Virtue and Moir # 26- There's no place like home

[Cherub721]

In that article Igor had a very insightful comment about I&K (that they practiced so well but then all of a sudden in the SD the speed they created got away from them and they couldn't control it to get their levels). We always knew Igor was more of the technician, but now I wonder as I did last summer if Marina is in over her head with anything less than a very healthy, technically proficient team who can train a lot. Her comments about Tessa really don't inspire confidence in me - we did all the necessary stuff with the doctors, but she still feels nervous, so, oh well. Isn't part of the coach's job to prepare the skaters mentally for these situations? To say you're still the best despite it all? But then how can she when she also coaches their biggest rivals.

I've never really been a Marina fan, and there are stories that she stole G&G away from more technical coaches, got them by on pretty choreography in 1994, and then was never able to produce anything until she hooked up with Igor. Now she has thrown Igor out but is she really able to deal with all these technical things? And with Margaglio by her side, bless his heart (and FP&M are one of my faves, that's not a bash)? Igor is certainly doing a great job with C&L and C&B so far, although there is also poor R&T, mired in 13th place (not sure if they have been working with him much since the summer).

I don't care where they go as long as they continue to work with Maria Mountain and Jennifer Swan.

[IoanaC]

Thanks for posting the translation. I don't know what Elena V. has been watching, but Tessa most certainly did not look heavy and slow in practice. Quite the opposite. And Zueva should not be making these statements now. I don't like this.
I will.go to tonight's practice. The afternoon one is scheduled during the pairs last group.

[Shayii]

Well, then act it. Some of you in this thread really need to get a grip. If following an ice dance team causes you this much angst, perhaps you all need a new hobby.

Lol and I'm seriously wondering why you care so much either way. Why does it bother you whether it causes us any angst or not; if it causes us angst, it's our prerogative. It's not like we're bothering anybody and most of these "crazy" V/M fans just stay in our little thread anyways, so what's the deal?

Look, I'm not trying to pick a fight with you or cause any problems. I just asked a simple question and it looks like people aren't even interested anyways, which I'm absolutely fine with.

[pani]

Thanks for posting the translation. I don't know what Elena V. has been watching, but Tessa most certainly did not look heavy and slow in practice. Quite the opposite. And Zueva should not be making these statements now. I don't like this.
I will.go to tonight's practice. The afternoon one is scheduled during the pairs last group.

Thank you! Enjoy today competitions!

[PEZazzz]

I am happy about the start order tomorrow. I'll be at the 8:30 practice and there for the freedance. Not to be a child about it or anything, but D/W come after tessa and scott in the free dance and I hope they feel the resentement of the crowd. i'm actually excited and I think I will enjoy myself knowing there is nothing more lose. Let the pressure be on D/W

[volunteer]

I don't understand why Marina would feel it necessary to make a statement about Tessa's confidence in the middle of a competition, even if she was asked a direct question, there are many ways to answer. Perception is everything, in competition you don't want your opponents to capitalize on any weaknesses, whether real or perceived. That makes me question Marina's devotion to VM as a team, or at least as Cherub pointed out, her ability to manage all aspects of preparation for her team.

[manhn]

Oh good, we're talking about next season.

To me, Carmen is not the problem. Very rarely are their free dances a problem (okay, Funny Face may have been a problem, but whatevs). But I would love to see a truly kick ass OD/SD/OSP from them that doesn't take them the entire season to perfect. Had they had a better received OD this season (granted, their OD wasn't all that well received last season either but D&W had similar problems), their Carmen would've been better received too. This is probably where a coach with greater technical expertise is needed. I mean, is V&M the only top team that seems to have issues with the pairs spin? I mean, why?

And maybe Skate Canada needs to put more input next season at those camps. USFSA seems to always demand changes from D&W, yet Skate Canada is always so laisez-faire about everything. I mean, perhaps Patrick should get an actual figure skating coach, right? And why is Kevin still with Joanne?

[Cherub721]

But I would love to see a truly kick ass OD/SD/OSP from them that doesn't take them the entire season to perfect. Had they had a better received OD this season (granted, their OD wasn't all that well received last season either but D&W had similar problems), their Carmen would've been better received too.

I always love their ODs but they do seem to have gone wrong in terms of the energy of their dance. It's a gorgeous waltz, the polka is integrated smoothly and was performed perfectly last night, but it lacked energy in the music compared to the other teams, therefore it did not appear as fast and exciting, but I think they are in fact quite fast over the ice. So if they stay next year, what then? Make their dance a majority quickstep? I would have loved to see a sublime foxtrot as only they can do.

I feel like ever since Belbin & Agosto the OD turned into less of an opportunity to perform an authentic ballroom dance on ice and more like a singles or pairs short program, the focus of which is to perform clean elements with energy and good speed.

[Shayii]

I don't understand why Marina would feel it necessary to make a statement about Tessa's confidence in the middle of a competition, even if she was asked a direct question, there are many ways to answer. Perception is anything, in competition you don't want your opponents to capitalize on any weaknesses, whether real or perceived. That makes me question Marina's devotion to VM as a team, or at least as Cherub pointed out, her ability to manage all aspects of preparation for her team.

I don't understand this either. I feel she's just making it worse by basically saying Tessa just isn't psychologically prepared because of what happened at 4CC. And people already feel she was making excuses for them when she said it was the dress that caused the messed up twizzles.

[AragornElessar]

Wow! Way to go Kaitlyn and Andrew. Maybe we should sit them down and have them chat with Tessa and Scott before the FD. I hadn't been planning on watching any of the SD's (at least not yet) but will go back and watch W&P's.

Aragorn, I'm sorry you are having stress issues. And yes, unfortunately I know as well from personal experience what prolonged stress can do both mentally and physically. I hope things get better or have already gotten better for you.

Hope you've seen W/P's SD by now. Thanks w/the stress and situation at home. Sadly, nothing's going to change until my Mom wakes up to reality about both mine and my Dad's Medical situation. I have a better chance to make the team for Sochi than that happening, so...

Get well soon!
In any case - they could talk about me, but not about all others in this thread.

You were the only one making disgusting and insulting comments about Canadian fans and how we support our skaters. You got called on it. Don't then come back in here and play the victim "Oh...I'm being picked on now by everybody...." and give a half assed apology. You knew what you were saying last night and you said it more than once. You meant every word, so own up to it and don't whine when you're rightfully nailed for it.

Thanks for posting the translation. I don't know what Elena V. has been watching, but Tessa most certainly did not look heavy and slow in practice. Quite the opposite. And Zueva should not be making these statements now. I don't like this.
I will.go to tonight's practice. The afternoon one is scheduled during the pairs last group.

Looking forward to your impressions and ITA w/you about Marina. What the HELL!?! A coach just does *not* do or say some of the things she has said about Tessa and Scott over the last year especially. It's more than time for them to leave Canton and I also think they should go to Igor. I really do think he was the one who was the true coach in Canton and Marina rode his coat tails. You can give a skater great choreography, but if there isn't someone there actually *coaching* and making sure the tech stuff is up to snuff, then what's the point?

Something's not right and I think it's the environment they're in. Time to go somewhere else.

[Shayii]

Aragorn, Pani isn't playing the victim. If anything she's taking full responsibility with some of the things she said yesterday and was sticking up for V/M fans. And emotions were running high yesterday so some of us might have said things that we probably didn't mean to (I know I attacked someone and had to take it back later).

[aka_gerbil]

Looking forward to your impressions and ITA w/you about Marina. What the HELL!?! A coach just does *not* do or say some of the things she has said about Tessa and Scott over the last year especially. It's more than time for them to leave Canton and I also think they should go to Igor. I really do think he was the one who was the true coach in Canton and Marina rode his coat tails. You can give a skater great choreography, but if there isn't someone there actually *coaching* and making sure the tech stuff is up to snuff, then what's the point?

Something's not right and I think it's the environment they're in. Time to go somewhere else.

No, no a coach shouldn't be saying the things she's saying. The LAST thing they need right now is it out there that Tessa is having confidence issues, as if the judges needed even more reasons to scrutinize them. I also agree that Igor was the true technical coach. I definitely feel they would be much better off with him. I would love to see what he and Swan could do with them next year.

I have felt all this season that something wasn't right. I think you're correct that it's the environment and it's time to go somewhere else.

[PEZazzz]

Hopefuly this will cheer everyone up:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzzEl...ature=youtu.be

[bmcg]

Wow, Marina does such great PR for them. I can see why they would never leave her

[Cherub721]

Don't think this was posted... more comments from Marina about the dress:

http://web.icenetwork.com/news/artic...&vkey=ice_news
For Zoueva, who coaches both teams in Canton, the evening held mixed emotions.

"You know, one team did a perfect program and the other team did little mistake on the twizzle," Zoueva said. "So, I was really high up and then kind of down."

The fashion-conscious Virtue, known for wearing several different costumes over the course of a season, unveiled a new black dress on Thursday.

Zoueva thinks it may have been costly.

"All the time, they do [the twizzles] perfect," she said. "I think it was the new dress, seriously, because it is a really big skirt. I saw it in the practice and I told her, maybe that is part of the problem."

-----

She sounds so blase. Very weird to see Scott breaking down the technical elements and the coach talking about the dress. Why didn't she insist on a change if she really thought it was a technical problem? This is the woman who supposedly insisted Tessa wear white instead of pink for the Olympics, but she won't put her foot down when the dress inhibits the skating?

[aka_gerbil]

She sounds so blase. Very weird to see Scott breaking down the technical elements and the coach talking about the dress. Why didn't she insist on a change if she really thought it was a technical problem? This is the woman who supposedly insisted Tessa wear white instead of pink for the Olympics, but she won't put her foot down when the dress inhibits the skating?

It makes no sense.

If they want a chance next year, they have got to get away from her.

[Cherub721]

It makes no sense.

If they want a chance next year, they have got to get away from her.

I was not feeling Marina when she kind of shrugged her shoulders about all the Shibs deductions at Nats, but this takes the cake.

[Bournekraatzfan]

Oh I totally felt gutted for P/B too. Especially after they came back from injury like Kaitlyn and Andrew.

me too
Tracy said that Fabian is still feeling pain in his groin and that it affects him most during the lifts. That+stamina issues from not having had the chance to train has me a bit worried about the FD. I really hope they will be ok. I am really impressed that they are competing here.

I completely agree with this. And nowhere is it more obvious than when you see both teams on the ice, at the same time, i.e. in practice.
Still, that doesn't change the fact that Tessa and Scott did make those mistakes last night. Without them, I am convinced they would have won the SD. The tiny difference in PCS confirms that.

I agree, IoanaC. I think the tech panel did their job, like you and nlyoung said. And while I would have had V&M a bit higher in SS and LF/M, for instance, they did not lose those categories by much (the margin was less than 0.25, the minimum increment, so the judges were not unanimous here, or in any category of PCS, though the margins were larger in the remaining three categories). I think that, had they been cleaner, the PCS might have been higher. So while I do think some of what they do is undervalued in PCS, I still have hope that they can attain a stellar score in the FD. I hope their performance of Carmen is everything they want it to be

I hope things get better, AragornElessar.

[IoanaC]

Wow, Marina does such great PR for them. I can see why they would never leave her

LOL, sad but true.

[pani]

LOL, sad but true.

You are so lucky to see such a great pairs event! WOW to Tanya and Max, Kirsten and Dylan and Mega-Eric!

AragornElessar., i said sorry today just to all V-M fans, who need to read how crazy they are, when only one crazy person in this thread - me. Nothing more.

As for Marina.
I think the main problem - she just didnt found good technick coach. And from the results i think Shpilband still the best.
Marina is all about choreo, ideas, emotionls, style, to find new positions in lift from ballet, but she didnt understaend COP like Igor.She could work with skaters on good legs-arms lines, but not on blades , edges and levels. So maybe D-W more ready technically, when V-M need coach who will work with them on SS, twizzles ect.
I think Scott is good in COP, he understand it, but they need outside look.
Thats my thoughts. Maybe i am wrong.
Today Savchenko-SZelkovi lost to V-T 6 points in PCS Hope this will not happened with Tessa and Scott and they will see, what they need to be on fire, because russians teams are very strong too.