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  1. #41
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    Fratianne and to a lesser degree Sumners still bring up losing the gold constantly, like they cant get over it. I am not saying they should feel that way but they obviously do. Fratianne especialy has a majorly crummy attitude, and Sumners in her Fire on Ice profile seemed to blame lots of things for not skating better or winning.

  2. #42
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    If we look at SPs only (they do get medals, don't they?), one of the most unexpected and joyful 2nd places has to be this one from 1993 Europeans.
    Oula Jääskeläinen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yXz10XZ1_M

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheIronLady View Post
    I recall Petrova and Tikhonov similarly said they should have been the winners of the bronze at the 2002 Olympics in pairs, and they blamed the competition being held in the USA somehow. These are two of the most ridiculous claims I have heard.

    Since Slutskaya stayed home from 2003 worlds, Sokolova had some support on the 100% anonymous panel as the Russian favorite. She was also fortunate that Cohen, Hughes, Arakawa, Volchkova, and even Suguri skated relatively poorly.
    Petrova Tikhonov surely said they deserved the bronze at 2002 Worlds, I never heard them saying it for the Olympics (even though it can be possible).

    The most embarrassing thing at 2003 worlds is when Bourne Kraatz won with 5 judges against 9 and an empty program (russian style ! )... Tell me it wasn't manipulated ! Also the crowd reaction to L/A FD was pretty unfair.

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nours View Post
    Petrova Tikhonov surely said they deserved the bronze at 2002 Worlds, I never heard them saying it for the Olympics (even though it can be possible).

    The most embarrassing thing at 2003 worlds is when Bourne Kraatz won with 5 judges against 9 and an empty program (russian style ! )... Tell me it wasn't manipulated ! Also the crowd reaction to L/A FD was pretty unfair.
    Pet-Tik have been very classy throughout their career. If they said they deserved the bronze, I am sure it was for worlds 2002 where I&Z skated very poorly (multiple mistakes) and were given a bronze over Pet-Tiks whose only mistake was on a sbs jump. I am even surprised if Pet-Tik actually said that, but they may have. We don't know the context, however.

    L&A's FD in 2003 was actually pretty good. I think the general perception was that it was B&K's turn, after beind denied for years (they did not actually deserve to win in prior years, but this one was close enough to be justified.). It is embarrassing when the crowd is mean to a skater because of the nationality issue. B&K are not US citizens, but I am sure the US crowd adopted them, just like they adopted S&P during the 2002 Olympics. Also it's possible that there was a large number of Canadians in attendance, and I can't fault them for cheering on B&K. I still like the crowd to be polite toward the competitors.

  5. #45
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    Petrova & Tikhonov were denied the bronze medal at worlds in 1999 (I still remember the polish couple completely missing the death spiral in the FS) and 2002 but they were classy about it. I still follow their career closely and I never read or heard a single interview of theirs in which they mentioned the 2002 olympics.

  6. #46
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    Bourne and Kraatz definitely deserved to win the 2003 Worlds even though their program wasn't that original, and not one of their best. That FD Lobacheva and Averbukh skated in those neon green costumes to rock and roll music was probably their worst FD, and one of the worst FDs by a top couple EVER.

  7. #47
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    Even if Petrova & Tikhonov had said they deserved the bronze at the 2002 Olympics it wouldnt be that ridiculous of them to say. Shen & Zhao did not skate well in their LP and were hugely gifted with the scores like they often were in their careers. Totmianina & Marinin who were supposed to win the bronze if Shen & Zhao screwed up also didnt skate very well that night, although they were mostly clean there were alot of small and grating mistakes and they were well below their Europeans level. Ina & Zimmerman skated very well without outstanding technical content and some small mistakes though. Petrova & Tikhonov cleanly delivered by far the hardest program of all those teams. One could argue any order of the teams from 3-6.

  8. #48
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    I actually thought back then that Pet&Tik should have been 3rd or 4th, but I haven't seen their performance or any of them other than B&S and S&P in a long time so I can't really judge now.. knowing more about skating now than I did in '02 my answer might be different.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nours View Post
    Petrova Tikhonov surely said they deserved the bronze at 2002 Worlds, I never heard them saying it for the Olympics (even though it can be possible).

    The most embarrassing thing at 2003 worlds is when Bourne Kraatz won with 5 judges against 9 and an empty program (russian style ! )... Tell me it wasn't manipulated ! Also the crowd reaction to L/A FD was pretty unfair.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    Pet-Tik have been very classy throughout their career. If they said they deserved the bronze, I am sure it was for worlds 2002 where I&Z skated very poorly (multiple mistakes) and were given a bronze over Pet-Tiks whose only mistake was on a sbs jump. I am even surprised if Pet-Tik actually said that, but they may have. We don't know the context, however.

    L&A's FD in 2003 was actually pretty good. I think the general perception was that it was B&K's turn, after beind denied for years (they did not actually deserve to win in prior years, but this one was close enough to be justified.). It is embarrassing when the crowd is mean to a skater because of the nationality issue. B&K are not US citizens, but I am sure the US crowd adopted them, just like they adopted S&P during the 2002 Olympics. Also it's possible that there was a large number of Canadians in attendance, and I can't fault them for cheering on B&K. I still like the crowd to be polite toward the competitors.
    L/A's FD was so aimed at the judges and a majority of the audience was on the other side. They didn't react to the dance because L/A didn't give them a dance to react to. It was all about hiding Lobacheva's (injury-triggered) weaknesses.

    I think that Denkova/Staviski actually had more of a claim on gold than L/A or B/K, but I'm fine with B/K winning.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by poirierpaul View Post
    Fratianne and to a lesser degree Sumners still bring up losing the gold constantly, like they cant get over it. I am not saying they should feel that way but they obviously do. Fratianne especialy has a majorly crummy attitude, and Sumners in her Fire on Ice profile seemed to blame lots of things for not skating better or winning.
    Although I haven't seen the Fire on Ice docu, it always seemed to me that Sumners was angry at herself for not winning gold because of her errors. She clearly did not deserve to win over Witt with those last missed jumps. Witt was on in that LP and it was much better than her 88 program.

  11. #51
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    Yeah I agree Roz was angry at herself and knows it was her errors that lost her the gold, and that it was the right result given their performances. However she also seems to be blaming outside factors to why she made those mistakes, blaming her coach for looking like she had given up after seeing Witt's skate, blaming being upset about her short program scores, blaming feeling a vibe TPTB wanted a Witt win. It came across as a bit of sour grapes or excuse making in that sense. She should just say she choked, flat out admit it, as that is clearly what happened, and can the silly excuses.

  12. #52

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    When you see how Linda and Roz handled their disappointing silver medals, you cannot help admiring the classiness of Michelle Kwan after she lost the gold to Tara, even though she skated very well and clean.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    Pet-Tik have been very classy throughout their career. If they said they deserved the bronze, I am sure it was for worlds 2002 where I&Z skated very poorly (multiple mistakes) and were given a bronze over Pet-Tiks whose only mistake was on a sbs jump. I am even surprised if Pet-Tik actually said that, but they may have. We don't know the context, however...
    I think TheIronLady is having dementia and her memory of things read back in 2002 cannot be relied on. I checked sources and the only complaining from Petrova/Tikhonov circa 2002 was--as you corrected me-- about the 2002 worlds held in Nagano, Japan. They said they would have been in the medals had the Russian federation promoted them. I stand corrected, and based on the following link they probably never said anything disgruntled about the Olympics being in the United States. My apologies to Petrova and Tikhonov.

    2002 Petrova/Tikhonov comments on Judging

    While we are at it, I do not recall ever reading anything from Sokolova complaining about the 2003 worlds results, so I wonder how accurate that post was. It sounds possible, but with how well Kwan skated, I am surprised that Elena complained about her silver.
    Last edited by TheIronLady; 05-07-2013 at 06:48 AM.

  14. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheIronLady View Post
    While we are at it, I do not recall ever reading anything from Sokolova complaining about the 2003 worlds results, so I wonder how accurate that post was. It sounds possible, but with how well Kwan skated, I am surprised that Elena complained about her silver.
    http://ptichkafs.livejournal.com/34133.html

    “S”: Were the judges often unfair to you?

    Unfortunately, that happened many times. For example, at the 2003 World champions, I came in second after Michelle Kwan. I am absolutely certain that I should have won, because I skated significantly better than Kwan. It’s not just my opinion, but that of many world specialists as well. However, the championships took place in the US, so the judges chose not to deprive the American darling of the golden award. I, therefore, ended up in second. There are many other examples, but I won’t go there. You must admit it’s not the best memories.

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    I'd be really curious to know who were the many world specialists who said that Elena skated SIGNIFICANTLY better than Michelle and should have won the 2003 championships.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by kukkura View Post
    If we look at SPs only (they do get medals, don't they?), one of the most unexpected and joyful 2nd places has to be this one from 1993 Europeans.
    Oula Jääskeläinen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yXz10XZ1_M
    Those 1993 Europeans were crazy !
    The winner was so unexpected, and he just finished in 3rd in the LP (IIRC).
    Anyway, the winner of the silver medal overall was really, really happy with it !

    Quote Originally Posted by VarBar View Post
    I'd be really curious to know who were the many world specialists who said that Elena skated SIGNIFICANTLY better than Michelle and should have won the 2003 championships.
    Mishin ? Kudriavtsev ?

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by briancoogaert View Post
    Mishin ? Kudriavtsev ?
    Maybe but is two specialists (accidentally her coaches) 'many world specialists'? Then, Elena says the judges were unfair to her MANY times. One time I remember is the 2003 Europeans where some people thought she should have won the gold because Irina fell on a jump combination but no other time comes to mind. Was Sokolova really one of the most robbed skaters in the history of the sport?

  18. #58
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    I've never heard a skater's comment so brash as Elena's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blue_idealist View Post
    Bourne and Kraatz definitely deserved to win the 2003 Worlds even though their program wasn't that original, and not one of their best. That FD Lobacheva and Averbukh skated in those neon green costumes to rock and roll music was probably their worst FD, and one of the worst FDs by a top couple EVER.
    I actually thought Denkova & Staviski deserved to win the worlds that year. Both their OD and FD were far more difficult. And I also think their deep knees and edges are superior to that of Bourne & Kraatz.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by VarBar View Post
    Maybe but is two specialists (accidentally her coaches) 'many world specialists'? Then, Elena says the judges were unfair to her MANY times. One time I remember is the 2003 Europeans where some people thought she should have won the gold because Irina fell on a jump combination but no other time comes to mind. Was Sokolova really one of the most robbed skaters in the history of the sport?
    Definitely not.
    2003 Euros the probably the most controversial to me. But maybe she is also talking about her being left from russian team many times.
    Between 1999 and 2002, she went to many GPF, but never Worlds. I guess this situation was not easy to live.

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