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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prancer View Post
    Because if something is wrong, it becomes not-wrong if someone else does it to you first?
    No--it's not being a hypocrite. Many couples set parameters for their relationships with which I would choose otherwise, but is acceptable to them. Some couples/families post every tidbit of their private affairs online for others to view. Not my cup of tea, but it works for some. Some couples are into open marriages. Again, not my cup of tea, but if that works for them, then I wouldn't say it's necessarily wrong for them.

    In the video and subsequent interviews, the wife admitted to regularly posting derogatory things about her husband
    on social media without his consent in apparent attempts to curry public opinion for herself at her husband's expense. So she set the parameters of the relationship to include posting private info about one's spouse on social media sites in order to humiliate her husband and bolster herself--all without his consent. She admitted to doing that repeatedly. If she finds that acceptable to do, then she shouldn't complain when that same standard is applied to her. Clearly she didn't think anything was wrong with her doing it. So, if her behavior isn't wrong, then neither is his. Just as it would be hypocritical to say you want an open marriage and actively pursue others while married, but then cry foul when your spouse does the same thing, so also this is an issue of hypocrisy--not moral wrongs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anita18 View Post
    Really? Cause my sister witnessed our father having a "tantrum" because our mom had been experiencing a lot of pain and had visited numerous doctors. Nothing had worked and it had been like this for 2 years. There was nothing he could do to help his wife of almost 30 years.

    He locked himself in his study and screamed. It scared my sister pretty bad, since my dad so very rarely shows even any emotion, but there it is.

    I wouldn't call that seriously messed up behavior.
    I wouldn't call that a tantrum. A tantrum is when someone throw a fit because they aren't getting something they want. Having a private moment of grief is securely not a tantrum, and I'm rather dumbfounded that you would equate a grown woman laying on her back and kicking the car roof while screaming at the top of her lungs that she wants to go the lake the same as what your father experienced. Really now.

    And the point of the video wasn't to show him as the good guy, but to show to her the outrageousness of her behavior. And I'll just say it--I think too many women think they have carte blanche to act outrageously in a relationship with the expectation that the guy should just take it. Many women think they can slap a man in the face, but will get all indignant if he hits her back. No one should ever have to humor an adult having a tantrum like that.

  2. #62

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    Temper Tantrum Wife - "I just want to go to the lake!"

    At least one person makes sense in here! I'm absolutely dumbfounded at the amount of people who apparently think they can justify any behavior so long as they can point the finger and blame someone else for making them act that way. She absolutely set the tone for sharing their problems online. You don't like? Don't do it.
    -Brian
    "Michelle would never be caught with sausage grease staining her Vera Wang." - rfisher

  3. #63
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    We're not justifying her behavior. There was no excuse for either of them to act the way they did. They both escalated the situation needlessly. But everyone loves to poke fun at the crazy wife while sympathizing with the poor husband, while it always, always takes two to tango.

    Agal, I agree that what my father experienced is not the same thing. But as an outsider, you treat both the same in order to properly diffuse it - and you certainly do not go about it the way this husband did. Both partners have the communication skills of 5-year-olds.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anita18 View Post
    We're not justifying her behavior.
    True. But oddly, several people are bent on justifying his. It's unreal.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by agalisgv View Post
    In the video and subsequent interviews, the wife admitted to regularly posting derogatory things about her husband
    on social media without his consent in apparent attempts to curry public opinion for herself at her husband's expense. So she set the parameters of the relationship to include posting private info about one's spouse on social media sites in order to humiliate her husband and bolster herself--all without his consent. She admitted to doing that repeatedly. If she finds that acceptable to do, then she shouldn't complain when that same standard is applied to her. Clearly she didn't think anything was wrong with her doing it. So, if her behavior isn't wrong, then neither is his. Just as it would be hypocritical to say you want an open marriage and actively pursue others while married, but then cry foul when your spouse does the same thing, so also this is an issue of hypocrisy--not moral wrongs.
    I wasn't talking about HER standards for behavior. I was talking about yours.

    If you think she was wrong to share their marital troubles online, then you have to think he was, too. You can't say that his behavior was justified by hers. And if he thought she was wrong to make him look bad online, then he has to see himself as wrong, too.

    Your open marriage analogy only works if they had an agreement that they could post complaints about one another online. An open marriage is one agreed to by both parties. If there is no agreement, then you have one party committing adultery (because no agreement was made) and the other party having an affair for revenge--and then you are arguing that it is okay that he had an affair for revenge because she had an affair.


    Quote Originally Posted by BigB08822 View Post
    At least one person makes sense in here! I'm absolutely dumbfounded at the amount of [I}people who apparently think they can justify any behavior so long as they can point the finger and blame someone else for making them act that way[/I].
    Which is exactly the argument being made when some justify his behavior by saying she did it first.
    "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."-- Albert Einstein.

  6. #66
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    Do people really not see a difference between someone putting on their personal Facebook or texting their friends about issues with their spouse, and someone putting an actual video of behavior on Youtube for the entire world to see?

    I think she behaved like a total ass, but I still think his decision to broadcast the bad behavior of his spouse to the entire world is a bigger deal.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prancer View Post
    Which is exactly the argument being made when some justify his behavior by saying she did it first.
    Which is why these two lovely people have the communication skills of 5-year-olds. My sister and I certainly did that kind of crap to each other when we were kids, but it's been decades. Because we're now adults and someone has to BE the adult and take the high road in an ugly situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiruwater View Post
    Do people really not see a difference between someone putting on their personal Facebook or texting their friends about issues with their spouse, and someone putting an actual video of behavior on Youtube for the entire world to see?

    I think she behaved like a total ass, but I still think his decision to broadcast the bad behavior of his spouse to the entire world is a bigger deal.
    Not really. Sure, we COULD quantify it and put a number to how many people her Facebook posts could reach and how many a Youtube video could reach but so what. I am going to go out on a limb here and assume her Facebook friends are mostly friends, family and co-workers. In other words, people she sees often and people he sees often. I would much rather someone share information about me to a complete stranger than to someone who is going to judge me and has to have dinner with us next week.

    Again, I am not saying he isn't at fault. I just feel people are giving her a pass. Maybe not, though. Maybe I am reading far too much into some posts. I see people acting as if some of us are giving him a pass and I can say with certainty that I am not, so perhaps it goes both ways. I also see a lot of people telling stories of their own where they did something they shouldn't have but it wasn't their fault, someone MADE them do it. I don't buy into that attitude. YOU did it, you own it. If you don't like owning it then never do it again but that will never happen until you take responsibility for your own actions.
    -Brian
    "Michelle would never be caught with sausage grease staining her Vera Wang." - rfisher

  9. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiruwater View Post
    Do people really not see a difference between someone putting on their personal Facebook or texting their friends about issues with their spouse, and someone putting an actual video of behavior on Youtube for the entire world to see?
    I don't see why one is worse than the other. At least with video, you have can verify for yourself whether the behaviour is worthy of ridicule. I can't count how many times after watching a skater's performance that it was not nearly as dire as the play-by-play comments would have you believe.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigB08822 View Post
    NAgain, I am not saying he isn't at fault. I just feel people are giving her a pass. Maybe not, though. Maybe I am reading far too much into some posts. I see people acting as if some of us are giving him a pass and I can say with certainty that I am not, so perhaps it goes both ways.
    Well, this is what you said:

    Quote Originally Posted by BigB08822 View Post
    I think she is much worse. Her behavior is absolutely despicable. Yeah, it was a douchy thing to videotape her and put it online but seriously, if she didn't act like that then he would have had nothing to put online. The vibe I got is that he is sick of it and is tired of her telling everyone how awful he is (she admitted she talked about him at work and admitted to posting about their issues on Facebook and to texting her friends) so he decided to fight fire with fire. If she wants to tell everyone how mean he is to her then he can show them how she behaves. He kept his cool and really handled her well, IMO. He could have easily pulled the truck over and told her to walk her whiny you-know-what to the lake.
    He handled her really well and he was just fighting fire with fire? And now you are saying that his culpability depends on how many posts she made on Facebook?

    Again, how is that NOT saying that his behavior is justified by hers?
    "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."-- Albert Einstein.

  11. #71

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    I think the problem is that people are choosing sides and quick to paint one party as the "enemy" and the other one as the "good one" or "victim" who was just giving back what he received.

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    Who here who thinks that what he did was really wrong has painted her as a victim? I think she was an asshole, too. But I know a lot of asshole spouses who bitched about their spouses to their friends. Hell, my parents and all my parents' friends certainly did and do. I'm sure what she said was way worse than anything they said, but it's fairly typical behavior, even if it is certainly immature. Posting a video of the spouse's bad behavior for all the world to see and then the whole world actually seeing it? I've never seen that happen ever. I'm not saying her behavior wasn't despicable, but the breach of trust there is so enormous and life-changing I can't fathom that people are actually giving him a pass for it.

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    I think he handled her temper tantrum well. I don't think he should have video taped her and put it online. Not the same thing. I meant he handled her well by not yelling back, cursing, hitting, kicking her out of the car. That was my intent with the comment.

    You are reading way too much into what I said, which is probably what I have done with most others on here as well. Neither are in the clear. NEITHER ARE IN THE CLEAR. THEY BOTH MADE BIG MISTAKES. If that wasn't clear before, it should be now.
    -Brian
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    He probably set her up. I'm sure that marriage was way too dysfunctional for any party to act rationally.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigB08822 View Post
    I think he handled her temper tantrum well. I don't think he should have video taped her and put it online. Not the same thing. I meant he handled her well by not yelling back, cursing, hitting, kicking her out of the car. That was my intent with the comment.
    I'm saying this for your own benefit BigB08822 (I'm not sure if you're married or in a relationship) but....he didn't. He really didn't.

    He handled it well in that he didn't hit her or flip out himself, but his behavior escalated the situation, no doubt about it.

    Alf and I took a "marriage workshop" communication skills class before we got hitched, and this husband broke ALL the rules of good communication. He didn't acknowledge her feelings. ("I know you've been looking forward to going out on the lake all week, so I understand why you're upset.") In fact, he did the opposite - he told her it wasn't his fault and that she was being a baby and he laughed at her expense. Yes, even if when your spouse is flipping out, you have to acknowledge their feelings. He also didn't offer any compromise. ("We can go out on the boat tomorrow after we have lunch, how does that sound?")

    He did none of that, and I shook my head at both of them the whole time.

  16. #76

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    He didn't handle her tantrum well because he videoed it, and made it public. How is that a good way to handle a tantrum?

    Also, if he yelled and cursed back, he would not have the same affect from videoing it, and he was the one who knew it was being videoed. He wouldn't have videoed it if he had yelled and cursed back - he made the video (in which he does bait her) to humiliate her and make himself look like the bigger person. He didn't handle the tantrum well in any way.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigB08822 View Post
    I don't think he should have video taped her and put it online. Not the same thing. I meant he handled her well by not yelling back, cursing, hitting, kicking her out of the car. That was my intent with the comment.
    Well, I don't think he handled it at all well, which is why that comment stuck out, but I really shouldn't have included that part. I was more concerned about the rest of it, where you were explaining his reasoning. You don't know his reasoning, so I think you are more likely to be explaining your own. And to me, what you said was an attempt to justify his behavior.

    But since that wasn't what was meant, cool. I think everyone agrees that they were both wrong; the argument started because of assertions that one or the other was MORE wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anita18 View Post
    I'm saying this for your own benefit BigB08822 (I'm not sure if you're married or in a relationship) but....he didn't. He really didn't.

    He handled it well in that he didn't hit her or flip out himself, but his behavior escalated the situation, no doubt about it.

    Alf and I took a "marriage workshop" communication skills class before we got hitched, and this husband broke ALL the rules of good communication. He didn't acknowledge her feelings. ("I know you've been looking forward to going out on the lake all week, so I understand why you're upset.") In fact, he did the opposite - he told her it wasn't his fault and that she was being a baby and he laughed at her expense. Yes, even if when your spouse is flipping out, you have to acknowledge their feelings. He also didn't offer any compromise. ("We can go out on the boat tomorrow after we have lunch, how does that sound?")

    He did none of that, and I shook my head at both of them the whole time.
    I am no communication expert, but if my spouse were behaving that way, I would treat her (or him) exactly like a child having a tantrum. I would make sure that said spouse was physically safe and then I would pretty much ignore spouse until spouse had a grip.

    There is no point in talking to someone who is that state, IMO. And when someone is that mad, something like "I understand your feelings" always comes across as patronizing. I think trying to reason with someone who is in full batshit mode is stupid--you can't reason with the unreasonable.
    "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."-- Albert Einstein.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Prancer View Post
    I am no communication expert, but if my spouse were behaving that way, I would treat her (or him) exactly like a child having a tantrum. I would make sure that said spouse was physically safe and then I would pretty much ignore spouse until spouse had a grip.

    There is no point in talking to someone who is that state, IMO. And when someone is that mad, something like "I understand your feelings" always comes across as patronizing. I think trying to reason with someone who is in full batshit mode is stupid--you can't reason with the unreasonable.
    This is very true as well. You have to try to reason with them BEFORE they totally freak out.

    When someone is in a full-on emotional outburst, the only thing you can do that will be helpful to them is to give them space. That's why "timeouts" are so important, so you don't blow up and you can come back to discuss things rationally once your head is clearer. I got my order wrong since I did mention giving them space in an earlier post.

    You still certainly don't do what this guy did.

  19. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by agalisgv View Post
    And I don't think there's ever, *ever*, a justification for the behavior she exhibited. Period. She subjected another human being to completely unacceptable behavior. The fact that others beside her SO weren't there doesn't make it a completely private moment--he was there and had to endure that. And no one, ever, should have to endure that.

    If people think that's understandable behavior in certain circumstances (like having a bad day), I think they have some serious issues.
    You indicate that you possess a level of emotional control that would prohibit you from behaving as this woman would and that the people in your life have an equal amount of emotional control. Or alternatively, you and the people around you would never even have an inclination to lose control in that way, knowing that it is entirely inappropriate for adults. Either way, you suggest that emotionally healthy, mentally stable and well-adjusted adults would not behave as this woman did.

    But not everyone is emotionally healthy, well-adjusted and mentally stable. And in some cases, one person will exacerbate another person's instability, anxiety or fear.

    The woman lost control completely and had an ugly temper tantrum and her behaviour was not 'appropriate' for an adult. But it is possible to have some compassion for someone who does that in certain circumstances - though I don't in her case because the tantrum in itself doesn't tell me much of anything about her circumstances or her relationship.

    She had a temper tantrum, but she's not an axe murderer. There are far more serious behaviours with far more adverse circumstances, including serious harm to others.

  20. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigB08822 View Post
    At least one person makes sense in here! I'm absolutely dumbfounded at the amount of people who apparently think they can justify any behavior so long as they can point the finger and blame someone else for making them act that way. She absolutely set the tone for sharing their problems online. You don't like? Don't do it.
    I agree with you 200%.

    Question: have any of you EVER acted as ridiculously as this woman did, in your adult years, or even in your teens? I certainly haven't, nor do I know others who have. Her behavior was despicable. Can you imagine living with that all the time? I see his posting the video as a guy who was at his wit's end.

    Perhaps, as a result of her "dirty laundry" being aired, she'll change for the better. I don't believe for one second she has severe mental issues; I think she's a spoiled brat who never grew up. She gets none of my sympathy. Zero.
    "I hit him with my shoes... if he had given me the medal like I told him to, I wouldn't have had to hit him!" -- 8-year-old Rhoda Penmark in "The Bad Seed"

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