View Poll Results: Where would clean Kwan have placed at the 2010 Olympics

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  • gold

    18 13.04%
  • silver

    17 12.32%
  • bronze

    17 12.32%
  • no medal

    86 62.32%
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  1. #1
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    Where would 29 year old Kwan have placed at 2010 Olympics skating cleanly

    Sorry I meant a poll with this last time but it didnt work. I am certain a clean Kwan would have won the 2010 Olympics, even at 29.

  2. #2

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    For me, the Kwan "what ifs" end at the 2006 Olympics. I wouldn't know how to vote.

  3. #3
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    Kwan did not compete at all from 2006-on, so this is really the most speculative "what if" poll out there. I'm a huge Kwan fan, but I'm no dummy. I doubt at age 29 if she would have been able to land a 3/3 or even a 2/3 needed to maximize her points with the allowed number of jumping passes, or could have somehow improved her spins to the point to be competitive with skaters much younger than her, and do a routine that would have impressed the judges. She's not Plushenko who landed quads in his prime. I will say that the 2010 COP would have been kinder to her than the 2006 one was.

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    She said she was training a sp but what were the jumps in it? I haven't read what the jumps were. You can only assume 2a. If the others were 3lz 2t and 3t or loop doubt she wold have medaled.

  5. #5
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    You have to wonder if Kwan was even competitive for a medal in 2006. By only the luck of the competition in Torino, neither Slutskaya and Cohen skated their best in the free, and despite winning, Shizuka Arakawa didn't include either 3/3 she was planning.

    As much as I love her skating by then Kwan hadn't included a 3/3 since 2002, was no longer doing the 3 loop, and did more 5 triple than 6 triple programs (usually doubling the second lutz) after 2004.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by essence_of_soy View Post
    You have to wonder if Kwan was even competitive for a medal in 2006. By only the luck of the competition in Torino, neither Slutskaya and Cohen skated their best in the free, and despite winning, Shizuka Arakawa didn't include either 3/3 she was planning.

    As much as I love her skating by then Kwan hadn't included a 3/3 since 2002, was no longer doing the 3 loop, and did more 5 triple than 6 triple programs (usually doubling the second lutz) after 2004.
    I always believed she would have been battling with Suguri for 4th place at the 2006 Olympics. Which is one reason as a Kwan fan I was relieved she didnt skate (although sad for her also) as I am not sure how much I would enjoyed seeing her in such a diminished position, even in what turned out to be a lackluster event.

    As for 2010 I doubt even she was ever seriously considering a comeback, and thank goodness after seeing the Vancouver Games she didnt even try. Her placing would probably have been something on par with where she might have finished at the Lillehammer Olympics (but a less happy one than Lillehammer where she would have been overjoyed just to be there rather than the disgraced Harding).

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanlysacek View Post
    I am certain a clean Kwan would have won the 2010 Olympics, even at 29.
    Troll alert. Check their other posts everyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by essence_of_soy View Post
    You have to wonder if Kwan was even competitive for a medal in 2006. By only the luck of the competition in Torino, neither Slutskaya and Cohen skated their best in the free, and despite winning, Shizuka Arakawa didn't include either 3/3 she was planning.

    As much as I love her skating by then Kwan hadn't included a 3/3 since 2002, was no longer doing the 3 loop, and did more 5 triple than 6 triple programs (usually doubling the second lutz) after 2004.
    I agree that Gold in 2006 would have been unlikely for Kwan on most nights (it just so happened that everyone did badly at that Olympics) but people forget that she barely lost the Worlds bronze medal by half a point. Jenny Kirk went on tour with Michelle after those championships and said Michelle skated her competitive long program (Bolero) every night when most skaters were doing simple show programs and Jenny never saw her miss a single jump during the entire tour. That's a 6 triple program. Her consistency was unrivaled, it just seems that her body couldn't hold up any longer after that year.

    And of course we can always rely on Sasha to fall, and a 2006 Carolina wouldn't have necessarily been a threat to Kwan on most nights either. I think a bronze medal would've been realistic for Kwan in 2006.
    Last edited by iarispiralllyof; 04-04-2013 at 11:15 PM.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by essence_of_soy View Post
    You have to wonder if Kwan was even competitive for a medal in 2006. By only the luck of the competition in Torino, neither Slutskaya and Cohen skated their best in the free, and despite winning, Shizuka Arakawa didn't include either 3/3 she was planning.

    As much as I love her skating by then Kwan hadn't included a 3/3 since 2002, was no longer doing the 3 loop, and did more 5 triple than 6 triple programs (usually doubling the second lutz) after 2004.
    At the 2005 Spring Marshalls Competition after Worlds, Kwan performed Bolero with two landed 3Lz and two landed 3F, which she had never done before, which clearly indicating she was still looking for future point maximizing options.

    She continued to practice 3/3 to the end of 2004, which is why she starting doing the 3S in combo.
    Last edited by bardtoob; 04-04-2013 at 11:27 PM.

  9. #9
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    May I say I'm that some voted for Gold? Seriously, if we repeat this poll in 2022 asking if Michelle might have won gold that year when still competing, then I guess some dye heart fans will still vote for gold.

  10. #10
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    Even Michelle at her prime wouldn't have beaten Yuna - she was on fire

  11. #11
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    Deleted. Duplicate post.

  12. #12
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    Since this thread is about Michelle, today the cartoon show "Arthur" reran the 2001 episode about Michelle Kwan. In the middle there was feature showing 16 year old Jenny Kirk talking about how she got into skating and also praising Michelle. Boy, Jenny looked and sounded way younger than 16 in that piece. It was neat to see the skating though & I was going to post it on her podcast thread here but saw there was an open one about MK.

  13. #13
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    If it had been Yu Na and Kwan in 1998 with no Tara, Kwan still wouldn't have won gold. And if Tara had been there I'd have put my money on Yu Na. It blows my mind that 4 people actually think Kwan could have beat that.

  14. #14

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    If you had asked 2006, I would have said gold with her usual 6 to 7 triple program at her best, especially if she had her 3toe-3toe. But 2010? No medal, program components had changed too much for her usual program to be truly competitive.

    One sad irony of Kwan's Olympic career is that the 2 times she competed she got beaten by younger skaters who skated lights out technically. The year she had to withdraw she got beaten by Arakawa with 5 triples and no 3-3 in the same year that both Sasha and Irina also skated subpar (no offense meant to Shizuka here). It just wasn't in the cards for her to be an Olympic champion, but she had a far more memorable career than any of them in her era, save perhaps Yu Na, and even then, I'd call it a tie at best.
    "Once you've skated together long enough, and you're really good friends, you can close your eyes, put your hand out and she's right there." Joe Dolkiewicz, 2011 US Novice Pairs Bronze Medalist

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yazmeen View Post
    It just wasn't in the cards for her to be an Olympic champion, but she had a far more memorable career than any of them in her era, save perhaps Yu Na, and even then, I'd call it a tie at best.
    Yu Na and Kwan are definitely not of the same era. Kim's first year of Senior competition was the year after Kwan's last year of Senior competition (which she didnt even compete once in anyway).

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yazmeen View Post
    but she had a far more memorable career than any of them in her era, save perhaps Yu Na, and even then, I'd call it a tie at best.
    I still don't think Yu Na can compare to Kwan's legacy. Not yet. The Olympic gold counts for a lot but Yu Na has 2 world titles and the Olympic gold. Kwan has 5 World titles (plus 4 other medals) and even without the Olympic gold she still has 2 Olympic medals. That completely trumps what Yu Na has done so far. Yu Na has a great chance to make a huge move by winning another Olympic gold but I think Yu Na has a lot to make up because Kwan simply never stopped competing (and winning) whereas Yu Na has phoned it in at one Worlds and skipped another. It just doesn't feel as dominant when someone hasn't been a constant on the scene. I will have to re-evaluate after Sochi, of course. Maybe as a Kwan fan I have learned not to put so much importance on Olympic gold.
    -Brian
    "Michelle would never be caught with sausage grease staining her Vera Wang." - rfisher

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by michiruwater View Post
    If it had been Yu Na and Kwan in 1998 with no Tara, Kwan still wouldn't have won gold. And if Tara had been there I'd have put my money on Yu Na. It blows my mind that 4 people actually think Kwan could have beat that.
    I am sure those people are not taking this poll seriously,

    ::goes and votes for kwan::


  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by michiruwater View Post
    If it had been Yu Na and Kwan in 1998 with no Tara, Kwan still wouldn't have won gold. And if Tara had been there I'd have put my money on Yu Na. It blows my mind that 4 people actually think Kwan could have beat that.
    They make about as much sense as you transplanting Yuna back to 1998 when she was 7 years old under a totally different judging and skating system with different standards yet somehow with the same skillset and program layout as a 19 year old 2010 Yuna under IJS.

  19. #19
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    Yes, I was obviously talking about a 7-year-old Yu Na beating Kwan. You got me.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by michiruwater View Post
    Yes, I was obviously talking about a 7-year-old Yu Na beating Kwan. You got me.
    You missed the point entirely. Your wild speculation of how Yuna would've done in 1998 involves a skillset and program layout that she developed in a totally different era. It makes no sense. It's a sport, it's supposed to progress. It's like ZOMG Yuna would've beaten Sonia Henie at all 3 of her Olympics since she did a 3-3 and Sonia didn't zomg lolz!!!
    Last edited by iarispiralllyof; 04-05-2013 at 03:45 AM.

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