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  1. #401

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    Quote Originally Posted by lala View Post
    Of course, Yagudin was friendly to Chan. Why not? What does that prove? And you believe me nobody wanted to write what you predicted... and am I a biased?? What are you? And I never said he hates Chan, or something like this.. Rewatch my posts..
    Must we? Oh wait, I forgot the obligatory emoticons... hang on... there you go.
    I guess the hard thing for a lot of people to accept is why God would allow me to go running through their yards, yelling and spinning around.


  2. #402

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    Quote Originally Posted by antmanb View Post
    Excellent! Now we're making progress - I'll be sure to bookmark this post to throw back in your face when you recant for the umpteenth time then
    Recant what? I have no idea what you think I l have been posting! Quadlessness is not acceptable in a win! That's it!

  3. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciocio View Post
    Oh, boy,this is great!
    I just wanna know ciocio, how you unknowingly created the boxes within the boxes by quoting your own made-up quotes, but actually a pretty exact summary of the direction this thread has taken! Inquiring minds want to know.

    Easily the most entertaining post in this thread.

  4. #404
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    Last edited by lala; 03-27-2013 at 07:47 AM.

  5. #405

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    Kwan
    purple
    yadda
    blah
    Quoting
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    Kwan
    Trying quotey things to make pwetty pwatterns
    Last edited by Aussie Willy; 03-27-2013 at 12:08 PM.
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  6. #406
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    Congrats ! I try it, but I can't do it

  7. #407
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    Quote Originally Posted by yaya124 View Post
    What do you mean he is blinded? About the remarks on the output of men's event this WC? It is not very clear from your post or maybe you mentioned somewhere in the previous post?
    Yes, I've said it in my previous posts in this thread. But I don't mind to repeat it one more time.

    He has made the connection between Chan's win and the politics in this case, for which he has neither evidence nor knowledge of such besides his Russian background. People have been talking about politicking in Russian federation for years. I'm sure he knows something about Russian politicking. He doesn't understand, at least doesn't understand completely about IJS. Not to belittle of him, but I dare say that I am confidently believe that some of the skating fans on this board have more knowledge on IJS than Plushenko does. So he has just blindly, subjectively assume that it was the Canadian federation which has done something. In this, he has made himself more "creative", more "specific", and more standing out of the crowd of those skaters who have objected this time's scores, and made himself like a fool.

    Quote Originally Posted by yaya124 View Post
    I think probably Chan "deserves" the title if only because of the IJS. Rules are rules. But with such messy LP and still got 8.61 for PE and 8.96 for IN, that is just scandalous. IMO, even his SS looked not that great in this particular performance, I felt his movement was kind of tight.
    Actually, if you consider Chan could get 10 in PE if everything is perfect, 8.61 was OK for a four mistake performance. One fall gets a deduction of 0.25 from PE should be enough, I believe. Chan had two falls and two other major mistakes. The rest of the program he has attacked and detailed in such a fashion that little was affected. If he got one whole point deduction from PE and got 9.00, that should be more than enough. Plus some other imperfect places that judges felt he should be penalized, another -0.39 off from the PE. I think 8.61 in PE is perfectly acceptable.

    Quote Originally Posted by yaya124 View Post
    In fact I do not really understand CH, now a good CH means good TR plus reasonable jumping layout, right? So actually this is kind of independent of what skaters put on ice, which means as long as you can afford to hire a good COP friendly choreographer, and execute all your transitions, you can guarantee high CH points (or at least to certain skaters). Or in other word, this mark is marking the choreographer instead of skaters. In my opinion, since the transition is rewarded independently, CH is redundant (the jumping layout is rewarded by applying x1.1 in TES, and the presentation is marked by IN and PE). Or the TR can be combined together with CH.
    I am still learning on this one. So I can't explain it well. I didn't mean that I've fully understood the other ones already. But CH is the most puzzled me as well.
    Last edited by Eyre; 03-27-2013 at 04:32 PM.

  8. #408

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    Hi
    Just to post a positive and rather sentimental one about a skater. I found the video of Todd putting his gold medal around his mother's neck. It is a very heartwarming thing to see. Just to let people take a pause from serious discussion to see a nice memory of skating in its hey day. Hope the link works
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJLdnWeWT9U

    Baron.

  9. #409
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eyre View Post
    Yes, I've said it in my previous posts in this thread. But I don't mind to repeat it one more time.

    He has made the connection between Chan's win and the politics in this case, for which he has neither evidence nor knowledge of such besides his Russian background. People have been talking about politicking in Russian federation for years. I'm sure he knows something about Russian politicking. He doesn't understand, at least doesn't understand completely about IJS. Not to belittle of him, but I dare say that I am confidently believe that some of the skating fans on this board have more knowledge on IJS than Plushenko does. So he has just blindly, subjectively assume that it was the Canadian federation which has done something. In this, he has made himself more "creative", more "specific", and more standing out of the crowd of those skaters who have objected this time's scores, and made himself like a fool.
    This is his opinion, and he is not alone. So maybe in your eyes he is make a fool of himself, but not to many other people. But yes, it is nonetheless valid opinion by you. Now I know what you meant. Thanks for explaining that.


    Actually, if you consider Chan could get 10 in PE if everything is perfect, 8.61 was OK for a four mistake performance. One fall gets a deduction of 0.25 from PE should be enough, I believe. Chan had two falls and two other major mistakes. The rest of the program he has attacked and detailed in such a fashion that little was affected. If he got one whole point deduction from PE and got 9.00, that should be more than enough. Plus some other imperfect places that judges felt he should be penalized, another -0.39 off from the PE. I think 8.61 in PE is perfectly acceptable.
    If you assume Chan's PE should be 10 if he is clean, your argument probably is OK. But then judges should use the same logic for other skaters too. It is THE mark gives people an impression about how the skaters perform the program (good or bad), hence with 4 major mistakes he can still get that mark, the system needs a second thought (or the judges).

    I am still learning on this one. So I can't explain it well. I didn't mean that I've fully understood the other ones already. But CH is the most puzzled me as well.
    I think my argument is valid, but hey I am a layman, so

  10. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by baron View Post
    Hi
    Just to post a positive and rather sentimental one about a skater. I found the video of Todd putting his gold medal around his mother's neck. It is a very heartwarming thing to see. Just to let people take a pause from serious discussion to see a nice memory of skating in its hey day. Hope the link works
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJLdnWeWT9U

    Baron.
    I remember this. He is one of my favorite skaters, there is always something exquisite in his movements.

  11. #411
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    Quote Originally Posted by baron View Post
    Hi
    Just to post a positive and rather sentimental one about a skater. I found the video of Todd putting his gold medal around his mother's neck. It is a very heartwarming thing to see. Just to let people take a pause from serious discussion to see a nice memory of skating in its hey day. Hope the link works
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJLdnWeWT9U

    Baron.
    Thank you, lovely video...

  12. #412

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    Quote Originally Posted by yaya124 View Post
    ..... which means as long as you can afford to hire a good COP friendly choreographer, and execute all your transitions, you can guarantee high CH points (or at least to certain skaters).
    Ummm shouldn't all skaters be trying to do this? Coaches and choreographers who don't understand the system are not going to get much business from competitive skaters if they can't figure the system out.
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  13. #413
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post
    Ummm shouldn't all skaters be trying to do this? Coaches and choreographers who don't understand the system are not going to get much business from competitive skaters if they can't figure the system out.
    That is my point, this point actually is for the choreogragher, not the skaters themselves, or the complain should be, not for what skater put on ice.

    For example, Chan got 9 for this messy performance, if a skater cannot handle this program, could u call it a good choreography? or u would say that Chan had skated it relatively good once so he could do it, hence the programe is suitable for him. then apparantly the judging here was not based on what happened on ice, but what Chan could do.

  14. #414
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    I disagree that Chan's performance was messy in terms of choreography or implying that falls on jumps = can't do choreography. Chan had mistakes on his jumps but the rest of his skating and his movements were complete and finished with refinements. Chan never seemed lost skating to the spirit of the program even with the jumping mistakes.

  15. #415

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    Quote Originally Posted by yaya124 View Post
    That is my point, this point actually is for the choreogragher, not the skaters themselves, or the complain should be, not for what skater put on ice.

    For example, Chan got 9 for this messy performance, if a skater cannot handle this program, could u call it a good choreography? or u would say that Chan had skated it relatively good once so he could do it, hence the programe is suitable for him. then apparantly the judging here was not based on what happened on ice, but what Chan could do.
    Mistakes on jumps have nothing to do with choreography. Whilst he made mistakes on jumps, he did the rest of the program without a problem.

    It is true that a choreographer can give a skater all the choreography in the world but unless the skater executes it then it is pretty much irrelevant. But in Chan's case he carried out quite successfully what he was given and probably gave it more than just putting in a average performance in that regard.
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  16. #416
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    And that's one good thing about CoP.
    Few years ago, Figure Skating was all about the jumps, and when skaters made mistakes on jumps, the program was painful to watch.
    Now, skaters have learnt to sell the program, even with a fall or two. that's a good thing, IMO.

  17. #417
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    The choreography mark is given not because the choreography is difficult but because the skater performed the difficult choreography with out flaw, which Patrick did.
    I want to thank you Lord for being with me so far this day. With your help, I have not been inpatient, lost my temper been grumpy or envious of anyone. But I will be getting out of bed in a minute and I think I will really need your help then. Amen

  18. #418
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    Maybe. But it seems the majority of FS fans would like to see flawless champions..

  19. #419
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    I too prefer flawless champions but flawless performances with all the jumps completed in both programs are quite rare at Worlds. Maybe Lysacek and Buttle before him were the only ones hitting all their elements as planned when they won their world titles since the CoP was introduced?

  20. #420

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    Quote Originally Posted by lala View Post
    Maybe. But it seems the majority of FS fans would like to see flawless champions..
    lala, we do like 'flawless' programs but we also like to see sportsmen/women push their limits. It is easier to do a flawless program if the everything is watered down. For example, skater who won with a flawless program in junior worlds will not win with that very same program in senior worlds. The demands and level of competition is different.
    Prosperity makes friends, adversity tries them. – Publilius Syrus

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