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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moka-Ananas View Post
    I just watched Kovtun's new FS. The version he showed at the test skate is an abridged one, right? He was finished after barely 3:40.
    He started from the middle section of his program, I believe.
    I find him much improved, his posture and carriage are tons better and Tchaikovsky surprisingly suits him very much. He looks in terrific form jumpwise too

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    I don't think she can survive with those younger girls. Unfortunately they are better. Her chance was last year. If she managed to stand out (for example at nationals) like Gosviani did, she would have a chance to be sent this season for senior B competitions and if she did well there, she would establish herself as decent senior (perhaps not the same as Sotnikova/Tuktamysheva/Lipnitskaya, but at least a decent senior. Unfortunately she did not qualify last year for senior nationals and at junior nationals she did not particularly managed to stand out. In juniors there is such a high level of competition within Russia and it is so many of them who have 3Lz-3T and 3F that I think it will be harder to stand out in juniors than in seniors. I think only one or two competitors at junior nationals did not have triple triple.
    Agree, last year with Leonova struggling and Sotnikova, Tuktamysheva running hot and cold, Shelepen being injured and switching to Israel, Korobeynikova struggling and Biryukova injured and struggling even more, there were chances for new ladies to establish themselves as contenders, and Pogorilaya and Gosviani were the ones who broke through and took advantage of the opportunity. Due to this, it will be tough for Agafonova to break through now. Pogorilaya and Gosviani really seized the opportunity with both hands and even now they are just in the conversation regarding top ladies for ISU championships, not even main contenders really.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by VarBar View Post
    Re Sotnikova's Ex: Piazzola's music is a blend of tango and jazz and I personally got neither a tango feel nor a jazz feel from her program.
    As DobrinFan wrote, you are not supposed to . In an interview Adelina's coach described her as a bird in this program, but there were people who felt like she is a butterfly. I too get this image - a butterfly first flying free, and then loosing it's wings and ending it's life slowly (or not so slowly). It's sad how people complain about the "same old" all the time, and then when someone dares to do something unusual, something different from the norm/canon, they just don't get it, and are not favorably disposed at all. Okay, maybe that's not you - maybe you are not one of those who complain about "the same old" (I don't really remember from your posts, sorry). That's just a general observation. But it does seem like you lack imagination a bit. Sorry for saying that, I just find it a bit sad.

  4. #84
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    But it does seem like you lack imagination a bit. Sorry for saying that, I just find it a bit sad.

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by VarBar View Post
    I agree that those last two sentences were uncalled for.
    I can call the moon a pear, but it doesn't make it so. -- kwanfan1818

  6. #86

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    Random thoughts:

    Agafanova looks good. Obviously has grown a lot, the jumps, skating, and interpretation have all become bigger and more secure. I would run her out for a JGP and see how she does. It really isn't necessary to have every 13 year old girl in the country skate immediately on the JGP. Maybe Agafanova can mature into a solid skater.

    And I would have loved I/K's Ghost FD from last year on anyone else for the sheer trashy/campy quality it brought, and you've got to admit, it WAS different. However, I/K are so talented and have so much charisma and the potential to really shake up the snoozefest high-level ice dancing is these days. That's why I love to 'trash' them and Morozov. :smoking:


    I secretly still hold out hope Leonova shows up with kick-ass, over-the-top programs, and has a successful fall. Unfortunately I think there are way too many factors not in her favor, but she still is one of my favorite ladies skaters, therefore I still am holding out hope.

  7. #87

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    For Leonova to make the team, she will have to win gold or silver (bronze won't cut it) at every GP and GPF, and win at least a silver at the Europeans, and the other top Russian girls will have to be off the podium in two of these competitions. It's a very low probability occurrence.

  8. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by alchemy void View Post
    Random thoughts:

    I secretly still hold out hope Leonova shows up with kick-ass, over-the-top programs, and has a successful fall. Unfortunately I think there are way too many factors not in her favor, but she still is one of my favorite ladies skaters, therefore I still am holding out hope.
    I wouldn't mind if she returned to her witches program. I loved that one. But even the best program is not going to help if she is not landing edge jumps...

  9. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    For Leonova to make the team, she will have to win gold or silver (bronze won't cut it) at every GP and GPF, and win at least a silver at the Europeans, and the other top Russian girls will have to be off the podium in two of these competitions. It's a very low probability occurrence.
    You forgot to add that she has to place high (medal) at their nationals, otherwise she may not even be sent to Europeans. Like last year.
    Last edited by hanca; 08-22-2013 at 06:16 PM.

  10. #90

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    problem is, the ladies/men/etc. should have 2 decent competitions at nationals and at europeans to even get to sochi, where they should skate fabolous again.
    we know all voronov for example, 2nd at nationals 09/10, europeans meltdown and borodulin got his spot.

    so i think chances of the established skaters like leonova aren't that bad for making the team, if the youngster fail to make impact at europeans, where they may be sent.

    for me personally, i would prefer those grown ladies (as i said a thousand times) like makarova, biryukova, leonova and even agafonova on the team than all those jumping beans. makarova on, could be really great and epic (i know, this happens rarely) but those others are just greta jumpers.

    not to speak of LaTuk and Sotnikova, i like their development until now and hope they will grow and get the time they need.

  11. #91

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeschke View Post
    problem is, the ladies/men/etc. should have 2 decent competitions at nationals and at europeans to even get to sochi, where they should skate fabolous again.
    we know all voronov for example, 2nd at nationals 09/10, europeans meltdown and borodulin got his spot.

    so i think chances of the established skaters like leonova aren't that bad for making the team, if the youngster fail to make impact at europeans, where they may be sent.
    I don't think you are right. I don't think the chances of Leonova are that great because the youngsters won't fail to make impact at Europeans. They did well last year and that was their first senior championship. Now they have experience from senior championships so I wouldn't worry much about them failing there. Besides, with the level of skating in Russia I think their own nationals may be a harder competition than the Europeans. Last year about 16 out of 18 girls had triple triple at Russian nationals (and most of them have all jumps up to Lutz), whereas at Europeans there is not that many skaters who have triple-triple and jumps up to Lutz.

    Actually, unless Leonova is held up at their nationals, she may finish so low that even if some of the youngsters did fail, there will still be a queue of ladies whose turn is before hers. My guess is that she will finish about 6-10 place, unless she regained her edge jumps or unless she is strongly held up.

  12. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeschke View Post
    polina agafonova at test skates

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9t9nFDYYl0
    Thanks for the link! More videos uploaded by the same person here (Gordei "Pots" & other juniors): http://www.youtube.com/user/KNevskaya/videos
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  13. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    I don't think you are right. I don't think the chances of Leonova are that great because the youngsters won't fail to make impact at Europeans. They did well last year and that was their first senior championship. Now they have experience from senior championships so I wouldn't worry much about them failing there. Besides, with the level of skating in Russia I think their own nationals may be a harder competition than the Europeans. Last year about 16 out of 18 girls had triple triple at Russian nationals (and most of them have all jumps up to Lutz), whereas at Europeans there is not that many skaters who have triple-triple and jumps up to Lutz.

    Actually, unless Leonova is held up at their nationals, she may finish so low that even if some of the youngsters did fail, there will still be a queue of ladies whose turn is before hers. My guess is that she will finish about 6-10 place, unless she regained her edge jumps or unless she is strongly held up.
    you're right hance, i spoke theoretic. i don't think , that the youngster will fail either. i just wanted to mention, that the russian fed is not to shy to throw someone out of the team and if that will happen (what i don't expect) i think chances will be high for someone like leonove in favor of some not so established skaters.

  14. #94

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    [QUOTE=alchemy void;3978576

    And I would have loved I/K's Ghost FD from last year on anyone else for the sheer trashy/campy quality it brought, and you've got to admit, it WAS different. However, I/K are so talented and have so much charisma and the potential to really shake up the snoozefest high-level ice dancing is these days. That's why I love to 'trash' them and Morozov. :smoking:

    With Grishuk on the team they could be fabulous.Hope she's going to be in the KNC

  15. #95

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    Gosviani wasnet even qualified to go to euros and russia went out of it's way to get her qualified and send her to euros. If a skater has a good skate at nationals and hasn't even been out of Russia the whole season before nationals they could go to euros once they get the minimum scores!

  16. #96

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    Yes but the difference is that this year you have three spots and three very good youngsters (Sotnikova, Tuktamysheva and Lipnitskaya). Unless either of them have particularly bad season or is injured, I don't think any other skater would have the same chance to go to Europeans as Gosviani had last year. Especially when Europeans are a month before the Olympics and Russian Federation may want to use Europeans as the deciding factor for choosing who to send to Olympics. Also, the thing with Gosviani is that she did not have the qualifying score because she did not have any opportunity whatsoever to get one. It is not like if she were sent to a number of competitions and failed to get the score.

  17. #97

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    Yes but the difference is that this year you have three spots and three very good youngsters (Sotnikova, Tuktamysheva and Lipnitskaya). Unless either of them have particularly bad season or is injured, I don't think any other skater would have the same chance to go to Europeans as Gosviani had last year. Especially when Europeans are a month before the Olympics and Russian Federation may want to use Europeans as the deciding factor for choosing who to send to Olympics. Also, the thing with Gosviani is that she did not have the qualifying score because she did not have any opportunity whatsoever to get one. It is not like if she were sent to a number of competitions and failed to get the score.
    I think the message from the gosviani thing is that the Russian federation will dump a world medalist if they are beaten by someone who didn't qualify to leave the country didnt have the ijs minimums to go! So it really doenst matter what Liza Adelina did at euros 2013 or were at 2013 worlds. It's totally irrelevent. If they are beaten at nationals by someone who didn't even leave the country they are not going to euros! And will have to skate the Russia cup final! That's where leonova finally beat gosviani!

  18. #98

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    I think you are wrong. Leonova did not only mess up the nationals. She struggled the whole season. She finished at her GP events 6th and 7th out of 10. I was not surprised that she was dumped. I am wondering how it would damage her reputation if she completely messed up Europeans and then messed up the worlds. Also, why waste European spot on someone who is clearly not landing any edge jumps. (watch the worlds, I don't think she landed any loops and salchows at all).

  19. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    I think you are wrong. Leonova did not only mess up the nationals. She struggled the whole season. She finished at her GP events 6th and 7th out of 10. I was not surprised that she was dumped. I am wondering how it would damage her reputation if she completely messed up Europeans and then messed up the worlds. Also, why waste European spot on someone who is clearly not landing any edge jumps. (watch the worlds, I don't think she landed any loops and salchows at all).
    At the Russia cup final there was credited loop and salchow by leonova. So that is where she was able to overtake gosviani. And I think agafanova too. But your main point of season long bombing puts sotnikova a risk because she's never had a good gp season. Not compared to tuktamisheva and lipnitskaia.

  20. #100

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    The difference is that Sotnikova's 'bombing' is 3rd and 5th place at GP event whereas Leonova's 6th and 7th. Furthermore, Sotnikova bombed only at one GP (the one where she was 5th. I wouldn't call being 3rd bombing) but then she did well at nationals and at Europeans, and again bombed at Worlds. Leonova bombed at both GP events, at nationals and at Worlds. So Sotnikova has been inconsistent (while adjusting to the puberty) and Leonova has been consistent in bombing anything she entered.

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