the Team Leaders Meeting this Thursday, the ISU will likely say they don't have to. (This is in the GP Announcement.) Majorov is already there, I don't know what the visa issues would be for the two Russian skaters in the Top Five -- I think not enough time to process one starting now, and there's nothing explicit that says that alternates have to start the visa process rolling in advance -- but Rogozine could get to Detroit easily and cheaply from Toronto with no visa issues, if that makes sense for his training plan, and since he's at SC the following week, he or Skate Canada on his behalf could decline because of back-to-back events.
    Last edited by kwanfan1818; 10-14-2013 at 11:24 PM.
    "'Is this new BMW-designed sled the ultimate sledding machine for Langdon and Holcomb?' Leigh Diffey asked before the pair cruised to victory. I don’t know, but I know that sled is the ultimate Olympic Games product placement.." -- Jen Chaney

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    I think if the reason Joubert cited for not attending this competition was inadequate preparation, then the French fed had every right to say, "Well, if you're not adequately prepared TWO WEEKS before Skate America, you're not going". However it would have been nice if they'd said something earlier. Can the alternate get there in time?
    Put that way it makes more sense, the article gives it a completely different tone however and I do wonder if that just came from the journalist or if it was planted that way on purpose. I'm sorry, my brain sees conspiracies easily at 11 pm, don't mind me.

  5. #25
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    If ever a "Death in my soul" emoticon was needed, it would be now.
    To think that fun is simple fun, while earnest things are earnest, proves all too plain that neither one thou truthfully discernest.

  6. #26
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    I jumped at the chance to buy tickets for this event because Joubert and Takahashi were on the list. The fact that Joubert isn't going and it's not his idea makes me absolutely livid. If anyone ever wonders what happened to figure skating in the United States, it's stuff like this. Federations out of control deciding the athletes fate instead of letting them decide on the ice.

    I will only ever go to a figure skating event again if it's extremely convenient and cheap.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Made4Dancin View Post
    I jumped at the chance to buy tickets for this event because Joubert and Takahashi were on the list. The fact that Joubert isn't going and it's not his idea makes me absolutely livid. If anyone ever wonders what happened to figure skating in the United States, it's stuff like this. Federations out of control deciding the athletes fate instead of letting them decide on the ice.

    I will only ever go to a figure skating event again if it's extremely convenient and cheap.
    I'm confused. Please explain what I bolded.

  8. #28
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    Like Zemgirl, I'm startled at how this whole thing played out. I'm going to presume there's more to the story than just simple punishment, but I'm rather afraid there isn't.

  9. #29
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    Wow... Gailhaguet really needs to be guillotined asap. This madness has to stop!

  10. #30
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    Noooooooo! My 1st chance to see a comp in years & years, and he & Takahashi were among the biggest draws. (Wait, Daisuke is still scheduled, right?)

  11. #31
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    @kwanette

    What happened to figure skating in the US is the blatant cheating and behind the scenes shenanigans. Americans as bad as we're supposed to be want our sports to be fair. When you follow a sport that seems corrupt at every turn and then an athlete isn't allowed to compete in a competition for spiteful reasons, it's beyond not fair. This is an international sport so people can be fans of anyone from anywhere. We see what happens to them. If Brian Joubert or any other athlete is to compete in an American competition and is not allowed to go, after we spent our money on it, and the American organizers can't or won't do anything about it then it means we should reconsider ever buying tickets from the organization again. I don't want to support corruption with my money. I've been dumb enough to do it this long, but no more.

  12. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    If ever a "Death in my soul" emoticon was needed, it would be now.
    YES.

    This bites. And I'm not even a fan, really, but the guy is frickin' legendary and I wanted to see him skate!
    BARK LESS. WAG MORE.

  13. #33
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    You buy a ticket for a competition and not for seeing specific skaters, because there is about a million reasons for why certain skaters might not be able to compete.

    American organisers won't do anything about it because how the French federation governs itself is not within their jurisdiction.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Made4Dancin View Post
    I've been dumb enough to do it this long, but no more.
    And you're NEVER coming back right?
    To think that fun is simple fun, while earnest things are earnest, proves all too plain that neither one thou truthfully discernest.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Made4Dancin View Post
    What happened to figure skating in the US is the blatant cheating and behind the scenes shenanigans. Americans as bad as we're supposed to be want our sports to be fair. When you follow a sport that seems corrupt at every turn and then an athlete isn't allowed to compete in a competition for spiteful reasons, it's beyond not fair. This is an international sport so people can be fans of anyone from anywhere. We see what happens to them. If Brian Joubert or any other athlete is to compete in an American competition and is not allowed to go, after we spent our money on it, and the American organizers can't or won't do anything about it then it means we should reconsider ever buying tickets from the organization again. I don't want to support corruption with my money. I've been dumb enough to do it this long, but no more.
    A rather baffling, nonsensical rant. Exactly what do you expect the American organizers to do about this? Send in the US Air Force to kidnap Joubert in France and spirit him back to Skate America to compete? Drop a bomb on Galhaiguet? (Come to think of it, those aren't half bad ideas.... Or do you just want your ticket money refunded? Anybody who buys a ticket to a skating competition anywhere knows that there are always potential last minute circumstances that cause a skater to withdraw, and nothing is guaranteed. It's just the reasons for this withdrawal seem to be cruel, nasty, and punitive, at least from the public press we've seen so far. If he was pulled for lack of readiness, it should have been done a couple of weeks ago. I think the USFS would much rather have a full complement of 10 men rather than an absentee place, so I don't see any skullduggery going on there and have to assume they'd rather have had time to fill Joubert's place. I find it hard to believe they were notified in time per ISU rules and chose to "sit on" naming a replacement.
    Last edited by jiejie; 10-15-2013 at 01:32 AM.

  16. #36

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    If he wasn't ready for a little tiny comp TWO WEEKS AGO, what on earth would make him think he would be ready for a Grand Prix event this week?

    Think about it. Almost every single one of his competitors at SkAm we've seen at least once competing this season (and some twice). Have we seen Joubert yet? No. Did his fans really want to see him come to SkAm and be underdone?

  17. #37
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    Honestly, I don't think what I wrote is that difficult to understand. Americans want a fair sport. Casual fans aren't going to pay for something that doesn't seem fair. That's why this sport continues to lose money in this country and is relegated to 2 hours of coverage on major networks. No one seems to think what happened to Joubert is fair.

    How is that confusing?

  18. #38

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    Maybe he didn't go to the little tiny comp two weeks ago because it was exactly that - a little tiny comp? And maybe he wanted to save his energy for the big comp this week? And now it appears the heavy hand of punishment has come down. Unfortunately, everyone gets punished - the skater, and the fans who were looking forward to seeing him skate. Folks are disappointed, as would be expected. There's not really anything that anyone can do about it, though.

  19. #39
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    In case anyone else was wondering, the rather draconian rules limiting GP withdrawals apply only to seeded skaters (top 6 from Worlds + comeback skaters). Since Joubert placed 9th at Worlds, he is an "invited skater" not a seeded skater, so apparently he can withdraw for any reason. He is not allowed a replacement event.

    The Organizer (in this case USFS) is required to invite an alternate if the withdrawal happens more than 7 days before the event. When it is less than 7 days, they fill it if the logistics can get worked out. Anyone know who are presently the top 5 on the alternates list for men? (There was a GP alternates thread here last season, but I could not find one for this year.)

  20. #40
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    I almost hope that it is Joubert himself who wants to withdraw from SA and the report of "punishment" is incorrect. If it were true, the French Federation is even more screwed up than I thought possible. Hmm... If the federation really is this screwed up, I feel bad for the current crop of French skaters. It's bad enough to belong to a small federation and get very little support, but to be stabbed in the back by your own federation ...

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