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With Olympics skated exactly as was who could have medalled or won
There seems to be alot of if everyone were clean threads. However that isnt realistic to think, and almost never will happen. One interesting thing to wonder is if the competition had gone exactly as it did for all but said skater which skaters were capable of winning or medalling had they skated their best. Say the Olympics from 92-2010. I am only interested in the women mostly so that is the only discipline I would do but feel free to do any others:
Capable to win over Yamaguchis winning performance had they skated their best- Yamaguchi, Ito, Harding, Kerrigan
Capable to medal over Kerrigans bronze performance had they skated their best- the 4 above, Bonaly, Chen (had she done perfect in both), Chouinard (had she done perfect in both)
Capable to win over Baiuls winning performance had they skated their best- Baiul, Kerrigan, Bonaly, Sato, Chouinard
Capable to win medal over Chens bronze had they skated their best- the 5 above, plus Chen
Capable to win over Lipinskis winning performance had they skated their best- Lipinski, Kwan
Capable to win medal over Chens bronze skates had they skated their best- Lipnski, Kwan, Butyrskaya, Slutskaya, Hubert, Gusmeroli, Bobek
Capable to win over Hughes winning performance had they skated their best- Hughes, Slutskaya, Kwan, Cohen, Butyrskaya
Capable to win medal over Kwans bronze skates had they skated their best- the 5 above, Suguri
Capable to win over Arakawas winning performance had they skated their best- Arakawa, Slutskaya, Cohen
Capable to medal over Slutskayas bronze skates had they skated their best- Kwan (had she skated, skated a clean short and clean 6 triple long with big COP improvements), Suguri (maybe, not even sure), Meissner (with her 2010 Worlds skates maybe), Kostner, Ando (maybe)
Capable to win over Kims winning performance had they skated their best- Kim
Capable to medal over Rochettes bronze skates had they skated their best- Kim, Asada, Rochette, dont really think anyone else honestly.
Maybe do the men too:
Capable to win over Petrenkos winning performance had they skated their best- Petrenko, Browning, Barna (with clean quad)
Capable to medal over Barnas bronze skates had they skated their best- the 3 above, Wylie, Bowman, Eldredge
Capable to win over Urmanovs winning performance had they skated their best- Urmanov, Browning, Petrenko, Stojko (with quad-triple)
Capable to medal over Candeleros bronze skates had they skated their best- the 4 above, Boitano, Candelero, Davis, Millot
Capable to win over Kuliks winning performance had they skated their best- Kulik, Stojko
Capable to win silver over Stojkos silver skates had they skated their best- Eldredge, Yagudin, Urmanov (healthy and competiting)
Capable to win over Yagudins winning performance had they skated their best- Yagudin, maybe Plushenko (but if was in contention Yagudin would probably do harder and give no chance)
Capable to medal over Goebels bronze performances had they skated their best- Yagudin, Plushenko, Goebel, Eldredge, dont really think any others
Capable to win over Plushenkos winning skates- Plushenko
Capable to win silver over Lambiels actual skates at the event- Plushenko, Lambiel, Takahashi, Buttle, Joubert.
Capable to win bronze over Buttles skates at the event- all the above, plus Weir, Lysacek
Capable to win gold over Lysaceks winning skates- Lysacek, Plushenko, Lambiel, Takahashi, Joubert, Chan, Abbott
Capable to win bronze over Takahashis skates at event- all 7 above, plus Oda, maybe Kozuka
I'm not sure Chen had any chance of a medal at the 92 Olympics. Her medal at worlds that year almost didn't happen as is (and it was mostly a splatfest and she was one of the cleaner ones). Chouinard perhaps had a chance if perfect, but Chen would have needed Kerrigan and Harding to both fall many times to place over them. Her skating was not yet at the level we would see in a few years.
At the 2006 Olympics I don't think Kwan or Meissner had any chance to medal either. Kwan was too injured, and it was unrealistic to expect 3/3s from her at point.
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Pairs I guess I might as well do too
Capable to win over MD winning skate- M&D, B&E
Capable to medal over B&Es skate- M&D, B&P, B&E, K&V, S&N, U&M
94 Olympics: nobody capable to do any better than they did
98 Capable to win over K&D winning performances if they did their best- K&D, B&S, W&S, E&B
Capable to medal over W&E bronze performances if they skated their best- all 4 above, I&D, M&S
2002 Olympics- nobody capable to do better than they did as far as medals.
2006 Olympics- nobody capable to beat T&Ms winning performances
Capable to beat Zhangs silver performances if they skated their best- Z&Z, S&Z, P&T, P&T, S&S
2010 Olympics- capable to beat S&Zs winning performances if they skated their best- S&Z, S&S, K&S
Capable to beat S&Ss bronze performances if they skated their best- those 3, P&T, maybe #2 Russians with Trankov, maybe D&D of Canada, probably not Zhangs at that point
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Originally Posted by Lnt175
Fair point on Chen in 92. Remember Chen wasnt her best at Worlds though, doubling many jumps in the LP.
I know Kwan wasnt ever doing a 3-3 in 2006. However if she was there, fully healthy, had made big COP improvements, and skated a clean short with triple lutz-double toe and triple flip she might have scored around 63 points. Then a clean LP with 6 triples (no triple-triple, just 6 triples clean) and COP improvements maybe score around 120. That would give her bronze over Slutskaya, or maybe silver over Cohen if both still did the exact same skates they did I was thinking. Remember this isnt a thread for everyone doing their best which I know by 2006 Kwan would have no chance in that case.
Meissners Worlds LP scored almost 130 at Worlds. I know it would score way lower in Turin which was a different environment and field, but I wonder how high it might score. 123 or 124 would be needed for bronze overall combined with her short there.
I am not sure if Nancy could have won in 92 over Kristi's flawed performance even had she skated cleanly. Kristi had 2 big mistakes but still did a triple lutz-triple toe, 2 triple lutzes, and had 8 5.9s for presentation. Nancy's combination was a triple toe-triple toe, only 1 triple lutz, she had 3 triple toes planned, and she wouldnt get 8 5.9s for presentation competing against Kristi either I dont think. Midori's long program wasnt bad at all, only one big mistake and a late triple axel, and still couldnt beat Kristi's LP with its mistakes, so I am not sure if Nancy ever could have. On top of all that Nancy skating cleanly with 7 triples probably wasnt realistic either, even if she could have won doing that. The most she ever would do is 5, and that wasnt until years later.
Midori would have beaten Kristi if she were clean
Kerrigan would have beatan Bauil
no one would beat lipinski
kwan and irina would have beaten hughes if they were clean
Irina and Cohen could have beaten Shizuka
Fumie Suguri and Carolina Kostner could have meddled over Irina
no one would beat Yuna
Rachael Flatt would have beaten Rochette if the two 3F were called clean.
She finished *20* points behind Rochette overall.
Originally Posted by sk8ingcoach
http://www.isuresults.com/results/owg2010/CAT002RS.HTM The triple flips probably did cost her about 8 points (still too much, IMO, for such a controversial call, that the judges obviously seemed not to agree with since they gave mostly 0s and some + GOEs. Glad they instituted the reduced penalties and differentiation between the < and<< after that). It's possible she would've finished as high as 4th but she still would've been way behind Rochette.
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I disagreed with Flatt's two downgrades but if that is true she would have placed 4th over Nagasu and Lepisto then it was justice served in an indirect route as it would have been criminal for her to have beaten either of those the way they skated in Vancouver.
Furthermore, if Rochette had landed the 3flip in the LP the way she nailed it in the SP (she scored the highest of all the ladies in the event with GOE on that element in the SP (7.10), and deservedly so) or if she had completed her planned 2Axel-2Axel sequence cleanly, she could have won the silver medal over Asada's LP skate. As it was, she was only 2.86 points off of Asada.
Originally Posted by KimGOAT
Last edited by museksk8r; 09-06-2013 at 12:11 AM.
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92 for women all of Ito, Harding, and Kerrigan could have beaten Yamaguchi's winning performance. It was the worst ladies gold medal performance in the last 40 years and maybe the worst skate of Kristi's career. Bonaly or Josee or Kiellmann, Hubert would have won bronze over Kerrigan's skate with 2 clean programs. Don't think Chen, too new.
94 for women Baiul landed only 3 clean triples so was way off her game. Any of Kerrigan, Bonaly, Sato, Josee, Chen, would have won over her with 2 clean programs. The gold medal was there for everyone but nobody took it.
2010 Olympics Rochette would have won silver over Asada if she skated cleanly, or if she had just 1 less mistake.
Brasseur & Eisler skating cleanly would have won over Miskutienok & Dmitriev with their mistakes in 92. Even when M&D were perfect B&E always took judges off them- 91 Worlds, 94 Olympics, so with M&D making 2 big mistakes and B&E completely clean it would be an easy win for B&E.
Usova & Zhulin would have won the 94 Olympic Gold over Gritschuk & Platov had they gone clean. They missed the last 90 seconds of the program totally.