View Poll Results: Who should get which assignments?

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  • Both for Nagasu and Both for Edmunds

    31 30.10%
  • Nagasu Both, but not Edmunds

    16 15.53%
  • Nagasu for the Olympics but Edmunds for Sr. Worlds

    19 18.45%
  • Edmunds for the Olympics but Nagasu for Sr. Worlds

    14 13.59%
  • Edmunds Both, but not Nagasu

    29 28.16%
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  1. #1

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    UPDATED: Olympic and Sr. World Assignments, Edmunds and Nagasu

    Who should go to th'lympics and Worlds?

  2. #2
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    Both of them should go to both the Olympics and Worlds....

  3. #3

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    I think Nagasu has a chance at medaling at the Olympics but is too unpredictable to be used to secure a 3rd spot at Worlds.

    I think Polina has a chance at helping secure a 3rd spot at Worlds but has no chance at an Olympic medal.

    ... so Olympics for Nagasu but Worlds 1st alternate, and Edmunds for Sr. Worlds but Olympics 1st alternate.

    Both Nagasu and Polina should go to 4CC, while Wagner gets 4CC off to heal.

    -------------

    Summary-

    Wagner: Olympics, Worlds

    Nagasu: 4CC, Olympics

    Edmunds: 4CC, Sr. Worlds
    Last edited by bardtoob; 01-12-2014 at 08:01 AM.

  4. #4
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    I was sort of hoping Samantha Cesario and Courtney Hicks get 4CC...

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by bardtoob View Post
    Summary-

    Wagner: Olympics, Worlds

    Nagasu: 4CC, Olympics

    Edmunds: 4CC, Sr. Worlds
    The Olympic team members are not going to 4CCs. Too close to the Olympics.
    "Marge, if you're going to get mad at me every time I do something stupid, then I guess I'm just going to have to stop doing stupid things!" - Homer Simpson in the Mr. Plow episode

  6. #6
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    Honestly if Mirai shows up at the Olympics in just a bit better shape than she is now.. Olympic judges will want to reward her for Vancouver, she will have the support of the panel whether or not she's outskated by 5-6 people at her best. So theoretically yes she does have a medal chance, Polina does not no matter what. She has a ways to go to be in position for that chance (Mirai), but in a month of tunnel-vision from where she is now technically I think anything is possible. I (if you haven't guessed ) would choose Mirai for Sochi, Polina for Worlds. She can do both Jr and Sr Worlds to prepare for the big comp as well. Jr Worlds aren't until after the Olympics right? The timing of this all is just gah. If it were an option and not Shady, I would send Ashley to the team event in Sochi with Gracie. They are likely to medal there if all teammates do their job, then the top 3 for the individual competition. Since you can't do that someone really should be pulled for Ashley in both cases. Mirai was very close to Polina in both programs, and I think with Olympic panel judges they would've gone with Mirai with the same 4 performances given.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karpenko View Post
    Honestly if Mirai shows up at the Olympics in just a bit better shape than she is now.. Olympic judges will want to reward her for Vancouver, she will have the support of the panel whether or not she's outskated by 5-6 people at her best. So theoretically yes she does have a medal chance, Polina does not no matter what. She has a ways to go to be in position for that chance (Mirai), but in a month of tunnel-vision from where she is now technically I think anything is possible. I (if you haven't guessed ) would choose Mirai for Sochi, Polina for Worlds. She can do both Jr and Sr Worlds to prepare for the big comp as well. Jr Worlds aren't until after the Olympics right? The timing of this all is just gah. If it were an option and not Shady, I would send Ashley to the team event in Sochi with Gracie. They are likely to medal there if all teammates do their job, then the top 3 for the individual competition. Since you can't do that someone really should be pulled for Ashley in both cases. Mirai was very close to Polina in both programs, and I think with Olympic panel judges they would've gone with Mirai with the same 4 performances given.
    While I do think an international panel may have gone with Mirai. I don't see them wanting "to reward her for Vancover." I think the international judges were welling to do that at 2010 worlds and Mirai didn't deliver. And didn't deliver numerous times. Its not really like Mirai was robbed of anything in Vancover.

    I don't think the judges are going to necessarily feel necessary to place Mirai over someone like Julia. Who is skating well now.

  8. #8
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    Maybe not, but that would depend on her level of fitness by Sochi. Honestly that's all thats missing - a bit more endurance. The personality won't be as subdued then either, so it'll do a lot for the overall performance. The jumps and spins are back. I think since Yuna, Mao, and potentially Mirai are returning it will be a thought on the judges minds in close calls (the results of the previous Olympics), and also PCS for great performances. Mirai was the one talked about after the last Olympics as giving a medal worthy set of performances, it just happened to be on one of the best skated Olympic nights. The judges remember her as well as we do, there's no way they wouldn't.

    I'm going to refrain until the team is announced, I'm feeling crazy for caring this much about an Olympic figure skating team.

  9. #9
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    It's completely irrelevant which skater has or doesn't have a theoretical chance to medal or earn three spots. You pick rules and you stick to them. Otherwise you are playing with skaters' lives. It would be completely unfair to suddenly change the way you pick the team because the 'wrong' skater failed to meet the criteria. USFS couldn't officially state that Nationals' results are used to determine the Olympic team but that is their problem and they should have found a way around that.

    Do I think that Wagner is more deserving of Olympics than Nagasu? Yes, I do. Because she has had better results so far this season (and last season). Which is why USFS should have designed some kind of formula for rewarding more than one competition performance. But since they didn't and since they have always gone on Nationals in the past, Nagasu should be going to the Olympics and not Wagner.

    And how can anybody question Edmunds' spot is just beyond me. She has beaten Nagasu at Nationals and she has had better results so far this season. And yet some people want to send Nagasu over Edmunds to Olympics? Based on what grounds exactly?

    The team should be: Gold, Edmunds and Nagasu, per USFS' usual (unwritten) rules.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    It's completely irrelevant which skater has or doesn't have a theoretical chance to medal or earn three spots. You pick rules and you stick to them. Otherwise you are playing with skaters' lives. It would be completely unfair to suddenly change the way you pick the team because the 'wrong' skater failed to meet the criteria. USFS couldn't officially state that Nationals' results are used to determine the Olympic team but that is their problem and they should have found a way around that.

    Do I think that Wagner is more deserving of Olympics than Nagasu? Yes, I do. Because she has had better results so far this season (and last season). Which is why USFS should have designed some kind of formula for rewarding more than one competition performance. But since they didn't and since they have always gone on Nationals in the past, Nagasu should be going to the Olympics and not Wagner.

    And how can anybody question Edmunds' spot is just beyond me. She has beaten Nagasu at Nationals and she has had better results so far this season. And yet some people want to send Nagasu over Edmunds to Olympics? Based on what grounds exactly?

    The team should be: Gold, Edmunds and Nagasu, per USFS' usual (unwritten) rules.
    This x 1000.

    Any other decision not only plays with skaters' lives, it invites lawsuits. And it sets a horrible precedent for the future. What happens the next time one of the "favorites" going into Nationals doesnt medal? Do people start complaining - if Ashley made the team why cant X??? Where does it end?

    ITA - stick to the way you've always done things and save yourself a lot of headaches.

  11. #11
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    Goodness, I just glanced at the thread title at first and it read like Edmund/Nagasu were given the World and Olympic assignments - I missed the 'Update' and 'poll' part!

    Nagasu for Olympics. Edmunds for Worlds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheylana View Post
    The Olympic team members are not going to 4CCs. Too close to the Olympics.
    Ot but they've really got to do something about the timing of U.S. Nationals/4CCs in the Olympic year - I mean if 4CCs should get the same respect as Euros. I think the U.S. should do like Russia and Japan - hold Nationals earlier.
    Last edited by Sasha'sSpins; 01-12-2014 at 12:09 PM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    Nagasu for Olympics. Edmunds for Worlds.
    Again: How can you justify that when Edmunds has beaten Nagasu at Nationals and had better international results this season?

    (Furthermore if we look further back at Nagasu's competitive history, it's been far from stellar)

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    The team should be: Gold, Edmunds and Nagasu, per USFS' usual (unwritten) rules.
    After further thought, I agree with this. This would be the most fair result and Ashley only has herself to blame.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Again: How can you justify that when Edmunds has beaten Nagasu at Nationals and had better international results this season?

    (Furthermore if we look further back at Nagasu's competitive history, it's been far from stellar)
    Imo, Mirai should have placed second at these Nationals over Edmunds. Imo, Edmunds PCS scores were overboard. They should've been behind Ashley's as well imo. And Mirai has medalled every year at the Senior GPs. Edmunds has done well but only on the Junior circuit - so far. Mirai had the harder road competing against the likes of Mao, Akiko, Kostner and the Russians. Senior and Junior competition are NOT the same thing. Of course this is all JMO.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    Imo, Mirai should have placed second at these Nationals over Edmunds. Imo, Edmunds PCS scores were overboard.
    Nagasu should have got negative GOE for the jumps that she has cheated and between her poor choreography and stopping in the middle of the program to take a break, I don't see why she should have a significant advantage on the PCS.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    They should've been behind Ashley's as well imo.
    Wagner wasn't deducted appropriately for her double-footed jumps (it should be a -3 deduction).

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    And Mirai has medalled every year at the Senior GPs. Edmunds has done well but only on the Junior circuit - so far. Mirai had the harder road competing against the likes of Mao, Akiko, Kostner and the Russians. Senior and Junior competition are NOT the same thing.
    The judging system figure skating uses is IJS. Judges do not use ordinals any more and skaters don't compete against other skaters, as far as the judging system is concerned. They are judged for what perform on the ice. So it isn't really relevant whether the competition is junior or senior, since your points represent the elements that you have executed. And Edmund's results are higher. If anything PCS scores are lower at Junior events than they are at Senior events.

  16. #16
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    I think the best thing to do is send the top three to the Olympics. I'm heartbroken for Ashley, but I think sending the top three to the Olympics is fair. It keeps down confusion. Ashley just did not do her job. I think she should get worlds, but she may not want to go.

    Olympics - Gold, Edmunds, Nagasu

    Worlds- Gold, Edmunds, Wagner

    Four Continents- Cesario, Hicks, Miller

  17. #17
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    I agree that Mirai should have placed second. Very questionable judging.

    Anyway, as I said elsewhere, the Olympic team should be Gold, Wagner, and Nagasu. I'd probably send the same group to worlds.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Nagasu should have got negative GOE for the jumps that she has cheated and between her poor choreography and stopping in the middle of the program to take a break, I don't see why she should have a significant advantage on the PCS.

    Wagner wasn't deducted appropriately for her double-footed jumps (it should be a -3 deduction).

    The judging system figure skating uses is IJS. Judges do not use ordinals any more and skaters don't compete against other skaters, as far as the judging system is concerned. They are judged for what perform on the ice. So it isn't really relevant whether the competition is junior or senior, since your points represent the elements that you have executed. And Edmund's results are higher. If anything PCS scores are lower at Junior events than they are at Senior events.
    And once again I completely disagree with all of the above. Polina should have never gotten the PCS scores that she received in the SP and LP. Mirai should have won silver not bronze and Ashley should have been in third. I'll just leave it at that.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    And once again I completely disagree with all of the above. Polina should have never gotten the PCS scores that she received in the SP and LP. Mirai should have won silver not bronze and Ashley should have been in third.
    Let's say you scored Polina as skating on par with Cesario (even though Polina is quite a bit faster with much better technique and better basic skating) in PCS. Using Cesario's PCS scores for Polina would *still* have given Polina the win over Wagner because that's how great the technical score difference was between them. Heck, if you add up just the PCS scores for Wagner's LP and SP, she beat Polina. It's the technical score that decided the placements between the two.

    I don't know why people are so fixated on the PCS when that wasn't the deciding factor here. People are making emotional arguments for their favorites which simply aren't grounded in reality. Somehow I doubt the USFSA will do the same (as they've never chosen to do so before, but we will see).

  20. #20
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    I think Wagner will be sent to both Olympics and Worlds. Edmunds will also be sent to both since she came 2nd. Since Nagasu finished 3rd with Wagner finishing 4th, she will be the one bumped for both.

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