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  1. #21
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    Ashley's dream for olympic season is so ambitious!

    she said in interview as a her dream, here is link http://www.teamusa.org/News/2013/Jan...-Ashley-Wagner
    “I would go to Sochi, skate two perfect programs, with the crowd giving me a standing ovation for my free skate, and I would win the gold medal. I’ll settle for the podium, but I want that gold medal.”
    Her dream is not just any color of olympic medal, but GOLD medal. But I don't think she will be able to achieve it Whatever she does before olympic season starts

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by briancoogaert View Post
    I think she has power and presence. When I saw her for the first time, I was really impressed by that. But she skates too carefully, IMO.
    It's all relative. Next to the likes of Rachel Flatt, Wagner may look pretty powerful, but when she gets on the ice with the big guns at Worlds, her basic stroking and edge control is just not as strong. ITA that she often looks to be skating carefully, rather than all out. Especially at the Olympics, careful will rarely beat all-out. (See the 98 ladies podium).

  3. #23
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    How about Wagner skates to Wagner? Maybe something from the Rings cycle?

  4. #24
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    Her programs for this season are already set, and there's no Wagner in them.

    Kostner took years to look graceful and was repeatedly called coltish into her 20's. She's become an elegant skater since her year with Carroll, but I wouldn't call her swan-like.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  5. #25

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    I think it will be a problem that Ashley is thinking about being "perfect" as quoted up thread. IMHO, Ashley was extremely lucky at Worlds this year that both Osmond and Gold were newbies. Gold's jumps are way better than Ashley's, and Osmond's skating skills, confidence, and performance are better. I suspect we will see improvement with Gold in the skating skills, confidence, and performance aspects, and improvement with Osmond in the jumps. If Ashley goes for perfect she will be slow and skate small (something she tends towards anyway.) When that happens she will be passed by Gold and Osmond and probably some others. JMHO, of course
    A good rant is cathartic. Ranting is what keeps me sane. They always come from a different place. Take the prime minister, for example. Sometimes when I rant about him, I am angry; other times, I am just severely annoyed - it's an important distinction. - Rick Mercer

  6. #26
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    She acknowledged that perfectionism and over-thinking were what has been holding her back. I've seen both Wagner and Osmond live, and I would not say that Osmond's performance is always better than Wagner's, but it certainly is when Wagner is being conservative, and Osmond is confident, which I hope she will continue to be as she's more and more in the spotlight. It doesn't hurt that Osmond's most formidable and politically backed competition, Phaneuf, retired, and that Lacoste petered after showing improvement, while Wagner's internal competition, plus last year's "Curse of the National Champion Repeat," was hanging over her head. US skaters constantly are trying to peak for Nationals, and allowing themselves to use GP and early international competitions to test new elements has become the luxury of the up-and-coming contenders.

    Ironically it's the technical work with Arutunian that may help to free Wagner from her perfectionism: he's trying to tool her jump technique so that it's repeatable/automatic through muscle memory regardless of how she feels, instead of her trying to reproduce the "feel" in competition, which she also acknowledges. When she's got the technique under her belt, and it becomes automatic, her jumps might be closer to perfect than when she tried to force them to be perfect, and she can focus on the performance aspects she studies with Nicks.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    ...Ironically it's the technical work with Arutunian that may help to free Wagner from her perfectionism: he's trying to tool her jump technique so that it's repeatable/automatic through muscle memory regardless of how she feels, instead of her trying to reproduce the "feel" in competition, which she also acknowledges. When she's got the technique under her belt, and it becomes automatic, her jumps might be closer to perfect than when she tried to force them to be perfect, and she can focus on the performance aspects she studies with Nicks.
    And on that note, she also stated in her TSL interview that she thinks 'calmer jump entrances' (which Rafael is teaching her) will help her attain the 3-3 or 2x-3t

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    She acknowledged that perfectionism and over-thinking were what has been holding her back. I've seen both Wagner and Osmond live, and I would not say that Osmond's performance is always better than Wagner's, but it certainly is when Wagner is being conservative, and Osmond is confident, which I hope she will continue to be as she's more and more in the spotlight.
    Would you agree with mag's assertion that Osmond's skating skills are better than Wagner's? Because I'm not sure I would (though Osmond can obviously pull off some crazy transitions).

  9. #29

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    As seen on TSL, Ashley has the great confidence and self believe (+2 on nice dosage of healthy self deprecating humour) to prepare her own big gun for the ultimate kiss kiss bang bang at US nationals. Although I am really excited to see how Gracey progresses from last year, she is by far a better athlete. Upon second thought, she can do well if her talent matches even matches 60% of that attitude. The rivalry between she and gold is getting exciting to see (did she mention anything about continuing after Sochi?).

    As bored as I am with the convention that the skater must pick a Russian composer's piece for Sochi, I thought the Prokiev's Romeo and Juliet is an inspired FS choice that will suit her style without she having to do too much work. The dramatic phrasing provide enough emoting that wasn't quite right from her program last year, possibly the best follow up to her transformational Black Swan program.

    Ashley has the drama and the Prom Queen presence, Gracey has the extraordinary jumps and the Golden girl power. The US is in good hands + a Miraicle comeback or a healthy Alissa (Surely an international judge's sentimental fav?) US should be in very good hands. If Ashley want to be in even more firmer control over he own destiny - Bring some Hollywood Glam, use her American Sass, get the package right (Stick with the Black swan costume designer) but make sure her tech content (3:3, 2A3T, No double footer) matches the packaging, it can turn out to be a bazooka in Russia.

    Another things in her favour, who you think ISU is going to turn towards to after Asia loosing its bests after Sochi? Plus Kostner is likely to retire.
    Last edited by os168; 07-29-2013 at 02:52 AM.

  10. #30
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    I think Ashley has a very good chance at a medal.

    Her programs are COP friendly. In her TSL interview, she said she was planning a 3F+3T in the short and 2A+3T in the free. She already knows that she has to put her hardest content out there.

    If she sticks to the jump layout she has been the last couples seasons, she'll have seven triples and two 2A. She repeats two high value jumps, the 3F and 3Lo. Her programs are usually backloaded. She can hit level 4 spins. Her footwork is admittedly a weakness, but it's not terrible.

    Her PCS scores have improved, but to push the top 3, she needs to push through the choreo sequence and end of the program -- make that lasting final impression. If her free skate is a character-drive program I think the judges will reward her.

    The top 3 also have at least one Olys under their belts, so they know how to deal with the pressure.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by all_empty
    In her TSL interview, she said she was planning a 3F+3T in the short and 2A+3T in the free. She already knows that she has to put her hardest content out there.
    Didn't she say that this season too? Talking is one thing, doing it another one...

  12. #32
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    Something she also acknowledged.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Li'Kitsu View Post
    Didn't she say that this season too? Talking is one thing, doing it another one...
    Like I said in the other thread, I'll give her the benefit of the doubt.

    Look at Michelle Kwan. She talked for years about upping her technical ante for years. Everone was but she did it the Olympic season.

    Granted, it didn't work out for Michelle the way she wanted, but she put it out there.

    I expect Ashley to do the same.

  14. #34
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    Oops double post.

  15. #35
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    Alright... honestly, even if she realized that herself, I'm still sceptical about it until I see it. But I'll keep my fingers crossed she'll go for it. I liked her a lot in 2011-2012 (especially 4CC), but I thought she was tentative this season and always held back a little. We'll have to wait to see it anyway

  16. #36
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    Kwan is a bad example IMO, especially since her disastrous oly season only seemed to prove that frank was right all along and she should have listened. Ashley is with nicks, who hyped Sasha up to death promising all sorts of things she never delivered on. I'm surprised Ashley isn't claiming to have a quad! I get why they hype... It is a judged sport where reputation gets you better scores. But unltimatly, it's all just words if you can't deliver on ice.

    Maybe nate silver will chime in now that he's given up politics. But history has proven that the chances of anyone who hasn't medaled at worlds making the oly podium are slim to none. Usually the podium is crowded with former world champions. Ashley is a very long shot to medal.

  17. #37
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    Hughes only had one World bronze going into 2002 and won gold. I dont think the result in 2002 would have been any different had she been 4th at the 2001 Worlds.

    Kerrigan had been 5th at the 93 Worlds and very nearly won gold, and should have. Although she had alot of World and Olympic medals from the distant past to aid her reputation still.

    Shizuka had only 1 top 7 finish at Worlds going into the 2006 Olympics and won gold.

  18. #38
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    Her best bet is to come up with two AMAZING programs that highlight all of her strengths and hide her weaknesses. Even with that, and a 3flip/3toe (sp) + 2axel/3toe (lp) she will need mistakes from others. None of the top three are known for their consistency, though. I honestly think that just having two memorable programs to set her apart is the best strategy and gives Ashley a fighting chance at sneaking in for a medal in the big competitions.

  19. #39
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  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by kuzytalent View Post
    Hughes only had one World bronze going into 2002 and won gold. I dont think the result in 2002 would have been any different had she been 4th at the 2001 Worlds.

    Kerrigan had been 5th at the 93 Worlds and very nearly won gold, and should have. Although she had alot of World and Olympic medals from the distant past to aid her reputation still.

    Shizuka had only 1 top 7 finish at Worlds going into the 2006 Olympics and won gold.
    I won't attack this from the other end (what would Ashley's chances be if Hughes had gone to sic with less success than she did?) as it's kinda counter productive, but I will elaborate on what I said. Possibility and probability are not the same.

    If Ashely wants to pull off an historic upset ala Hughes, than she has to build the momentum that Hughes built going into the games. 1. She needs to narrowly lose a gp event to Kim and have the press kick up a big fuss claiming she "wuz robbed" 2. She needs to beat both Kim and Caro and/or Mao at another gp event a week later. 3. She needs to medal at the GPF again, preferably with more "wuz robbed" hype after finishing behind a sloppy Kim, Mao and Caro . Etc... The maybe she can overcome the fact that unlike Hughes, she didn't medal at worlds and hasn't made every world team she tried for.

    Kerrigan? Seriously? Kerrigan was like Sasha. Despite almost never skating a clean LP ever, she medaled at almost every single international event she competed in, always taken as a medal contender by the judges despite being wildly inconsistent. Ashley didn't go to 2013 worlds hyped as the one to beat, and easily win the sp, now did she.

    And unlike Ashley, shiz is a world champion, and according to the Isu lipinski rule, that can never be taken away from her!

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