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  1. #41
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    Sorry, double post.
    Last edited by cruisin; 06-15-2013 at 03:09 AM.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sofia Alexandra View Post
    And apart from the heart condition that cavalier king Charles spaniels suffer from they're also prone to syringomyelia, which means that the skull is too small for the brain.
    Syringomyelia is rare in the US. And technically it is not that the skull is too small, it is a malformation, the base of the skull cuts/curves in too much and blocking spinal fluid and putting pressure on the spinal cord. The discomfort can range from mild irritation and scratching at the neck, to excruciating pain. It is most common in the UK. Cavs in the US are bred larger than they are in the UK. And the base of their skulls are better formed because the dog is generally larger. This is also present in many small breeds.

    There was a big to do a few years ago because the winner of the most prestigious Brittish dog show was a Cav with syringomyelia. This dog became very popular for studding. Not good!

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sofia Alexandra View Post
    Dog breeding post
    I have a purebred german shepherd (rescue, no papers) and as idiotic as her backyard breeder was, at least she has a normal back. However, the show standard here in the States is to have this unnatural sloping back. Our neighbors have two that they breed (also backyard breeders), and the poor things look like they have so much trouble walking with those low back legs.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gazpacho View Post
    About 75% of shelter dogs are mutts. If you're focused on having any breed, you're already ruling out most shelter dogs. If you're focused on one specific breed, then you're overlooking many fantastic dogs.
    My Heinz 57 was a private acquisition (a friend of a friend's parents passed away and she couldn't keep their dogs, I had just closed on a house and wanted a dog). My purebred, though not papered, Pembroke Welsh Corgi is from county animal control. Around here, the county shelter will often be a majority of purebreds-mostly hounds, some toys, and there was a GSD in the last time I cruised through. (Though frankly how he made it to adoption row I have no idea. His behavior was not confidence-inspiring.) At our county, once they make it to "adoptable" they're there until taken. There are plenty of dogs never given the option (unclaimed bull terriers and other pit-type breeds are all euthanized if they're not claimed by an owner and are never available for adoption.) And it can be very hard to gauge behavior and temper in a shelter situation, plus even when they allegedly know the dog's "history" they can be wrong or missing important information. Responsible breeders (and AKC, NEVER CKC as that's pretty much admitting to not being a responsible breeder) are well acquainted with their dogs and can give a reasonably confident guarantee what the new owner is going to get, health and general behavior wise. And they will take back puppies who do not work out.

    Purebred are not why there are so many dogs in shelters (let alone why there are so many mutts in shelters.) People who refuse to spay/neuter their unregistered, unworked/unshown pet-quality animals and don't take care to make sure the dogs never have a chance to breed are the reason. Nonregistered/CKC-registered 'designer breeders' who produce mass quantities of dubious animals are.

    I would not, by the way, necessarily recommend a Corgi for the OP--the behavior would probably work out, but Corgis have two shedding seasons, both six months long. The amount of hair is staggering.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    ...
    Purebred are not why there are so many dogs in shelters (let alone why there are so many mutts in shelters.) People who refuse to spay/neuter their unregistered, unworked/unshown pet-quality animals and don't take care to make sure the dogs never have a chance to breed are the reason. Nonregistered/CKC-registered 'designer breeders' who produce mass quantities of dubious animals are. ...
    This is my impression, though I haven't researched it. Puppy mills and dogs not spayed/neutered are the things that contribute to there being so many dogs without homes. Responsible breeders are not the problem as far as overpopulation is concerned (breed standards are a different issue.)

    I guess you could say that every dog adopted as a puppy from a breeder means a shelter dog without a home. But I just don't feel its up to me to be that judgmental on people who who decide for the breeder option. I'd rather just applaud everyone who gives a dog a good home.

    There are always hounds at the shelter I go to. I love them, but I always rule them out beforehand. I simply don't have the right situation for a hound. I know this because I've learned about hounds. Not to repeat myself but to repeat myself, so let me repeat myself, I think its really good to know ahead of time about breeds when adopting from a shelter because many of the dogs do display characteristics of breeds that are in their mix.

    The first dog I adopted from a shelter I didn't really know anything. We'd had a spaniel growing up so I was looking for something like that. There was a nice little 5 month old puppy there and my mother said, Oh that looks like our kind of dog. So home he came.

    He turned out to be a German Shorthair Pointer mix--this was obvious if you knew anything about breeds but then I didn't. And a GSD is nothing like a spaniel in terms of behavior even though both are sporting dogs.

    I loved him; he was the greatest companion for 15 years but I'd never adopt a GSD again. And a lot of people would not have kept him through the first two wild and crazy years, I'm quite sure.
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  6. #46

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    I saw a couple last night with a Weimaraner and a Hungarian Weimaraner. They made a gorgeous pair. I'm talking about the dogs. So jealous!

    To the OP, after your breed research, definitely go to the pound or local humane society. I have no statistics for this, but I think that mutts are healthier and hardier. Of course they may eat sticks and rocks like other dogs who end up at the vets, but you don't hear about them with displasia or other chronic disorders.

    It's good to see you are realistic about what you'd need.
    Keeper of Nathalie Pechelat's bitchface.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coco View Post

    To the OP, after your breed research, definitely go to the pound or local humane society. I have no statistics for this, but I think that mutts are healthier and hardier. Of course they may eat sticks and rocks like other dogs who end up at the vets, but you don't hear about them with displasia or other chronic disorders.
    That would be because no one tracks them. A dog who's half a breed prone to displasia can still get it, but no one keeps records on it. There's a myth that mutts are "healthier", but the reality is they get cancer, kidney failure, shorter/longer lifespans based on the breeds they come from just like any other dog can.

    Mutts can be great dogs. Mutts can be sickly or viscous dogs. The major difference is if you're getting the dog from someone who either doesn't know the history or hasn't spent a lot of time working with the dog, you can't predict its behavior or potential health risks based on knowledge of the breed. The average animal shelter doesn't have the time or resources to work extensively with each dog, so you are risking a lot on your own ability to assess the dog. The whole "gotta save 'em all" mentality regarding shelter dogs in recent years can lead to people winding up with dogs they don't know how to deal with that aren't appropriate for them.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    That would be because no one tracks them. A dog who's half a breed prone to displasia can still get it, but no one keeps records on it. There's a myth that mutts are "healthier", but the reality is they get cancer, kidney failure, shorter/longer lifespans based on the breeds they come from just like any other dog can.

    Mutts can be great dogs. Mutts can be sickly or viscous dogs. The major difference is if you're getting the dog from someone who either doesn't know the history or hasn't spent a lot of time working with the dog, you can't predict its behavior or potential health risks based on knowledge of the breed. The average animal shelter doesn't have the time or resources to work extensively with each dog, so you are risking a lot on your own ability to assess the dog. The whole "gotta save 'em all" mentality regarding shelter dogs in recent years can lead to people winding up with dogs they don't know how to deal with that aren't appropriate for them.
    Agree with this entire post. Would add that because people rescue dogs they cannot handle, some dogs wind up back in the shelter.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by danceronice View Post
    That would be because no one tracks them. A dog who's half a breed prone to displasia can still get it, but no one keeps records on it. There's a myth that mutts are "healthier", but the reality is they get cancer, kidney failure, shorter/longer lifespans based on the breeds they come from just like any other dog can.

    Mutts can be great dogs. Mutts can be sickly or viscous dogs. ...
    True. Its a nice myth about mutts being healthier but it really just depends. You can adopt a dog from a shelter and find it has a serious health problem. That's the case with my current dog. My last mutt/rescue dog died of kidney failure unexpectedly.

    The key thing is to know what you yourself are able to deal with, what kind of dog you can best provide for, how much risk you are able to take. Do a lot of research and thinking ahead of time. Go to a shelter if that's right for you, or a reputable breeder if that is what is right for you.

    If you are concerned about there being more dogs than homes, please have your dog spayed/neutered. Treat your dog as he/she deserves. These are the things that matter.
    Congratulations 2014 World Ice Dance Champions Anna Cappellini & Luca Lanotte!!!

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRidge View Post
    True. Its a nice myth about mutts being healthier but it really just depends. You can adopt a dog from a shelter and find it has a serious health problem. That's the case with my current dog. My last mutt/rescue dog died of kidney failure unexpectedly.

    The key thing is to know what you yourself are able to deal with, what kind of dog you can best provide for, how much risk you are able to take. Do a lot of research and thinking ahead of time. Go to a shelter if that's right for you, or a reputable breeder if that is what is right for you.

    If you are concerned about there being more dogs than homes, please have your dog spayed/neutered. Treat your dog as he/she deserves. These are the things that matter.
    A big problem is that many people impulsively buy or rescue a dog. Or they get pressured by their kids. Then it doesn't work out. So, the dog gets sent away. Too many people do not get that they need to choose a dog that is suitable for their lifestyle. Do they work long hours? Do they have children, and how old are they?

    My dog was not neutered until recently, he is 6 years old. We were considering showing him, but changed our minds. And, I had read some articles that neutering dogs can sometimes cause genetic health issues to occur at a younger age. My vet worked on that theory, at U. Penn Veterinary School. He said that it was inconclusive, but there is some merit to it. And, if the dog is behaving well, no reason to neuter him. We eventually did, because his prostrate became enlarged. Neutering resolved that. I think the biggest reason there are too many dogs are puppy mills, not owners neglecting neutering/spaying. The puppy mills fill a market. And people buy them. As long as people buy puppies bred in such appalling conditions, unhealthy and unstable dogs will wind up in shelters. Not saying that dogs bred by reputable breeders don't ever have health problems. But, they have a much better shot.

    Dogs are amazing animals. They love unconditionally. All you have to do is love them back .

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyrak View Post
    Hey, I'm owned by a schnoodle too! Great little dogs, mine is smart as a whip too....
    Quote Originally Posted by Bostonfan View Post
    I have a Schnauzer/Poodle mix and they are great dogs that meet most of your criteria. However, I use a doggy daycare if I'm going to be out longer than 4 hours at a time (I work partially from home, so that helps). I've never left my dog by herself for a full 8 hr work day, so I don't know how she would handle it. I also have a friend with a Havanese that also seems like it would be a good fit.
    I think I'm leaning towards Schnauzers. From what I can tell, they would be good inside the house as well as for allergies. I also read that their hair needs clipping only twice a year. Does that sound accurate? Also, do they do a lot of barking?

    Source: http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/standardschnauzer.htm

  12. #52

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    Have you considered a Shih Tzu? My sister has SO many allergies but she had owned Shih Tzus for years and has no reaction to them whatoever. An adult Shih Tzu weighs anywhere between 11-16 lbs. Yes, they do have long hair, which requires grooming. That may, or not may be, a problem for you. But, if it IS a problem, you can always keep the dog clipped in the "puppy cut," which is really cute (short). I think maintaining the "puppy cut" requires trimming 3-4 times a year. Shih Tzus have hair, not fur. They shed very little and have much less dander than most breeds. Just something to think about ....

  13. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRidge View Post
    This is my impression, though I haven't researched it. Puppy mills and dogs not spayed/neutered are the things that contribute to there being so many dogs without homes. Responsible breeders are not the problem as far as overpopulation is concerned (breed standards are a different issue.)

    I guess you could say that every dog adopted as a puppy from a breeder means a shelter dog without a home. But I just don't feel its up to me to be that judgmental on people who who decide for the breeder option. I'd rather just applaud everyone who gives a dog a good home.
    Well, plenty of people who adopt purebreds turn them into rescues as well.

    I got both of my two dogs from people who might be considered 'backyard breeders' since we couldn't afford the cost of a breeder. The first was a lab shepherd cross, the second a golden retriever without papers. The third dog was the puppy of my neighbours, who live in the basement suite - an odd mix of Sharpei, blue heeler and border collie. She was never intended to be my dog but was taken from her mom too young due to extenuating circumstances. She spent the first few weeks of her life with me and my other dog, and became my dog.

    I like to start out with a puppy because of the bonding that occurs. And I intend to get a puppy for my next dog - probably a golden from a breeder this time - because I really want to train a dog right for once. I didn't really formally train my first dog and got the second when the first was aging and having health problems. I didn't start training her formally (with a train) until she was 3, and never did get the desired results.

    Next time, I hope to get it right - and am holding off getting a puppy until I'm done working with the older dog, as my trainer suggests.

    I make no apologies for this. A dog of mine will never go to a shelter barring death or dismemberment, and that is one less dog in the shelter. And, I choose my breeds/mixes with care to make sure they fit with our lifestyle.

    The next puppy will probably be my last (I'm almost 55) and after that, I'll get older shelter dogs.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Japanfan View Post
    Well, plenty of people who adopt purebreds turn them into rescues as well.
    Oh, yes, you are right. That's why this is so important:

    I make no apologies for this. A dog of mine will never go to a shelter barring death or dismemberment, and that is one less dog in the shelter. And, I choose my breeds/mixes with care to make sure they fit with our lifestyle.


    The next puppy will probably be my last (I'm almost 55) and after that, I'll get older shelter dogs.
    I'm just the opposite (at the same general age). I think maybe I'll get a puppy when I retire because then I can devote time to it. I get older dogs in part because they are capable of spending more time alone and don't require the same amount of time for training.

    I have to say, though I strongly encourage anyone who can take on the expense to get a middle aged or older dog, that my experience has been that it will be costly in terms of vet care. The three middle aged/older dogs I've adopted have been the most wonderful dogs you can imagine but I'm on number three, and only had the other two 3-4 years each. Its definitely not for everyone. But if its for you, its more than worth it.

    ETA: ross_hy I don't have any personal experience with schnauzers, but I do know that in my neighborhood of apartments and working people, there are quite a few of them. They are lovely little dogs. Well I assume you mean the little ones. There's a giant schnauzer down the street from me too; the folks got it as a puppy and boy did they put a lot of work into her! But she's turned into a lovely, if BIG!, dog.
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  15. #55
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    My old skating coach had a mini-schnauzer (I think she was sort of...well, it started out as his mother's dog and he somehow wound up with it.) Dog thought it weighed 300 lbs and was a guard dog.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenya View Post
    I'm allergic to dogs as well and my family has had three Bichons over the years. The smallest one we had was only 6 pounds or so, but I think an average size for the breed is a little bigger. In my experience, they aren't the smartest breed, but ours were all very easygoing and incredibly sweet. I had a Bichon while living in an apartment by myself and had no problems - in my experience, they don't need a lot of exercise, are relatively quiet, and can be fairly low-energy. The best part about Bichons, in my opinion, is that they have great personalities and love people. My Bichon's favorite activity was sleeping on my lap.
    My parents have a bichon frise as well and they both work full time. Very cute little dog and again, hypoallergenic.

  17. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by cruisin View Post
    I think the biggest reason there are too many dogs are puppy mills, not owners neglecting neutering/spaying. The puppy mills fill a market. And people buy them.
    Um, no....

    It's difficult to get numbers because people have their agendas. Researchers at universities are less likely to have conflicts of interest, so I've relied on those papers for these statistics. All statistics are for the US in one year.

    Number of planned puppy births in private households (mostly breeders): 3.38 million
    Number of unplanned puppy births in private households: 2.60 million
    Number of puppies bought at pet shops (almost all puppy mills): 170,000

    Obviously, many dogs born at puppy mills never get a home. But if you do the math and compare the number of puppies bought at pet shops vs. the number of unplanned births in private households, that's a difference of 2.43 million. To calculate their numbers, puppy mills first estimate how many they can sell and go from there. For the number of puppy mill births to equal the number of unplanned private household births, puppy mills would have to produce 14 times more puppies than they can sell.

    Unwanted births from unspayed/unneutered kittens are an even bigger problem.

    Some places, like Santa Cruz County, require spaying/neutering unless you apply for an exemption certificate. In the ten years following the enactment of the law in Santa Cruz County, the number of dogs taken in by shelters decreased 65%.

    If you don't spay/neuter your pet, you better have a damn good reason for it.

  18. #58
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    Well, I've taken the next step. I applied to a couple of rescue groups about either a schnauzer or a bichon frise. The only reason I applied to two was because I applied to one before and they have never gotten back with me and balked about my lack of a yard. Therefore, I didn't want to put all of my eggs into one basket.

    Thanks for all the help on here! I'll keep you posted.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gazpacho View Post
    Number of planned puppy births in private households (mostly breeders): 3.38 million
    Number of unplanned puppy births in private households: 2.60 million
    Number of puppies bought at pet shops (almost all puppy mills): 170,000

    Obviously, many dogs born at puppy mills never get a home. But if you do the math and compare the number of puppies bought at pet shops vs. the number of unplanned births in private households, that's a difference of 2.43 million. To calculate their numbers, puppy mills first estimate how many they can sell and go from there. For the number of puppy mill births to equal the number of unplanned private household births, puppy mills would have to produce 14 times more puppies than they can sell.
    Pet store owners unfortunately keep the puppy mill business alive. The puppies at least get out and have a chance of a good life - it's the moms kept pregnant constantly, living their entire life in a tiny cage, that are truly heart-breaking.

    I believe that California does not allow pet stores to sell puppies. If pet store owners would stop using puppy mills, they would cease to survive. I've never understood how pet stores could support puppy mills. And there mark-up is already three times that of breeders some time. I know someone who spent $3000 on a young Pekingese puppy and $2000 on another that had been there six months. That poor puppy grew into a dog with a lot of problems.


    Some places, like Santa Cruz County, require spaying/neutering unless you apply for an exemption certificate. In the ten years following the enactment of the law in Santa Cruz County, the number of dogs taken in by shelters decreased 65%.
    That is a brilliant idea. More places should implement the same requirement.

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    [QUOTE=ross_hy;3940350]Well, I've taken the next step. I applied to a couple of rescue groups about either a schnauzer or a bichon frise. The only reason I applied to two was because I applied to one before and they have never gotten back with me and balked about my lack of a yard. Therefore, I didn't want to put all of my eggs into one basket.




    Good luck. Some breeders can be extremely rigid. A dog can do fine without a yard and at least the breeder doesn't have to worry that their puppy will become a backyard prisoner, as so many dogs do.

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