View Poll Results: What medal if any will Bobrova & Soloviev win at the 2014 Olympics

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  • Gold

    4 4.00%
  • Silver

    1 1.00%
  • Bronze

    67 67.00%
  • No medal

    28 28.00%
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  1. #21
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    Yes, they will get the bronze. This is after all ice dance, Olympics and Russia.

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by IceIceBaby View Post
    Yes, they will get the bronze. This is after all ice dance, Olympics and Russia.
    So how do you explain them getting the bronze at worlds in Canada?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    I would give the bronze odds of the team for next year at this point:

    Bobrova & Soloviev- 40%
    Weaver & Poje- 27%
    Capellini & Lanotte- 23%
    Pechalat & Bourzat- 8%
    Chock & Bates- 1.5%
    All others combined- 0.5%
    Out of curiosity, why do you give W&P so much higher a chance than P&B?

    Also, if I&K actually get their shit together and have good programs (yes I know, two big "ifs"), why wouldn't they be a factor? Even with their shitty FD they almost won Euros when they skated it well. It seems like when they actually deliver, the judges go for it. I don't see that changing next year.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by nuge View Post
    I don't agree .I expect Nathalie/Fabian to come back fighting again in the new season like they did after losing to S/S.
    Their placement was due to the injury. They were having an exceptional season being the solid third couple up until then.I wouldn't say they are dumped at all but will be competing against B/S W/P .I can't see C/L moving up yet she still has not great edges and they still skate small.
    Where are all P/B fans ?
    B/S could have a good shot for bronze yes but I would say let's see how they all do in the GP and then we can get a better indication.
    As much as I love P/B and as much as I think they'll fight like hell next season, I think they're toast given current ice dance politics. Honestly, everyone already knows who's going to be on the podium and what the order will be. They could mail the medals out tomorrow if they wanted to.

  5. #25

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    Golver is like VMDW but bronze is anybody's!!!

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by casken View Post
    Out of curiosity, why do you give W&P so much higher a chance than P&B?

    Also, if I&K actually get their shit together and have good programs (yes I know, two big "ifs"), why wouldn't they be a factor? Even with their shitty FD they almost won Euros when they skated it well. It seems like when they actually deliver, the judges go for it. I don't see that changing next year.
    Weaver & Poje had a much worse injury and were in a far more difficult situation to even make it to Worlds than P&B and they still outskated them and beat them. P&B have benefited the last year and half from some protocal/ranking judging but now having dropped to 6th at Worlds, even if not skating at their best, and a bunch of younger teams now ranked higher than them, I see their PCS dropping down in relation to the other teams and them starting to be dumped somewhat, even when they return to top form.

    As for I&K I think this year was their window to try and take over the Russian #1, and it was kind of open for this year, but after B&S winning a medal at Worlds and I&K having a horrible result at Worlds (finishing behind the Shibutanis, lol) I think they will have to wait until after Sochi to even have a chance at challenging for the Russian #1 position again.

  7. #27
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    P&B have benefited the last year and half from some protocal/ranking judging
    Have they? I'm trying to think of the events they skated in in the past year and a half where it was clear they were getting results they shouldn't be and I'm drawing a blank.

    As for I&K, I just can't see if I&K actually deliver, them being stuck behind techincally inferior teams (IMO of course) like W&P and C&L.

  8. #28
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    I personally love Bobrova and Soloviev and think that it would be amazing for them to get to experience being on the podium in Sochi. I think that another year with Zhulin will make them improve even more. They are such hard workers, and this seems like a very promising partnership.
    Personally I think that they are much better than CL who I find pretty bland both on TV and live. I do think that Pechalat and Bourzat are better skaters than them right now, but that may change after more time with Zhulin.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by casken View Post
    Have they? I'm trying to think of the events they skated in in the past year and a half where it was clear they were getting results they shouldn't be and I'm drawing a blank.

    As for I&K, I just can't see if I&K actually deliver, them being stuck behind techincally inferior teams (IMO of course) like W&P and C&L.
    Many thought W&P skated better than P&B at the 2012 Worlds, and almost all certainly felt they had the stronger OD there (FD is debateable) but they even finished a couple points below in that phase. The GPF last season even more felt W&P were stronger. This season I wouldnt say P&B had any wrong results but the PCS gap on the ones behind them was a bit on the generous side. Either way I have a feeling their scores next season will be more on the stingy side than the generous side, lets put it that way. The next generation are moving in, a Russian team is now ranked 3rd in the World in a year before the Olympics will be in Russia, and I dont see the judges being enthusiastic about giving any help to an aging team who will never be a remote challenge to the likes of V&M and D&W, and who were 6th at the recent Worlds, with all the interesting younger teams who will be around over the next quad, now making their move. Their PCS at Worlds were right in line with B&S and a notch above the others I mentioned, but next year I have a feeling their PCS will not be on par with B&S, and more likely in line with C&L and W&P (or even a notch behind W&P depending how much they improve with a healthy off season and better programs). We will see though.

    As for I&K in what way are they superior to W&P. OK I admit I am a fan of W&P and I think they have been slightly on the side of being screwed over in their careers (eg- all those defeats to Crone & Poirier even when C&P made mistakes, losing to the Shibutanis at the 2011 Worlds which was ridiculous), but I cant remember a time where W&P have finished behind I&K in competition yet. I&K also arent what I would call a technically especialy strong team. If anything their real strength is in PCS, and it often helps their placings in competitions where they compare more favorably to their opponents than they usually do in TES. If they were such a technically strong team they wouldnt be making as many mistakes and struggling with the twizzles so often. As for C&L they are actualy improving and getting better all the time, while I&K have been mostly stuck in a rut and trying to find ways to improve but not coming up with any good answers since they left the junior ranks.

  10. #30
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    Many thought W&P skated better than P&B at the 2012 Worlds, and almost all certainly felt they had the stronger OD there
    Ah. See, I didn't at all. I thought P&B were solidly third thanks to their superior skating skills and a better constructed FD. (I always found that the construction and flow of W&P's FD started falling apart about halfway through, not to mention the over relying on the vocals for the IN) So I don't look at those PCS and see protocol at all. We'll have to just agree to disagree on that one.
    As for I&K in what way are they superior to W&P.
    *At their best*, deeper edges, how easily speed is gained per push of the blade, better run to the blade and ice coverage, body line and quality of positions, etc.

    Consistency is their problem.
    If they were such a technically strong team they wouldnt be making as many mistakes and struggling with the twizzles so often.
    Eh, the Shibs can twizzle consistently with the best of them. I wouldn't consider them any stronger than a lot of the teams they regularly twizzle better than.
    losing to the Shibutanis at the 2011 Worlds which was ridiculous
    I agree with that. But I'm in the camp that thought P&B still should have won bronze even with the fall, so...

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by casken View Post
    As for I&K, I just can't see if I&K actually deliver, them being stuck behind techincally inferior teams (IMO of course) like W&P and C&L.
    Just as judgejudy27, I don't see were they are technically superior than those teams. Unlike especially C/L they have regularly failed to get good levels on their step sequences and SD sequences, they often have problems with their twizzles, and their lifts are not all that great. Of course, skating skills are also technique, but they are not a significant part of TES (they are only somewhat reflected in step sequence GOEs), more of PCS. And, to tell the truth, that's the only advantage that they have. Their transitions are not the best, they skate quite far apart, Ilinykh's posture is also not ideal, and I don't think that their interpretation, or their overall execution and performance is truly better than C/L's and W/P's (although judge's marks may sometimes say otherwise).


    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    Many thought W&P skated better than P&B at the 2012 Worlds, and almost all certainly felt they had the stronger OD there (FD is debateable) but they even finished a couple points below in that phase. The GPF last season even more felt W&P were stronger. This season I wouldnt say P&B had any wrong results but the PCS gap on the ones behind them was a bit on the generous side.
    I am not sure about "almost all" at all - I don't remember reading that many comments on this board that definitely said that W/P's SD (not OD ) was better. And if some people didn't like P/B's SD, then it had more to do with the concept of the dance, not with execution. P/B had a mistake in twizzles, but W/P had one level less in their rumba sequences. And higher PCS is understandable, since apparently P/B's skating skills are still better than W/P's (I am not such an expert, but so the more knowledgeable people say). As for the FD - people feeling that W/P were stronger may have had more to do with them liking that FD better than P/B's. It's true that at Worlds W/P had a higher technical base value - P/B closed the gap with the help of GOEs, and won the FD over W/P with the help of PCS. True, the gap in PCS could have been smaller, but that wouldn't have helped W/P to get the bronze.

  12. #32
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    Most likely for silver, but colud be gold. Very talented team for sure.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    So how do you explain them getting the bronze at worlds in Canada?
    Well, of course the politicking has already started. Already in their SD they received very generous PCS, so the judges clearly wanted them to medal. I think that even if P/B had skated better, B/S still would have won with a small margin.
    Ice dance results are the easiest to manipulate and Team Russia only have V/T as a sure podium lock. So they definitely need more medals (especially if their President is so obsessed with figure skating), I would bet a lot of money for B/S's bronze. Don't you remember what happened in Vancouver in ice dance?

  14. #34
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    Sorry but ice dance judging makes sense to me more than 2013 men, pairs and ladies competitions. I don't think Bobrova/Soloviev's medal results of the politicking. They have a good, original free dance, clean elements, very good skating skills. To me ice dance not just politicks anymore.

    Like Zhiganshina-Gazsi and Bobrova-Soloviev, I think ISU judges wants to see original/interesting programs. If next year they came up with a good program, why not?

  15. #35

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    Denkova/Staviski were dumped down to fifth in 05 then had an exceptional chance at olympics with a fabulous CD but then messed up in the OD bronze could well have been theirs even silver .They of course won two world's after that so anything can happen .

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceIceBaby View Post
    Well, of course the politicking has already started. Already in their SD they received very generous PCS, so the judges clearly wanted them to medal. I think that even if P/B had skated better, B/S still would have won with a small margin.
    Ice dance results are the easiest to manipulate and Team Russia only have V/T as a sure podium lock. So they definitely need more medals (especially if their President is so obsessed with figure skating), I would bet a lot of money for B/S's bronze. Don't you remember what happened in Vancouver in ice dance?
    This is pretty much how I feel.

  17. #37

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    Any medal that wanst gold was treated as a huge loss so bronze for b/s like bronze for d/s wouldn't mean anything.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by casken View Post
    Have they? I'm trying to think of the events they skated in in the past year and a half where it was clear they were getting results they shouldn't be and I'm drawing a blank.

    As for I&K, I just can't see if I&K actually deliver, them being stuck behind techincally inferior teams (IMO of course) like W&P and C&L.
    Can you see I/K delivering? Seriously, I'm curious.

    In terms of getting levels, C/L and W/P are certainly better. That W/P trounced them on levels this year with the lack of preparation speaks to that. C/L have gotten straight level fours before and under Shpilband will certainly be a force there.

    You mention I/K's technical superiority, but it's worth pointing out that"*At their best*, deeper edges, how easily speed is gained per push of the blade, better run to the blade and ice coverage" is actually a fairly narrow component - Skating skills and some choreography in there. So even marked fairly and cleanly, that aspect won't gain them a whole heck of a lot over W/P (over C/L, probably).

    I thought B/S deserved the bronze this year, fwiw.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by caseyedwards View Post
    Any medal that wanst gold was treated as a huge loss so bronze for b/s like bronze for d/s wouldn't mean anything.
    I think it's different for BS because DS were reigning world champions. BS are only reigning bronze medallists. (Although so were Virtue and Moir)

  20. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macassar88 View Post
    I think it's different for BS because DS were reigning world champions. BS are only reigning bronze medallists. (Although so were Virtue and Moir)
    It's gold or nothing! Silver Bronze medals were won by a handful in 2010 but they only counted the three golds as successes. you succeed with gold or you fail. Sure all the medal winners got some recognition from the government but only because they were going by what the Olympics consider worthy.

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