Page 40 of 51 FirstFirst ... 30383940414250 ... LastLast
Results 781 to 800 of 1001
  1. #781

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    8,566
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Hi, guys! Yes, it what she said. And I think this is very important for all FS community.
    The difference is TAT wasn't in Nice, she was in hospital after surgery. This time she was in London with Kovtun. And this season Vaitsehovskay didn't asked every coach about ice dance results, because she was happy with DW gold, who is her favorites, when last season she asked everyone before somebody didn't tell to her DW must won. So TAT wasn't asked about what she is thinking about VM place in London.
    Last edited by pani; 08-27-2013 at 09:43 AM.

  2. #782

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    8,566
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by parapluies View Post
    These people really don't understand how CoP works. FF won because it was technically superior to DF whereass DF looks like it was put together at the last minute.
    For people, who didn't understand, someone made video which show only legs work and I think everyone saw it.
    But I am sure this season DW will have much better programs and she will show better free leg positions.
    All we are talking about was in past.
    And funny - TAT agree with Scott about judges.

  3. #783
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    141
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Another variant

    Thanks, TAHbKA:

    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...medal-in-Sochi

    EV: What do you think about the ice dance?
    TT: I think Virtue/Moir will be very strong this season

    EV: Because they lost the Worlds?
    TT: I don't think it was fair, by the way. I liked them better than Davis/White in the FD. The judges were unable to receive `Carmen' as they should had. I think it was an exceptional dance.

  4. #784

    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    In Canuck Land, hey!
    Age
    56
    Posts
    3,782
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    I would day it was more than just the judges who couldn't "receive" Carmen. Pity.
    Crazy about sports!

  5. #785

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    8,566
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by professordeb View Post
    I would day it was more than just the judges who couldn't "receive" Carmen. Pity.
    Usually TAT "love" judges and evrytime tell them about if she didnt think results were fair.

  6. #786
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,485
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Not so many posts left and I think the new thread will be around Finlandia so this is the time to think of some nice titles.

    I wouldnt mind "Cheek to Cheek"

  7. #787

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    8,566
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Emdee View Post
    Not so many posts left and I think the new thread will be around Finlandia so this is the time to think of some nice titles.

    I wouldnt mind "Cheek to Cheek"
    I like it

  8. #788
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Marseille
    Posts
    947
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by pani View Post
    For people, who didn't understand, someone made video which show only legs work and I think everyone saw it.
    But I am sure this season DW will have much better programs and she will show better free leg positions.
    All we are talking about was in past.
    And funny - TAT agree with Scott about judges.
    Yep if you rewatch their 2012 worlds performance you can see where D/W lost points (unsynchronized twizzles for example)

  9. #789
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    424
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by parapluies View Post
    These people really don't understand how CoP works. FF won because it was technically superior to DF whereass DF looks like it was put together at the last minute.
    I agree and I might also add that the push back over V/M winning in 2012 was totally inappropriate - as far as I'm concerned they won it fair and square and just because people preferred DF to FF doesn't mean the former should have won. It's about the skating not the music.

    Thanks Shayii for reminding us not to take seriously anything Tarasova says.

  10. #790
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,485
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    [QUOTE=blueglass;3981774]I agree and I might also add that the push back over V/M winning in 2012 was totally inappropriate - as far as I'm concerned they won it fair and square and just because people preferred DF to FF doesn't mean the former should have won. It's about the skating not the music.

    QUOTE]

    Totally agree with this sentiment. DF was a program that easily captured the interest of the hoi polloi but honestly it didnt have the little touches of T&S. And FF just grew and grew and grew as the year progressed. After a few watches of DF I found it didnt grow on one at all but was rather flat by the time worlds came around.

  11. #791
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    64
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    [QUOTE=lola10;3980188 Lastly, a big, warm welcome to asianfsfan! Have fun here![/QUOTE] Thanks, lola10

    Everyone here has contributed lots of interesting posts to read

    In relation to what has been posted, want to play devil's advocate here

    Here's my personal take on why FF vs DF and Carmen vs ND seasons differ. Simple: Choreography (and Music) Appeal

    When VM's FF first showcased to the audience and judges, the overall reaction to the piece was extremely positive. Pretty much stayed that way till the end. Its choreography was peppy/upbeat. It evoked pure joy fullness/ happiness. Most of all, it was relatable. Same goes with DW's , it made sense since it's "traditional" (or, equated to what ice dancing should be). Plus, the performance had music appeal and for some, (likable)style. In all sense, they (judges) related (emotionally) better (and positively) to both FDs equally. Therefore, the Scores reflected that. FF was a more obvious winner (despite the few disgruntled critics) - it had the "Feel/Look/Music sound" of Great Performance + had obvious Technical superiority over DF.

    With Carmen (specifically requested by judges themselves), They (judges) had high expectations for a spectacular choreography. They want the feel of explosive passion and tragedy, alright. Alas,when the piece showcased, Carmen was completely...opposite...of what they envisioned (in their minds).

    Honestly, it was...different...hard...and "uncomfortable". Full of symbolisms...and maybe (for some) it's in abstract (the horror!). Perhaps, that's why some focused on one dimension...in this case, sexual. Though, it isn't ...really.

    But those who do enjoy art in its truest sense will appreciate for its overall beauty. Like coach Tatiana, she saw "it". We saw (and got) "it". The judges...not so much. Distracted by the performance, they were also unable to score their technical (though better than most ice dancing teams) components objectively.

    The same with SDs - Giselle (ballet) is a known piece and music appeal. From the beginning, it garnered positive reaction because of the feeling it evoked. Choreography...simple, upbeat...and again, relatable. Hence, you can see technical components was/could be indirectly affected by their emotion to the performance.

    Back to Carmen, I don't blame them...they (judges) just want simple. Simple...relatable emotions of passion and/or tragedy in a "traditional" feel, like those of past Carmens...Just more extraordinary.

    First (and positive) impression is everything. Think how Mahler/Valse Triste/Umbrellas/etc...affected you emotionally...The same goes with the judges...

    Unfair? Perhaps...

    Remember, even if the CoP has changed, there are parts of it that is still subjective. That! No matter how logical or objective you are, is still emotional.

    Sorry for rambling...sometimes, what I want to express and write is harder than I am thinking and feeling. Wish I was as articulate as some of you are

  12. #792
    Rooting for the Underdogs
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Politicking for P&B and V&M
    Posts
    1,630
    vCash
    887
    Rep Power
    0
    Judges aren't supposed to be judging based on how the theme of a program makes them feel. It's also not American Idol where the audience reaction is taken into account. This is an Olympic sport. What the audience thinks or feels about a team's music or theme is, or should be, completely irrelevant to the scoring. The judges are supposed to be judging by a specific set of printed-in-black-and-white criteria that's supposed to evaluate the program based on technical difficulty and execution, skating skill, etc. Even the PCS mark is a technical mark, after all.

    I think it's important not to mix up the theme of a program with its choreography. Carmen was an unquestionably spectacular piece of choreography. There is no other tour de force like it in skating history. I understand that the theme may have made some people uncomfortable, but the theme of the program and how it made people feel was in no way supposed to enter into the marking. The theme is just a background for the technical skills that are supposed to be evaluated. CoP was created with the intention of removing the subjective "how a program makes someone feel" component from scoring skating programs.
    Last edited by aka_gerbil; 08-28-2013 at 01:39 AM.

  13. #793
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Does it matter?
    Posts
    1,115
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by blueglass View Post
    Thanks Shayii for reminding us not to take seriously anything Tarasova says.
    Unfortunately, I think I have to agree with you and Shayii because I often feel that Tarasova's perception of who should have won a competition is based on what program/music 'transports' her rather than the ISJ rulebook and what the judges are looking for in a performance. Just like Sonia Bianchetti in 2012, D/W should have taken the Worlds gold because their waltz made her cry with joy. lol I'm afraid such an explanation is hardly enough, at least as far as I am concerned.

  14. #794

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    8,566
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    WOW, I don't think TAT could be compared with Sonya. How many OGM Sonya had?
    TAT isn't good expert in figure skating? Or just because she disagree with judges she couldn't talk about this?

  15. #795

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    1,853
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by pani View Post
    WOW, I don't think TAT could be compared with Sonya. How many OGM Sonya had?
    TAT isn't good expert in figure skating? Or just because she disagree with judges she couldn't talk about this?
    No we can't. Sonia Bianchetti I actually think despises V/M. My problem with Tat is that she was a lot more vocal about her stance for Worlds 2012 than she is for 2013. Nobody spoke up when it mattered I feel. Anyways I wasn't trying to make anybody else feel like they can't take Tarasova's comment seriously. It was still nice that she said it.
    "They’re everything in a team that we strive to be...they are to me the quintessential ice dance team of our time."~Kaitlyn Weaver

  16. #796

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    8,566
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Shayii, like I post before, she wasn't asked.about this at WCH. And she was focusing in Kovtun not such a good result in London.
    I think it's not bad she said this before season started. She never talk without some back minds.
    Now we need to wait High Performance Camp. When it will be?

  17. #797
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    1,592
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    1. Bianchetti has been VERY positive on V/M throughout their career.

    2. As for the new thread, I want it to be "17 Seasons to Sochi" to celebrate their seventeen seasons together. I'm trying to come up with 17 lists about them (any suggestions?)

  18. #798
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,485
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    1. Bianchetti has been VERY positive on V/M throughout their career.

    2. As for the new thread, I want it to be "17 Seasons to Sochi" to celebrate their seventeen seasons together. I'm trying to come up with 17 lists about them (any suggestions?)
    I love the new thread idea but I think that should be around Nats ...it's early for that....you know how we will use up a lot of ink.

  19. #799

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    1,853
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    1. Bianchetti has been VERY positive on V/M throughout their career.

    2. As for the new thread, I want it to be "17 Seasons to Sochi" to celebrate their seventeen seasons together. I'm trying to come up with 17 lists about them (any suggestions?)
    I probably shouldn't have used the word despised, not sure why I even chose that word. But her comments re Tessa and Scott always seemed forced and that website she writes for (can't remember the name) hardly have anything positive to say about Tessa and Scott.

    I loved this title when you suggested it earlier in the year, but I think we should save it for later like Emdee said-- around nats or the games. And what kind of lists are you trying to come up with? Like just random facts?
    "They’re everything in a team that we strive to be...they are to me the quintessential ice dance team of our time."~Kaitlyn Weaver

  20. #800
    YEAH!
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Worshipping Grebenkina...
    Posts
    13,682
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    5868
    Quote Originally Posted by AsianFSFan View Post
    With Carmen (specifically requested by judges themselves), They (judges) had high expectations for a spectacular choreography. They want the feel of explosive passion and tragedy, alright. Alas,when the piece showcased, Carmen was completely...opposite...of what they envisioned (in their minds).

    Honestly, it was...different...hard...and "uncomfortable". Full of symbolisms...and maybe (for some) it's in abstract (the horror!). Perhaps, that's why some focused on one dimension...in this case, sexual. Though, it isn't ...really.

    But those who do enjoy art in its truest sense will appreciate for its overall beauty. Like coach Tatiana, she saw "it". We saw (and got) "it". The judges...not so much. Distracted by the performance, they were also unable to score their technical (though better than most ice dancing teams) components objectively.
    ...
    Back to Carmen, I don't blame them...they (judges) just want simple. Simple...relatable emotions of passion and/or tragedy in a "traditional" feel, like those of past Carmens...Just more extraordinary.
    Quote Originally Posted by aka_gerbil View Post
    Judges aren't supposed to be judging based on how the theme of a program makes them feel. It's also not American Idol where the audience reaction is taken into account. This is an Olympic sport. What the audience thinks or feels about a team's music or theme is, or should be, completely irrelevant to the scoring. The judges are supposed to be judging by a specific set of printed-in-black-and-white criteria that's supposed to evaluate the program based on technical difficulty and execution, skating skill, etc. Even the PCS mark is a technical mark, after all.

    I think it's important not to mix up the theme of a program with its choreography. Carmen was an unquestionably spectacular piece of choreography. There is no other tour de force like it in skating history. I understand that the theme may have made some people uncomfortable, but the theme of the program and how it made people feel was in no way supposed to enter into the marking. The theme is just a background for the technical skills that are supposed to be evaluated. CoP was created with the intention of removing the subjective "how a program makes someone feel" component from scoring skating programs.
    I think you both make great points. The judging is not supposed to be based on how the program makes you feel, but I can't help but wonder sometimes. There has long been a stereotype about stuffy, conservative figure skating judges and that didn't come out of thin air. There's a reason why we get the warhorses we do, interpreted in similar ways, often with similar or the exact same music cuts, and the same type of costume, year after year after year. Anything that distracts from this or makes the judges uncomfortable is a big risk. For example, the way they used modern dance elements and shifted their weight differently than the typical upright figure skating choreography was brilliant (because man, what core strengh, edge stability, and balance do you need to pull that off), but it's not what the judges are used to and could've actually been a mark against them. And remember, just two seasons before, the ISU was asking for "uplifting."

    I am proud of them for taking that risk and I agree with aka_gerbil that they created an outstanding piece of choreography (both according to the CoP rulebook and my personal preference). I do understand what AsianFSFan is saying also (welcome, by the way!). It reminds me of Maxim Staviyski's description of Carmen from CoR:

    "i like their free dance based on carmen. there have been many attempts to present a classic theme in certain modern way. such things are not always acceptable, especially when we're used to the classics and any other interpretation looks, let's say, unusual. it gets uncomfortable. but in the canadian's choreography, you can see their own approach and their own vision. it has maybe more sexuality, more rough movements for tessa and unnatural positions in dance [than we're used to]. it was a very interesting dance to watch. and i can't even say that virtue and moir performed all elements as they should be done. i consider them the leaders today. they are strongest in choreography and skating”


    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    1. Bianchetti has been VERY positive on V/M throughout their career.

    2. As for the new thread, I want it to be "17 Seasons to Sochi" to celebrate their seventeen seasons together. I'm trying to come up with 17 lists about them (any suggestions?)
    I dislike Bianchetti, but yes, she has said many great things about them.

    I love this idea! I was thinking something like "The Seasons Turn" but yours is even better and it gives me fond memories of Butyrskaya's 17 Moments of Spring.

    "Cheek to Cheek" is great too... both should be used during the season.

    What do you mean by 17 lists?

Page 40 of 51 FirstFirst ... 30383940414250 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •