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  1. #41
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    I just watched the performances of Leonova and Gosviani and wondered why Gosviani didn't beat Leonova outright instead. Are there protocols and break down of scores available anywhere?

    I saw solid jumping from Gosviani but for 2 botches on doubles. She landed a 3/3 and 7 triples in total (some were very slightly URed but surely under 1/4 turn, perhaps the final 3toe is < or even <<-worthy though). Leonova on the other hand toe-axelled and squeaked out all the 2toes and had a Lavrenchuk setup to the loop. 5 triples in total and nothing more than a 3lutz2toe-axel. Spins were equally lackluster for both. Gosviani displayed decent CH, TR and IN whereas Leonova really had none of those. Why she bothered to change the music when she completely ignored it is beyond me. Leonova notably had very poor ice coverage and only displayed the simplest of SS with her always 2 footed skating and no change in direction.

    I am very perplexed. Did Leonova win on TES or PCS? Neither is reasonable IMO. Please tell me many of Gosviani's jumps were <ed by a strict caller and perhaps I could understand the results a little better.

  2. #42

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    I haven't found a link to detailed protocols yet.

    SP results comparison: http://fsrussia.ru/upl/results/1213/crfinal/SEG013.HTM
    3 Николь ГОСВИЯНИ Gosviani 60.09 30.61 B 29.48 7.30 7.05 7.40 7.55 7.55 0.00 #9
    4 Алена ЛЕОНОВА Leonova 57.90 27.42 30.48 7.60 7.40 7.55 7.80 7.75 0.00 #4

    FS results comparison: http://fsrussia.ru/upl/results/1213/crfinal/SEG014.HTM
    1 Алена ЛЕОНОBA Leonova 114.09 53.85 60.24 7.60 7.35 7.45 7.60 7.65 0.00 #6
    4 Николь ГОСВИЯНИ Gosviani 105.97 47.57 58.40 7.35 7.05 7.20 7.45 7.45 0.00 #9
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  3. #43

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    I haven't watched the FP of Gosviani yet.
    Her SP youtube showed very slow skating and a wrap leg on all jumps. She may have taken minuses on her jump GOE's.
    I know Leonova has quality issues as well.
    I was quite surprised to see how 'Junior' Gosviani's skating appeared in the SP.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I am very perplexed. Did Leonova win on TES or PCS? Neither is reasonable IMO. Please tell me many of Gosviani's jumps were <ed by a strict caller and perhaps I could understand the results a little better.
    Nicole's second jumps on 3F-3T combo and single 3F were marked <, also 2T at the end of 3T-2T was <<. And the levels of other elements aren't great either, steps and layback got only level two. Leonova's levels were better and she got full credit for all of her jumps, even though half of them got negative GOE

  5. #45

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    Autumn_girl, is a link to the detailed protocols available yet?
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  6. #46

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    I believe this is the final result including protocols: http://fsrussia.ru/upl/ckeditor/35120.pdf

    It is really long since all disciplines' results are all listed.

    Ladies SP scores:
    1 Evgenia Gerasimova Евгения ГЕРАСИМОВА 64.89 37.49 27.40 6.75 6.50 6.95 7.05 7.00 0.00
    2 Polina Korobeinikova Полина КОРОБЕЙНИКОВА 61.48 33.16 28.32 7.10 6.85 7.10 7.15 7.20 0.00
    3 Nikol Gosviani Николь ГОСВИЯНИ 60.09 30.61 29.48 7.30 7.05 7.40 7.55 7.55 0.00
    4 Alena Leonova Алена ЛЕОНОВА 57.90 27.42 30.48 7.60 7.40 7.55 7.80 7.75 0.00
    5 Polina Agafonova Полина АГАФОНОВА 57.81 31.05 26.76 6.70 6.45 6.80 6.80 6.70 0.00
    6 Sofia Biryukova Софья БИРЮКОВА 51.26 23.50 27.76 6.95 6.65 6.90 7.15 7.05 0.00
    7 Alina Maksimova Алина МАКСИМОВА 50.74 28.34 23.40 6.00 5.60 5.75 5.95 5.95 1.00
    8 Tatiana Fedoseeva Татьяна ФЕДОСЕЕВА 50.56 28.64 21.92 5.50 5.30 5.50 5.60 5.50 0.00
    9 Alsu Kayumova Алсу КАЮМОВА 48.14 26.02 22.12 5.60 5.30 5.50 5.75 5.50 0.00
    10 Valentina Chernyshova Валентина ЧЕРНЫШОВА 47.41 22.61 25.80 6.55 6.25 6.20 6.70 6.55 1.00

    Alena's SP TES
    1. 3T+3T< < 7.00 -0.98 -1 -2 -1 -1 -2 -1 -2 - - 6.02
    2 3F 5.30 -1.40 -2 -2 -2 -2 -2 -2 -2 - - 3.90
    3 2A 3.30 -0.50 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 0 -1 - - 2.80
    4 LSp3 2.40 0.50 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 - - 2.90
    5 StSq3 3.30 1.00 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 - - 4.30
    6 FCSp3 2.80 0.70 2 2 1 1 1 2 1 - - 3.50
    7 CCoSp4 3.50 0.50 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 - - 4.00



    Ladies FS scores
    1 Алена ЛЕОНОВА 114.09 53.85 60.24 7.60 7.35 7.45 7.60 7.65 0.00
    2 Полина АГАФОНОВА 111.79 55.87 55.92 6.95 6.80 7.15 7.00 7.05 0.00
    3 Алсу КАЮМОВА 110.11 63.47 46.64 6.00 5.65 5.85 5.85 5.80 0.00
    4 Николь ГОСВИЯНИ 105.97 47.57 58.40 7.35 7.05 7.20 7.45 7.45 0.00
    5 Евгения ГЕРАСИМОВА 100.10 47.54 54.56 6.90 6.75 6.70 7.00 6.75 2.00
    6 Полина КОРОБЕЙНИКОВА 96.58 45.10 52.48 6.75 6.55 6.25 6.75 6.50 1.00
    7 Валентина ЧЕРНЫШОВА 94.53 44.13 50.40 6.45 6.20 6.15 6.45 6.25 0.00
    8 Татьяна ФЕДОСЕЕВА 91.12 48.28 43.84 5.65 5.30 5.45 5.45 5.55 1.00
    9 Алина МАКСИМОВА 81.23 40.95 43.28 5.75 5.25 5.25 5.50 5.30 3.00


    Alena's FS TES
    1 3T 4.10 -1.40 -2 -2 -2 -2 -2 -2 -2 - - 2.70
    2 3Lo 5.10 0.70 1 0 1 1 1 1 1 - - 5.80
    3 3Lz+2T e 7.30 -0.84 -1 -1 -1 -2 -1 -1 -2 - - 6.46
    4 FCSp3 2.80 0.50 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 - - 3.30
    5 3F+2T 6.60 -0.70 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 -1 - - 5.90
    6 3S+2T 6.05 x -0.70 -1 -1 -2 -1 0 0 -2 - - 5.35
    7 3F 5.83 x 0.28 1 0 0 1 0 1 0 - - 6.11
    8 2A 3.63 x 0.30 0 0 0 1 1 1 1 - - 3.93
    9 StSq3 3.30 0.80 1 2 1 2 2 2 1 - - 4.10
    10 ChSq1 2.00 0.70 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 - - 2.70
    11 CCoSp4 3.50 0.50 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 - - 4.00
    12 CSSp4 3.00 0.50 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 - - 3.50
    53.21 ------- 53.85
    Last edited by l'etoile; 02-20-2013 at 05:21 PM.

  7. #47

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    Thanks, l'etoile! I've cross-posted the link in the Russian Cup competition thread in Kiss and Cry: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...=1#post3843499

    Senior Ladies SP protocol starts on page 85.
    Last edited by Sylvia; 02-20-2013 at 05:22 PM.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  8. #48
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    why everyone is so low sotnikova place? in my opinion it would be in the top five at world championships
    Last edited by anna1506; 02-20-2013 at 11:13 PM.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by anna1506 View Post
    why everyone is so low sotnikova place? in my opinion it would be in the top five at world championships
    She's never been consistent.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    She's never been consistent.
    There was a time when she was THE definition of consistency.

    And then she grew

  11. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    She's never been consistent.
    That's not entirely true. She was very consistent the season she won Junior Worlds (I think she fell like, once). She has been adjusting to puberty and growth since.

  12. #52
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    Yes thank you for the history lesson, you are both right of course.

  13. #53
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    Don't be dissing our girl, Ziggy.
    Those who never succeed themselves are always the first to tell you how.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    Thanks, l'etoile! I've cross-posted the link in the Russian Cup competition thread in Kiss and Cry: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...=1#post3843499

    Senior Ladies SP protocol starts on page 85.
    I wonder if the tough calling was deliberate. The judging was very pro-Leonova. Her PCS was outrageous and how did she get +1s on the loop?!?!?!

  15. #55
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    can someone explain what is a toe-axel?
    how do you guys notice it? thanks in advance

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by robinhood View Post
    can someone explain what is a toe-axel?
    how do you guys notice it? thanks in advance
    When skaters do a toe-loop, (for anti-clockwise skaters) they jump from a RBO edge, with a toe assist from the left foot. The left toe-pick should pick into the ice straight back (though on multi rotational jumps, the toe goes in at a slight angle but more or less still backwards). If a skater toe axels, they'll open the left side up and plant the toe-pick into the ice facing forwards and spring up to the jump from that position, so that it is much more like they have done an axel instead of a double toe (or double axel if it is a triple toe-loop attempt).

    The one skater that stands out as having a toe-axel was Mao's sister Mai Asada. In trying to find footage of her toe-loops I found her world juniors LP from 2003 in which she attempted 3A-2T (i didn't remember Mai trying the 3A too!). If you go to the end of the clip here you can see how she puts the toe in forwards http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PcNa89WPaQ
    Last edited by antmanb; 02-21-2013 at 02:29 PM.

  17. #57
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    ^^I didn't realize Mai did the 3A too (although it wasn't ratified). I didn't start paying attention to junior skating until 2007-2008...Did she ever try that at the senior level?

    Another toe-axel standout was Kimmie Meissner. The second jump in basically all of her 3-3s was a toe-axel...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...aoEWyBeQ#t=57s

  18. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    ^^I didn't realize Mai did the 3A too (although it wasn't ratified). I didn't start paying attention to junior skating until 2007-2008...Did she ever try that at the senior level?

    Another toe-axel standout was Kimmie Meissner. The second jump in basically all of her 3-3s was a toe-axel...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...aoEWyBeQ#t=57s
    I don't know about that - the 3F+3T looked good to me - and if you watch it in slow motion at the end, the pick in on the 3T is about right - her body is still facing in the right direction and the toe isn't turned out more than about 1/3 which is is fairly normal. The 3T on the back of the 3Lz is more open and could arguably be a toe-axel.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I wonder if the tough calling was deliberate. The judging was very pro-Leonova. Her PCS was outrageous and how did she get +1s on the loop?!?!?!
    Yes, seeing those protocols, I take back what I said.

    Leonova has been ridiculously overmarked. There is no way she deserved those PCS for those weak, uninspired performances and the GOEs were very questionable as well.

  20. #60

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    her goe on jumps was almost all negative and pcs barely higher then agafanova lol. For some people I guess only 1's or 2's would make sense for leonova.

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