Vaitsekhovskaya speaks to Mishin `The great ones are judged differently'

[Glacier cat]

4.) and alas (scroll to almost the bottom): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...figure_skating (I'll be cheering you on, Zhenya & Mr. Mishin & co., as always)

Interesting. Plushy is REALLY the only one `living' skater on this list. Moreover he is a single skater. Not Pairs. This is simply great

Total 4 Olympic Medals
Gillis Grafström (SWE) 1920–1932

Total 3 Olympic Medals
Sonja Henie (NOR) 1928–1936
Irina Rodnina (URS) 1972–1980
Artur Dmitriev (EUN), (RUS) 1992–1998
Pierre Brunet (FRA) 1924–1932
Andrée Brunet (FRA) 1924–1932
Evgeni Plushenko (RUS) 2002–2010
Marina Klimova / Sergei Ponomarenko (EUN), (URS) 1984–1992
Shen Xue / Zhao Hongbo (CHN) 2002–2010
Beatrix Loughran (USA) 1924–1932 (2 medals - Ladies, 1 medal - Pairs)

Total 2 Olympic Medals
Karl Schäfer (AUT) 1928–1936
Dick Button (USA) 1948–1952
Ludmila Belousova / Oleg Protopopov (URS) 1964–1968
Alexander Zaitsev (URS) 1976–1980
Katarina Witt (GDR) 1984–1988
Ekaterina Gordeeva / Sergei Grinkov (URS), (RUS) 1988, 1994
Oksana Grishuk / Evgeny Platov (RUS) 1994–1998

[hanca]

Once I talked with him, not in Zagreb. I thought he was friendly and cheerful person. Maybe in Zagreb he was anxious about Plushy

That's possible. Every time we met him in the hotel he looked like if he has been constantly pissed off. I do have a huge respect for him as a coach, but seeing his face there looking repeatedly so sour/angry, I thought I wouldn't want someone like that coaching me.

[lala]

That's possible. Every time we met him in the hotel he looked like if he has been constantly pissed off. I do have a huge respect for him as a coach, but seeing his face there looking repeatedly so sour/angry, I thought I wouldn't want someone like that coaching me.

I read many opinions from his pupils. They love him. I think Mishin rigor of a misconception as Tarasova is the best, Morozov is the worst, Yagudin is the most artistry, Plushenko is only jumper, Kevin Reynolds has bad skating skills, only the North-American choreography is good, ,etc. The people say say say, and lots of people believe it, without knowing the truth.

[hanca]

I read many opinions from his pupils. They love him. I think Mishin rigor of a misconception as Tarasova is the best, Morozov is the worst, Yagudin is the most artistry, Plushenko is only jumper, Kevin Reynolds has bad skating skills, only the North-American choreography is good, ,etc. The people say say say, and lots of people believe it, without knowing the truth.

But I am not basing my opinion on what people say, I am basing it on what I saw. I while I agree that this years Europeans could have been quite difficult for him because of Plushenko, and maybe he is not like this all the time, I am just saying what I saw.

I am sure that his students love him. So do Morozov's student love Morozov, and generally, most students do like their coaches. That's true on any level, not only at elite level. Even at my rink most of people like and respect their coach.

[yaya124]

That's possible. Every time we met him in the hotel he looked like if he has been constantly pissed off. I do have a huge respect for him as a coach, but seeing his face there looking repeatedly so sour/angry, I thought I wouldn't want someone like that coaching me.

I saw him in Zagreb before men's SP, he was ordering coffee. He seemed cheerful enough to me. And I heard couple of stories from some fans who met him in summer training camp, just hilariously funny.

I think people would have certain image of these well known persons, unless what they saw is totally different, they tend to fit what they saw into the preset 'frame'. For example, probably you think Mishin is a very serious person, then when you saw him in person not smiling around, you would either think 'yes, he is a very serious man' or you would think he is pissed off by something/someone.

Never mind, these are all personal opinions, no big deal.

[misskarne]

It wouldn't at all surprise me if Mishin was especially tense in Zagreb.

[hanca]

I think people would have certain image of these well known persons, unless what they saw is totally different, they tend to fit what they saw into the preset 'frame'. For example, probably you think Mishin is a very serious person, then when you saw him in person not smiling around, you would either think 'yes, he is a very serious man' or you would think he is pissed off by something/someone.

Not sure if 'a very serious person' describes it enough. It seemed to me more like 'a miserable' would be better description. and I am not basing it on just once seeing him, but seeing him quite a few times in the hotel.

[yaya124]

Not sure if 'a very serious person' describes it enough. It seemed to me more like 'a miserable' would be better description. and I am not basing it on just once seeing him, but seeing him quite a few times in the hotel.

Please read my following two sentences after the one you made in bold.

But as misskarne pointed it out, Plushenko apparently was in a very bad shape so if Mishin was not happy it is perfectly understandable.

[hanca]

Please read my following two sentences after the one you made in bold.

But as misskarne pointed it out, Plushenko apparently was in a very bad shape so if Mishin was not happy it is perfectly understandable.

Please, read my post number 22 and 24. I did say that it's possible that he was just anxious about Plushenko. I have also said that I agree that this years Europeans could have been quite difficult for him because of Plushenko, and maybe he is not like this all the time. However, I can still have an opinion based on what I saw.

[ItalianFan]

Interesting. Plushy is REALLY the only one `living' skater on this list. Moreover he is a single skater. Not Pairs. This is simply great

I seriously don't think it would be so terribly "not record breaking" to be only the 2nd person in history to have 4 oly medals.....even of course he could never equal the three gold.

[Glacier cat]

Yes. If Plushy becomes the second person, I will be very happy not only as his fan but as sports fan. I always get excited that Plushy is still competing in my lifetime. Even without any medal, I will be happy if he can compete in Sochi after such major surgery

[lala]

Yes. If Plushy becomes the second person, I will be very happy not only as his fan but as sports fan. I always get excited that Plushy is still competing in my lifetime. Even without any medal, I will be happy if he can compete in Sochi after such major surgery

exactly

[sadya]

Achieving high results nowadays is perhaps even more special than in the past, as the sport is more demanding and thus more difficult for your body to stay healthy after repeated movements and pressure in any sport, not just figure skating. Not to take anything away from what athletes achieved in the past. They were developping the sports and great in their own way, but perhaps there never has been more strain on the athlete's body than in our times.

So it's still special if athletes win or medal multiple times. It doesn't happen that often in international level anymore.

[umronnie]

Interesting. Plushy is REALLY the only one `living' skater on this list. Moreover he is a single skater. Not Pairs. This is simply great

I hope by 'living' you mean "not officialy retired from skating". Otherwise it will sadden me greatly to learn about the passing of some of these athletes.

But, "records" aside, you really cannot compare the careers of Gillis Grafstrom, or Ulrich Salcow and his 10 world titles, to the careers of modern skaters. This is a totally different sport - and not just in the physical demands. When Grafstrom won his medals the men's field encompassed 14 men (in 1920) to 23 (in 1928). The competition was so physically demanding that the 1920 bronze was won by 44 year old Martin Stixrud and the ladies' gold by the 3-months pregnant Magda Julin....(Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Figure_...ummer_Olympics).

When Salcow won his first world title, there was no bronze medal, as there were only two participants (it's difficult to see how this would make a "world" championship). When he won his last title there were 7....

[Iceman]

Glacier Cat, Maybe I misunderstand your table, but quite a few single skaters who have won a total of 2 Olympic medals are missing: Bocki, Candelero, David Jenkins, Patrick Pera, Stojko, Brian Orser, Petrenko and among the women, Kwan, Kerrigan, Slutskaya, Lu Chen, Fritzi Burger, Tenley Albright, Carol Heiss, Jeanette Altwegg, Dijkstra.

[Vagabond]

AM: It's deeper. Yuri Vlasov was the first to push 500kg, Armin Hari was the first to run 100m in 10sec, Bob Beamon did a 8.90jump. As for 4 Olympics in singles...
EV: Were done at the beginning of last century by the Swede Gillis Grafström, and he won 3 of them
AM: I didn't know about it. I think Evgeni doesn't either. Hence we were aiming for it.

Does that mean they might have second thoughts about his remaining in training?

[Cherub721]

I'm sure they have had second and third thoughts, but doubt that's what Mishin meant by that statement. They "were" aiming for a record 4th Olympic medal. He can't say they "are" aiming for a record that they found out isn't really a record after all. Hitting that record is no longer their motivation, so either they are no longer pursuing a 4th Olympics or, more likely, they are pursuing it with different motivation.

ETA: With the team event, technically they can go for 5 medals, but I think he's talking about individual medals or just participation in 4 Olympics.

[Glacier cat]

Glacier Cat, Maybe I misunderstand your table, but quite a few single skaters who have won a total of 2 Olympic medals are missing: Bocki, Candelero, David Jenkins, Patrick Pera, Stojko, Brian Orser, Petrenko and among the women, Kwan, Kerrigan, Slutskaya, Lu Chen, Fritzi Burger, Tenley Albright, Carol Heiss, Jeanette Altwegg, Dijkstra.

I quoted it from here. I think someone who can edit needs to work




By the way, reading through the wiki page of the Olympic medalists in men's figure skating, I noticed that there were only a few Olympians at the early Olympic games.

[lala]

Mishin Between the stars http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXTMOXartYQ unfortunately in Russian language, but interesting to watch, especially from 9' 35. How he can teach.

[NadineWhite]

Glacier cat, your intent was right on, but where you erred was not including *exactly* what the wiki page stated, which states ATHLETES WHO WON AT LEAST TWO GOLD MEDALS OR THREE TOTAL MEDALS ARE LISTED BELOW: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...figure_skating

And as you can see by what Iceman has posted there are quite a few skaters that have won 2 olympic medals, thus the reason the person whom created the wiki file narrowed it down, totally understandable.

I give you the benefit of the doubt, Glacier cat, I knew what you were getting at, but a non-Plushy fan imho would want to **** with you.

And don't discard the past, unronnie, everything's relative. Just as what is being done today will most likely be considered irrelevant and easy by those 100+ years from now, even if we know differently. What Sonja & Gillis did in their day was A-W-E-S-O-M-E, and I acknowledge that fact! *bow*

Back to the here & now, Zhenya is definitely a Great One (on the aforementioned wiki list only he, Henie, and Grafstrom are singles skaters), so despite what he does here on in, his records speak for themselves, but to truly become an Immortal like Grafstrom & Henie he'll have to do more imho. And that means going above & beyond, adding that 4th Olympic medal to his arsenal, not just competing in his fourth Olympic Games, which has been done already by several (Stojko & Sebestyen to name a few). No, adding that 4th Olympic Medal will elevate him from Great to Immortal. jmho.


GOOOOOOOOOOOOO ZHENYA!!!!