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  1. #81
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    She probably knew better but tried to speak up for her team (annoyingly so - like you said, who did she think she was fooling?) anyways. I don't know what else she could've expected. Even their FD sucked as it was danced almost entirely side by side.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by gk_891 View Post
    She probably knew better but tried to speak up for her team (annoyingly so - like you said, who did she think she was fooling?) anyways. I don't know what else she could've expected. Even their FD sucked as it was danced almost entirely side by side.
    B&Ks programs that season would have been absolutely fabulous exhibition programs though. Competitive, not so much.

    One thing to keep is mind is ice dancing was so protocal and rank based back then. So while I dont think in anyway B&K were robbed that season from their and their camps perspective they had always beaten A&P since the 96 Worlds, had pulled well away from them in the judges scores and rank since then, and beat them that season at the GPF too. All the indications they were getting was they should expect to beat them, whether deserved or not. So I can understand their shock to the system when in Nagano it was clear from the start things were different.

    They had also come closer to K&O at the end of the 97 season, beating them at the GPF in Canada, and narrowly losing to them at Worlds. With K&O sitting out some of and avoiding G&P much of that season, and B&K meeting G&P twice, they seemed to have deluded themselves they were even now the closest rivals of G&P and were suddenly above K&O. As a Canadian I saw them state so many times on profiles and interviews, and special note was made of Pasha mocking the idea (turns out while the Canadians made her out to be trolling, she was right all along). So Nagano was a shock to their system.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    ... I always wondered what made this [G/P 94 Olympic win] possible. Was it:

    1. G&P really improved that much in just one season.
    Actually, I think they did look a lot sharper plus had more appealing material. I mentioned upthread I thought , when watching 93 Worlds that G/P's dance looked harder. I think their presentation was not yet up to the gold standard in 93 and they seemed a lot smoother the next season.

    2. The judges finally clued into G&P and their superior technical abilities vs U&Z and rewarded them, after seemingly being oblivious to it for 2 years.
    Are you forgetting the 6 suspended judges who had them second in 93? I'm pretty sure those judges did see their technical strength, so it isn't really finally. In any other discipline, we would not find it odd for one year's silver to win gold the next.

    4. Something happened in Russia that made U&Z lose their status as Russian #1 to G&P. Something the U&Z camp did that really pissed off some of the higher ups, or something else.
    My guess is they saw saw G/P as the next champions anyway and started to push them a year early when they saw the effect U/Z marriage troubles were having on their skating. Maybe they were afraid T&D could beat U/Z so they pushed the team that was so different from T&D, with the more obvious speed and technical fireworks. If it was deliberate, it was a shrewd move by the Russian fed. By having the younger skaters win in 94, they were setting themselves up for 4 more years of titles and a second Olympic gold. (Of course, they may have won 94 Worlds anyway after U/Z and T/D dropped out and still won everything for the next 4 year either way, but there were still the Finns and the Canadians were already starting a big push for their youngsters Bourne & Kraatz.)

    5. U&Z were on such a massive decline with their marital spat and coaching problems and other issues, that they lost some of the very things that made them special in the first place (especially their previously sensual on ice chemistry,
    Also some of this. After Four Seasons and Blues for Kluk, I remember being so disappointed when I first saw that Nino Rota number.
    Last edited by Susan M; 04-29-2013 at 06:54 AM.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by gk_891 View Post
    I remember Platov once said that Dubova was a phenomenal technical coach, much more so than either Linichuk or Tarasova. It's too bad she couldn't really help B&K with that. Her work had started to become very disappointing mid-90s onwards.
    Platov always said you could tell a "Dubova blade."

    Quote Originally Posted by gk_891 View Post
    G/P denied that Linichuk choreographed The Feeling Begins although Linichuk tried to take credit for it.
    Linichuk sued them over the choreography and unpaid coaching fees, and they settled in arbitration for about half what she asked. The story has been relayed on FSU as Linichuk suing over the choreography and winning, but I've not seen a primary source saying that. Could be that Linichuk simply had a contract that said whatever was created on her ice, under her watch, was her choreography, even if G&P did everything while she watched out the corner of her eye. TFB was sufficiently different from her other work with G&P, and she was disinterested enough in them by then, that I really doubt she put it together.

    The story I heard (and who knows what's true) is that she really wanted to get rid of them after 95-96 because she wanted to lead K/O to gold. She talked about leading them to gold as early as 95. And after the 96 Worlds, she basically left them on their own. When asked why Linichuk would do such a terrible thing, her old coach Elena Chaikovskaya (who ironically became G/P's advisor in 97 and 98) said that G/P could be 10 time world and Olympic champion and it wouldn't matter because they were a team put together by another trainer (Dubova). I had also once read that at the 97 European, the Russian skating federation had released some sort of statement that Linichuk had done everything possible to push G/P into the professional ranks and basically left them in the cold. But like I said, I'm not 100 percent sure as to what's true and not true.
    FWIW, that's how Grishuk feels about it. I know she doesn't have credibility with everyone, though. Here's what she said: G: That's actually the reason we had to change our coach. We were afraid that if we didn't do that quickly, the placement might have been switched, not because we were weaker but because that's how the coach wanted it. It was better for the coach to have a new champion at every Olympics. It shows that she can make anybody a champion. At the Worlds in 1996, our coach at the time said at the press conference that her bet is on the other team to win the next Olympics. When I found out about it, it was a big shock. That's why we switched to Tatiana (Tarasova).

    I also have some tapes with G&P skating at the gala at 1995 Worlds, and the commentary mentioning their retirement was already announced. So I guess Linichuk's plan nearly worked. I also read that she urged Kostomarov to dump Navka in 1999... great thinking there!


    Another interesting tidbit I had once read was that Linichuk was once coached by a young Dubova back in the late 70s. But she left her to study under Chaikovskaya. Funny how they're all so intertwined in many ways.
    Didn't know that.

    We're far from the topic of 92 Worlds now, but you all might be interested in this article: http://ptichkafs.livejournal.com/48979.html The juiciest tidbit to me was tat Ovsiannikov first skated with Kustarova's daughter, and they stole him away for Krylova.

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by falling_dance View Post
    It appears that they finished 24th in the original dance at 1994 Worlds and then withdrew.
    Exactly! K/f were totally still in the medal hunt at 1994 worlds but then some awful disaster hit them in the od and they fell all the way to 24th!! That's totally worse than just a fall that's like not doing any elements lol!!!

  6. #86
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    In that translation linked above, it was mentioned that Krylova broke her arm at 1994 Worlds. That may explain it.

  7. #87
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    I remember the CBC coverage just mentioned they had pulled out of Worlds with her broken arm. They didnt even mention them skating the OD, and I had no idea until now they even had. Either way their decline that season was swift. They went from World bronze medalists to 6th at the Olympics, and even 6th at Europeans. They were tied for 4th after the CDs at Worlds, but that just meant they were sliding back even more, as they were tied with the team that was only 7th at the Olympics and Europeans. The broken arm was probably the last straw for Anjelika to ditch him. I felt badly for him as he seemed like a really good guy, and wasnt an obvious weak link in the team like some men, but in retrospect it was a smart move on her part. I dont think they were done just because of a bad 94 season and they may well have recovered some momentum and risen again in the future, but Oleg is a much stronger skater, dancer, and performer than he is, and a better match and more striking chemistry with her on the ice.

  8. #88
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    I had once read that Linichuk really had to convince Krylova to skate with Ovsiannikov because she had been very happy skating with Fedorov all those years. And according to Fedorov (in an interview I read years ago), Linichuk wanted to pair him up with a Japanese lady but he refused. But like you said, it was a better move on her part to skate with Oleg as he was indeed superior to Vladimir.

  9. #89
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    Pitchkafs

    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post
    Platov always said you could tell a "Dubova blade."


    We're far from the topic of 92 Worlds now, but you all might be interested in this article: http://ptichkafs.livejournal.com/48979.html The juiciest tidbit to me was tat Ovsiannikov first skated with Kustarova's daughter, and they stole him away for Krylova.
    What ever happened to Pitchkafs? I've been missing his livejournal for almost 2 years.

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