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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciocio View Post
    There are a lot of hilarious pieces of fluff on Youtube about their rivalry. I think Plushenko still likes the Soviet villain image, talking about his "enemies". I'm dreaming about a Bond show on ice with Joubert as 007, Yuna as Bondgirl and Plushy starring the Soviet villain, it would be AMAZING!
    It is known that Yagudin and Piseev's relationship wasn't great and probably that's why Russian judges seem to favor Plushenko but a lot of people also think that Yagudin did not have support from his Federation in international competitions which is . Not even Piseev was that crazy. We've seen what happened to Plushenko after Vancouver when he criticized Piseev -he lost his eligibility- but then the Federation realized they need him, they made peace and everybody was happy.
    Sorry, how many seconds they showed that Russian guy that dagmaged Plushenko's reputation in western society? I think I've seen that video, if you didn't keep reminding everyone, I don't think lots of people even noticed that. The media always wants drama, when Brian Orser and Brian Boitano competed, there were tons of drama about the Battle of the Brians. There's a comment on Youtube says: "US ****er judge gave 5.7???". That's about Yagudin's Olympic sp performance, he received the lowest mark and the only 5.7 from the US judge. Actually Yagudin's wild bad boyish personality is contradict to NA value, he was constantly criticized for his careless behavior at the time.

    The politics, I think it's not just about who they like, I have a feeling the RF don't really care about athlets, that's why when Plushenko showed a little bit attitude in 2010, they dinged him without any reluctant. But the people from his team helped him to repair the relationship with RF. Politics is also about those power that be behind those athletes. RF has a long history of competition between St. Petersburg and Moscow. Yagudin left Mishin and went for Tarasova, made his case more complicated than Kulik. Tarasova and Kulik's former coach had a good relationship, and they both from Moscow. Yagudin's from St. Petersburg and went to a coach from Moscow, Tarasova and Mishin weren't that friendly towards each other at the time. All those things made Yagudin a traitor and lost the support from St. Petersburg. Yagudin was a bad Russian boy in NA and a traitor from Russia combined, no body beat him on that matter.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    Oh, So what, Yagudin beat some elite skaters when he was 13, he beat fresh Olympic champion Urmanov when he was 15, at 17 too, all at international competitions. There are tons of other exmples of younger skaters beat elder competitors. Plushenko beat Yagudin in 2001 when Yagudin was already a 3 time world champion and wasn't as eagerly craving for the titles as Plushenko .
    How many world titles did Yagudin win when he was 13, 15, 16, 17? None. Exactly as many as Plushenko.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by theshrew View Post
    How many world titles did Yagudin win when he was 13, 15, 16, 17? None. Exactly as many as Plushenko.
    I agree with what you said, but your logic is interesting

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    I agree with what you said, but your logic is interesting
    I think, that is very logical
    Yagudin's first world champion title, 1998 he was 18- Plushenko was 15, (he won bronze)
    Yagudin's second world champion title, 1999-Plushenko was 16, (he won silver)
    Yag's third w champ title 2000-Plu was 17( he was 4th, that was the one time when he was out of the podium, but he was first at ECH)
    Plushenko's first w champ, 2001 he was 18- Yagudin was second...

    Would you have expected from the kid Plush to defeat one of the best skaters ever???? That isn't too much glory overcome a 15, 16, 17-year old kid .... or was it a great glory, great deed? Well, that is praises of the vanquished, not of the winner.

    Not to mention he beat Yagudin at 16, 17...
    Last edited by lala; 09-24-2013 at 06:59 PM.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by lala View Post
    I think, that is very logical
    Yagudin's first world champion title, 1998 he was 18- Plushenko was 15, (he won bronze)
    Yagudin's second world champion title, 1999-Plushenko was 16, (he won silver)
    Yag's third w champ title 2000-Plu was 17( he was 4th, that was the one time when he was out off the podium, but he was first at ECH)
    Plushenko's first w champ, 2001 he was 18- Yagudin was second...

    Would you have expected from the kid Plush to defeat one of the best skaters ever???? That isn't too much glory overcome a 15, 16, 17-year old kid .... or was it a great glory, great deed? Well, that is praises of the vanquished, not of the winner.

    Not to mention he beat Yagudin at 16, 17...
    Yagudin's performances at 1995 centennial and at 95 RN when he was 15, could beat himself at 1998 worlds, so 15 year old Yagudin could beat 18 year old Yagudin, Yagudin still is better than Plushenko

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    Yagudin's performances at 1995 centennial and at 95 RN when he was 15, could beat himself at 1998 worlds, so 15 year old Yagudin could beat 18 year old Yagudin, Yagudin still is better than Plushenko
    Ok, you win..

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Habs View Post
    In 2010-11, Canadian judges preferred Crone & Poirier, while international judges favoured Weaver & Poje.
    Right on! This one was sooooooo painfully obvious.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by lala View Post
    Ok, you win..
    Yes, Yagudin was just Plushenko's born enermy

  9. #69

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    Some interesting trivia I research & comprised way back in January of 2011:

    Only 3 Olympic Champions have never won their own country's Nationals ~ Wolfgang Schwarz (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfgang_Schwarz), Alexei Yagudin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexei_Yagudin), Sarah Hughes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Hughes)

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    Yes, Yagudin was just Plushenko's born enermy
    LOL!!!!!! 100% russian drama! Plushenko and Yagudin took figure skating to an unbelievable popularity, ISU should pay them a rent or something.

  11. #71
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    Tanja Szewczenko was favored over Marina Kielmann during German Nationals, even after Kielman clearly outskated her. I like the skating of Szewczenko more, but her poor skate winning over Kielmann at Nationals was unfair.

    In the 50s-60s there were Joan Haanappel and Sjoukje Dijkstra in the Netherlands. Haanappel won nationals over Dijkstra again and again. International it was different. I can't remember what happened exactly, as I read about them many many years ago in an out of print biography of Dijkstra.

    When is it National preference and when is it simple a case of a better performance at Nationals than at Worlds? And perhaps some countries traditionally like certain traits in skaters better than other countries. Interesting topic.

  12. #72

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    Ryan Bradley always seemed to be appreciated more by US judges. He was National champ in the US but never was close to the top 10 at worlds. His rivals seemed to do better at worlds

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciocio View Post
    LOL!!!!!! 100% russian drama! Plushenko and Yagudin took figure skating to an unbelievable popularity, ISU should pay them a rent or something.
    You over estimated their influence and over estimated Yagudin's popularity in north America. Not a lot of people cared about two Russians. The one drama that really caused the unbelievable popularity of figure skating was Kerrigan/harding drama.
    Last edited by unicorn; 09-25-2013 at 04:41 PM.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    You over estimated their influence and over estimated Yagudin's popularity in north America. Not a lot of people cared about two Russians. The one drama that really caused the unbelievable popularity of figure skating is Kerrigan/harding drama.
    Ciocio talked about the whole world..Do you think, only N-A is exist?

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by lala View Post
    Ciocio talked about the whole world..Do you think, only N-A is exist?
    I don't know what she/he talked about, only you know. And yes, there's only NA on the planet.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    I don't know what she/he talked about, only you know. And yes, there's only NA on the planet.
    Of course I also don't know what she/he talked about, but I know how big was the craze for both of them everywhere.

    well, yesterday I started to like you...I was wrong..

  17. #77
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    Russian judges and federation think Slutskaya is better than Slutskaya but international judges think Butyrskaya is the better skater.

    U.S judges think Kwan is an untouchable god but international judges think Lipinski, Cohen, and Hughes can challenge and sometimes beat her.

    U.S judges think Zawadszki is a good skater but international judges think she sucks, even when she skates well. International judges think Gao is a good skater, but U.S judges and USFSA think she is nothing.

    International judges think Mitchell is a really good skater but U.S judges think he is nothing.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by unicorn View Post
    You over estimated their influence and over estimated Yagudin's popularity in north America. Not a lot of people cared about two Russians. The one drama that really caused the unbelievable popularity of figure skating was Kerrigan/harding drama.
    Yes, everybody heard about Kerrigan and Harding, their story was very popular all over the world. In Europe and Japan Plushenko and Yagudin contributed a lot to the popularity of FS and they are still contributing. They have a lot of fans, they attend shows etc.
    I think right now there is only Japan on the planet, when it comes to FS. I hope we don't need a new Kerrigan vs Harding to bring back the popularity in N/A or even Europe.

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciocio View Post
    Wikipedia:

    Alexei Konstantinovich Yagudin (Russian: About this sound Алексей Константинович Ягудин​ (help·info); 18 March 1980) is a former Russian figure skater. His major achievements in his six years of eligible sports career include being the 2002 Olympic Champion, a four-time World Champion (1998, 1999, 2000, 2002), a three-time European Champion (1998, 1999, 2002), a two-time Grand Prix Final Champion (1998-1999, 2001-2002), a World Junior Champion (1996) and a two-time World Professional Champion (1998, 2002).

    Evgeni Viktorovich Plushenko (Russian: About this sound Евге́ний Ви́кторович Плю́щенко​ (help·info), Yevgeny Viktorovich Plyushchenko; born 3 November 1982) is a Russian figure skater. He is the 2006 Winter Olympics gold medalist, 2002 Winter Olympics silver medalist, and 2010 Winter Olympics silver medalist, three-time (2001, 2003, 2004) World champion, seven-time (2000, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2010, 2012) European champion, a four-time (1999-2000, 2000-2001, 2002-2003, 2004-2005) Grand Prix Final champion and a ten-time (1999–2002, 2004–2006, 2010, 2012–2013) Russian national champion.
    Okay. I adore Plushenko, and hope he wipes the ice with the 'babies' he will be skating against in Sochi (if he's well enough to make the team). However, THIS information is particularly UNFAIR! Yagudin's career came to a screeching halt when it was discovered that he had a malformation of the hip socket, and years of pounding quads on it didn't do him any favours. Sure, Plushenko has all those other medals since 2002 Skate America, where Yagudin skated last competitively. Had his body NOT betrayed him, I could have seen these two slugging it out for YEARS, perhaps both competing in Vancouver! So, if you TRULY want to compare them during both skaters competitive careers, cut out everything Plushenko did past that SA comp. Having one's career cut tragically short by catastrophic injury in NO WAY makes your accomplishments pale in comparrison to a skater who, (albeit has had his share of injuries) was able to continue in the sport. Just sayin'.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple Axel View Post
    Okay. I adore Plushenko, and hope he wipes the ice with the 'babies' he will be skating against in Sochi (if he's well enough to make the team). However, THIS information is particularly UNFAIR! Yagudin's career came to a screeching halt when it was discovered that he had a malformation of the hip socket, and years of pounding quads on it didn't do him any favours. Sure, Plushenko has all those other medals since 2002 Skate America, where Yagudin skated last competitively. Had his body NOT betrayed him, I could have seen these two slugging it out for YEARS, perhaps both competing in Vancouver! So, if you TRULY want to compare them during both skaters competitive careers, cut out everything Plushenko did past that SA comp. Having one's career cut tragically short by catastrophic injury in NO WAY makes your accomplishments pale in comparrison to a skater who, (albeit has had his share of injuries) was able to continue in the sport. Just sayin'.
    No, if we want to compare them:
    Plushy and Yag at 13, 14, 15 y.o. and so on... to their Olympic Champion titles, they're not in the same age. Alexei competed 7 years among the seniors.
    Last edited by lala; 10-07-2013 at 07:48 PM.

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