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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Probably the main reason why I could never live in the US. I either walk everywhere or use public transport.
    There are certainly cities where this isn't true, including the general metropolitan areas that are commuter towns into the city. (Even my podunk little hometown had at least hourly, twice an hour mornings and evenings for the commuters.) Hackensack is one of them, and Sikharulidze regularly went to NYC when he was training there. I get the impression from her blogs that she likes the warmth of a home or a companion. She seemed to have a great time with Makarova in Vancouver. I'm not sure there's anyone in Morozov's group with whom she has that kind of friendship.

    Where Leonova lives now, there's no shortage of real food, if she's able to cook. I suspect she's not. With all of the people around in northern Jersey who can cook anything, I'm surprised that Morozov hasn't arranged to have healthy food catered to the rink while they're there. Arena food is rarely cheap, and there are enough of them to order in bulk.

    One of Seattle's all-time best ballet dancers left after last season to dance with Les Ballets de Monte Carlo, and he came back for a guest performance earlier this month. At a talk after the show, he said that when he was in Seattle, he had a lot of standard routines so that he'd be at his best. Now, in touring, he can't depend on any routine or even that the schedule is going to stick, and he said he has to be prepared for anything. It's a very different mind set.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  2. #102
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    I dunno. The first time I went to Russia there was nothing at the hotel's humongous breakfast buffet I could stand eating. It was horrible stuff. The towels in the room were so stiff from being washed with cheap soap, you could free stand them--and this was at a 4-star hotel. The cigarette smoke was appalling and in Moscow I was stepping over drunks lying on the sidewalk at 9:30 in the morning. I could go on and on. However, I really like Russia and the Russians, and I prefer talking about the good things about the country first. No country is perfect.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by milanessa View Post
    Yeah, like it's any different in Europe. I lived in a small village in England and we got one bus a day to go into town to shop/work. Didn't fit your schedule? Tough. Don't you live in a city?
    Obviously public transport is limited outside of cities but it still exists. Pavements exist as well. And there's nothing to the extent of US suburban sprawl in Europe. Or 'cities' like LA.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    And there's nothing to the extent of US suburban sprawl in Europe. Or 'cities' like LA.
    Ever been to Moscow?
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

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  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceAlisa View Post
    Ever been to Moscow?
    I said 'nothing to the extent'.

    If you need a translation:

    Suburban sprawl exists in US.
    Suburban sprawl exists outside of US.
    Suburban sprawl covers a much bigger area, percentage-wise in the US than anywhere else.
    Suburban sprawl has much more people living in it in the US, in comparison with any other country.
    Living in suburban sprawl in the US means you aren't able to function at all if you don't own a car.
    Living in suburban sprawl outside of the US means it's hard to function without a car but it's not as bad.

    My parents live in suburbia from hell and there's a bus going into the city every hour. There are streets with pavements. There's a community centre with a doctors' surgery offering loads of different activities (and you can actually walk there easily). And so on and so forth.

    P.S. Moscow is nothing like LA in that it actually has a city centre and pretty typical urban planning with suburbs on top of that, on the outskirts.
    Last edited by Ziggy; 02-25-2013 at 05:58 PM.

  6. #106
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    That might be true of Europe, but Russia is closer to the US geographically, and that's the comparison she's making. When she's training in Hackensack, there's plenty of public transportation into NYC, because Hackensack is a commuter suburb very close to NYC. It's easier for her to get to NYC than for the Russian skaters who've described commuting to their rinks from the equivalent or the other side of Moscow and St. Petersburg.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I said 'nothing to the extent'.

    If you need a translation:

    Suburban sprawl exists in US.
    Suburban sprawl exists outside of US.
    Suburban sprawl covers a much bigger area, percentage-wise in the US than anywhere else.
    Suburban sprawl has much more people living in it in the US, in comparison with any other country.
    Living in suburban sprawl in the US means you aren't able to function at all if you don't own a car.
    Living in suburban sprawl outside of the US means it's hard to function without a car but it's not as bad.

    My parents live in suburbia from hell and there's a bus going into the city every hour. There are streets with pavements. There's a community centre with a doctors' surgery offering loads of different activities (and you can actually walk there easily). And so on and so forth.

    P.S. Moscow is nothing like LA in that it actually has a city centre and pretty typical urban planning with suburbs on top of that, on the outskirts.
    Wow, that's pretty impressive meaning to fit into the phrase "nothing to the extent."
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

    from Speedy Death

  8. #108

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    There are streets with pavements.
    I wonder when we'll finally get that in suburban US?
    Creating drama!

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffisjeff View Post
    I wonder when we'll finally get that in suburban US?
    And buses going to the big city, wouldn't that be something? And a train? Going to the airport, may be? Oh wait...
    Last edited by IceAlisa; 02-25-2013 at 06:18 PM.
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

    from Speedy Death

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Suburban sprawl covers a much bigger area, percentage-wise in the US than anywhere else.
    This is so true. Almost all of Alaska, Montana, Idaho, North and South Dakota, Kansas, Nebraska, Idaho, and Utah is covered with suburban sprawl, whereas in Belgium and the Netherlands, for example, there are huge swaths of wilderness and the population is concentrated in the urban core.

  11. #111

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    "Almost all of Alaska" covered in suburban sprawl? Obviously tongue in cheek.

    For those who'd like more info...

    Population density of US States http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...lation_density

    Population density of various countries http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...lation_density

    I actually hadn't realized that the Netherlands had that high a pop. density - learn something' new every day!
    Last edited by Willowway; 02-25-2013 at 07:30 PM.

  12. #112
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    I believe Vagabond was being facetious. But I also don't think Ziggy is entirely wrong. Much of the United States is an endless suburbia. That doesn't mean the entire country is so, but even many large cities like Phoenix, Dallas, Houston, Atlanta, Detroit, are extremely spread out.
    "I miss footwork that has any kind of a discernible pattern. The goal of a step sequence should not be for a skater to show the same ice coverage as a Zamboni and take about as much time as an ice resurface. " ~ Zemgirl, reflecting on a pre-IJS straight line sequence

  13. #113
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    Facetious? Moi?! Jamais!

    But I do think that Ziggy would do well to visit the United States some time.

  14. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    But I do think that Ziggy would do well to visit the United States some time.
    Why would he want to do that? We have no fresh foods and no paved roads!
    Creating drama!

  15. #115
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    Re; cities and suburbia, There are many wonderful places in the US, and much to admire. But for inexperienced tourists, some aspects can of America be daunting. As a Canadian, one assumes that there won't be too much difference, and i've fallen into that trap. When I visisted the Humana Festival in Louisville with another middle aged woman, we taxied to a theatre for a popular show. It was still daylight and the city looked absolutely like any other city I'd been in. At the end of the evening, we asked the box office manager to call a cab. He looked at us as if we had two heads and informed us that taxies do not venture down town after dark. I explained we were tourists and asked we could get back to our hotel. He was flabberghasted by the question, and from the way he said "Americans have their own cars" and dashed away, I belive he thought we were lunatics, or at least from the moon. We had no choice but to walk, in our high heels along entirely empty, dark streets. There were no lights from on buildings, no brightly coloured signs. We were so terrified that we almost ran for half hour trip back to the hotel. There weren't even cars coming from the theatre on the streets as the underground parking lot emptied in a different direction.

    I've travelled to many cities in Europe and Asia, including those with different aphabets, but have never felt more out of my comfort zone than in Louisville. There is culture shock where you least expect it.
    Perhaps that's all Leonova meant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by morqet View Post
    It must be difficult for his skaters to deal with the number of people in his training group - he must have been at every GP this season, surely? It seems like they'd only see him in weeks they are actually competing, as the rest of the time he'd be in another country with other skaters. I remember Miki Ando travelled with him to TEB in 2010 and trained at the Bercy rink during the competition, but that's not ideal and probably not even financially possible for most skaters.
    I thought I read somewhere, the whole group travels to all of the GP events (or to all of the GP events where any Morozov's student compete, so it would probably be all of the events), so they don't see him only in the weeks they are competing, they see him all the time, but then they spend every week at different place. think it must be insane for him to arrange the rinks at every place they go.
    Last edited by hanca; 02-25-2013 at 09:49 PM.

  17. #117

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oreo View Post
    The towels in the room were so stiff from being washed with cheap soap, you could free stand them--and this was at a 4-star hotel.
    The towels may not have been stiff due to being washed with a cheap soap, they may have been starched! They do it in some parts of Eastern Europe. Don't ask me why...

  18. #118

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    You know, bashing someone's hometown or country just isn't polite, especially based on 1 visit or limited experience with the area. I've only been to Great Britain (9 times) and Canada (3 times) so I'm not internationally very well traveled, but no - things weren't like "home." Sometimes careful planning ahead was necessary. There were unexpected things that were kind of difficult, but I'm not even going to list them because generally speaking, the people everywhere we went were so lovely, who cared if there was some inconvenience? The good certainly outweighed a small amount of personal discomfort or "not getting what I was used to." BTW-I work in a very "suburban" area of Atlanta, but there is definitely great public transportation, and I know plenty of people there who don't own cars. (In fact, lots of bicycling!) Let's put blind generalizations up there with impolite bashing.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Living in suburban sprawl in the US means you aren't able to function at all if you don't own a car.
    Which is why people who don't want to own cars don't live in the suburbs.
    "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."-- Albert Einstein.

  20. #120

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    Quote Originally Posted by Holley Calmes View Post
    You know, bashing someone's hometown or country just isn't polite, especially based on 1 visit or limited experience with the area. I've only been to Great Britain (9 times) and Canada (3 times) so I'm not internationally very well traveled, but no - things weren't like "home." Sometimes careful planning ahead was necessary. There were unexpected things that were kind of difficult, but I'm not even going to list them because generally speaking, the people everywhere we went were so lovely, who cared if there was some inconvenience? The good certainly outweighed a small amount of personal discomfort or "not getting what I was used to." BTW-I work in a very "suburban" area of Atlanta, but there is definitely great public transportation, and I know plenty of people there who don't own cars. (In fact, lots of bicycling!) Let's put blind generalizations up there with impolite bashing.
    I don't think she wanted to bash anyone's country.

    The difference may be that you travelled because it was your choice, whereas she travels and it isn't her choice. Unlike you, she can't do the careful planning you suggest because as someone wrote above they move often at a very short notice. Also, most of the time (when you don't travel) you are staying at home, whereas she doesn't seem to have one place where she would stay most of time, so it appears that she doesn't know where she is going next (and when). If you are somewhere for a few months, you may put posters/photos on the wall and personalise the space, whereas it looks that she lives from the suitcase, at times staying somewhere for such a short time that it probably isn't worth personalising the space. It is gypsy lifestyle, and it can be difficult to live if it wasn't your choice. She chose the coach (Morozov) but she didn't have much choice with the lifestyle. The lifestyle comes as a package with this coach, whereas skaters who have other coaches will have more stability in their life. Someone may enjoy this, someone else may struggle with it. She is honest and she doesn't enjoy this part of the package.

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