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  1. #81

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    I don't have any issue with Ashley's use of 'pansy'. Having watched some of her videos and seen her interact with some of her best friends, I'm sure she did not intend to insult gays. The girl appears to have more gay friends than Lady Gaga and Madonna combined, and the fun they have is so genuine.

    I thoroughly enjoyed the interview, I'm glad she brought her irreverence and got in the spirit of TSL. I think that this type of interview could get more people interested in skating, and a great update on the typical 'American Ice Princess smile-and-pretend' interviews we're so accustomed to seeing. It was snarky (and sometimes she tried a bit too hard), but as someone mentioned upthread she showed some great maturity/wisdom on the events that affected her profoundly (Not making Vancouver Olympics, Mills' internet diatribe, Nicks' decision not to travel). I don't suppose she intends to give Shirley Hughes a big hug the next time they meet.
    Last edited by FunnyBut; 08-01-2013 at 10:08 AM.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyWarhol View Post
    I can't believe people are getting worked up over pansy.

    GAYS MAY BE PROSECUTED AT OLYMPICS: fans and athletes not immune

    http://news.yahoo.com/gays-may-prose...opstories.html

  3. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    GAYS MAY BE PROSECUTED AT OLYMPICS: fans and athletes not immune

    http://news.yahoo.com/gays-may-prose...opstories.html
    Yes, this is a big issue, but do you think Ashley is promoting discrimination by calling herself a pansy because she chickened out on a jump?

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    GAYS MAY BE PROSECUTED AT OLYMPICS: fans and athletes not immune

    http://news.yahoo.com/gays-may-prose...opstories.html
    Wrong thread.
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

    from Speedy Death

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by FunnyBut View Post
    Yes, this is a big issue, but do you think Ashley is promoting discrimination by calling herself a pansy because she chickened out on a jump?
    Just because someone uses a slur to describe themselves does not mean it is any less offensive to the group of people the term was originally intended to harm. I'm not sure what your logic is behind that? If a male skater referred to himself as a "fag" because he missed his triple axel, would you not expect there to be any kind of uproar? The fact that words like 'fag' and 'pansy' have become synonymous with being weak AND are used to decribe a gay male are exactly the root of the problem. Continuing their use only reinforces the idea that gay men are weaker than their straight counterparts.

    Do I think Ashley meant harm to the gay community with her choice of words? No. But, I also don't think children mean harm when using the word 'gay' as an adjective for 'weak' or 'stupid.' That doesn't mean I would sit in silence when it was used; in fact, if she is as big of a supporter as some are claiming, I would imagine Ashley would WANT to know that she accidentally used a word that has such a derogatory history so that she can avoid its use in the future.

    Nobody thinks Ashley is evil for her choice of words and it is sad how defensive people are getting these days when gays point out something that is offensive to them. After all, we are slowly getting rights in a few states, can't we just be grateful and let things go?!

  6. #86
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    It is unacceptable for anyone to say something was gay when they did not like it (eg. that test was gay). Because that is directly associating gay with bad. It is not 100% the same thing when someone calls themselves a pansy when they chicken out of something. It's flawed to compare the two.

    Everyone jumps to criticize Ashley for being contrived at times, but they jump right on her when she makes one borderline questionable word choice in a two hour interview where she spoke thousands of words. I'm sure everyone making a stink out of this would much rather hear Ashley Wagner the Robot speak boooooring contrived interviews where she never flubs a single word and bores us to tears in manicuring her word choices at all times. She has better things to do, like training for the olympics.

    Pick your battles. Battle Russia and their appalling policies and laws, but don't battle a well-meaning athlete for one word.

  7. #87

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    Here are 5 things I hope we can all agree on:
    1. People have a right to be offended by a word even if the person using it doesn't know it's offensive. You're free to be "meh", I'm free to be offended. Freedom rocks.
    2. The worst thing to say to an offended or upset person is "lighten up and get over it". It makes them feel worse.
    3. Ashley is not an evil b for using the word, and would probably be embarrassed and apologetic.
    4. This horse has been beaten to death.
    5. Talking about skating is more fun than this.

  8. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by toddlj View Post
    Here are 5 things I hope we can all agree on:
    1. People have a right to be offended by a word even if the person using it doesn't know it's offensive. You're free to be "meh", I'm free to be offended. Freedom rocks.
    2. The worst thing to say to an offended or upset person is "lighten up and get over it". It makes them feel worse.
    3. Ashley is not an evil b for using the word, and would probably be embarrassed and apologetic.
    4. This horse has been beaten to death.
    5. Talking about skating is more fun than this.
    This.
    "I hit him with my shoes... if he had given me the medal like I told him to, I wouldn't have had to hit him!" -- 8-year-old Rhoda Penmark in "The Bad Seed"

  9. #89
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    That was the best. Everything Ashley said made me understand where she's coming from and root for her. I like level-headed, aware, driven people like her. I think it was the perfect level of "going there" but keeping it digestible for the PC crowd. I feel like if I were surrounded people like her at work we'd get a hell of a lot more done and have a better time.

    As I took a break between parts 1 and 2, I wondered about what will drive her at this year's Nationals and Olympics. There's a potential she could subconsciously slip into, "Meh, there are three spots, I'm guaranteed one of them." So I appreciate when at the end she said she's very aware that there are many girls gunning for her at Nationals, and that she has a long way to go to be on the Olympic podium. I'm glad that her goals don't just stop at making it to the Olympics, but clawing her way amongst the best because internationally, she's not yet one of the frontrunners.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbd1235 View Post
    I

    I'm sure everyone making a stink out of this would much rather hear Ashley Wagner the Robot speak boooooring contrived interviews where she never flubs a single word and bores us to tears in manicuring her word choices at all times. She has better things to do, like training for the olympics.

    Pick your battles. Battle Russia and their appalling policies and laws, but don't battle a well-meaning athlete for one word.
    What an illogical conclusion!

  11. #91

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    ^^^^^ I am with her.
    DH - and that's just my opinion

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    What an illogical conclusion!
    Exactly.

    Ashley is my favorite American skater; and skating is, of course, more fun to discuss. However, this is a thread discussing her interview with TSL which dealt with topics that extend well beyond what she does on the ice.

    Nobody is saying they want cliche answers or boring interviews from her. Is there really no gray area between boring and offensive? The attitude of posters here is rather appalling. My appreciation of Ashley's skating has no bearing on the fact that she used a word that was offensive, and how dare anyone tell me otherwise, or to get over it. "Fag" means a pack of cigarettes, and "pansy" means a delicate flower. Both are words that have come to use as derogatory insults against gay males, and are offensive regardless of whether they are thrown at oneself or a competitor. WTF is so hard to understand about that?

    I wish Ashley well this season. I hope she gets the 3/3 and contends for an Olympic medal. I also hope that she continues being honest, open and interesting in her off-ice endeavors, but can do so using words that don't demean a group of people that is being put through an awful lot of hate and BS right now, especially as it pertains to the upcoming Games. I have a feeling she would say "sorry, I didn't even realize" and move on, unlike posters here who refuse to understand the hurt words can cause certain people.

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    Thank you to everyone who has decided for me, as a gay man, what I should and should not take as offensive.

    Dictionary.com:


    pan·sy
    [pan-zee]

    noun, plural pan·sies.
    1.
    a violet, Viola tricolor hortensis, cultivated in many varieties, having richly and variously colored flowers.

    2.
    the flower of this plant.

    3.
    Slang: Disparaging and Offensive.
    a.
    a male homosexual.

    b.
    a weak, effeminate, and often cowardly man.
    Who are you to say that Ashley meant 3a. when she could have meant 3b? If you seriously think that Ashley is a homophobe and needs to apologize, then file a complaint against her with the USFSA.

  14. #94
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    LOL, Ashley Wagner is about as homophobic as Nicole Bobek, Barbra Streisand, Cher, Madonna, Lady Gaga, Cyndi Lauper, Kathy Griffin, and Margaret Cho.

  15. #95
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    Omg. You people are still arguing over that word. Wow just wow.

  16. #96
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    I grew up thinking that "pansy" was just another word for "wimp", so I'm pretty sure Ashley did too.

    I love her depiction of Adam's reaction to the "Gold lutz", though!

  17. #97
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    I get real tired of the PC police trying to police every word people say. It's just another form of fascism from people trying to control another person's freedom of speech. If they could read our minds and tell us what to think and not to think they would do that also. I guess i grew up in a time when people were a lot tougher and didn't get so butthurt. It was obvious that Ashley meant the word pansy as meaning she wimped out on the triple triple.

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronwynsings View Post
    I love her depiction of Adam's reaction to the "Gold lutz", though!
    That was pretty funny. The thing that wasn't made clear- is Adam annoyed she is doing it, or that she is trying to change the name to credit her? Because the later is pretty annoying; but Ashley made it sound like it was the former.

  19. #99
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    I assumed it was the former, but I'm not sure. Ashley does do some jumps occasionally with both arms over her head and I've seen it referred to as "Ripponing" the jump, and he hasn't really said much about that. (though it's not a triple lutz she does)

  20. #100

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    Rippon encouraged Gold to do the Rippon 3Lz last year, according to this 2012 Skate Detroit article: http://web.icenetwork.com/news/artic...&vkey=ice_news
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

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