Can Kevin Reynolds overtake Patrick Chan as Canadian Number 1?

[essence_of_soy]

If someone posted "Can Reynolds overtake Hanyu and Takahashi" a month everyone would have said no, never.

If Reynolds skates two perfect programs, and Chan bombs, then yes I think its possible for Reynolds to win over Chan. Chan doesn't seem to be getting the "he must win no matter how he skates" treatment from the judges this season and Reynolds' stock is going up.

But if "overtake" means Reynolds permanently overtaking Chan as the #1 Canadian guy overall, then I think that's incredibly doubtful given the disparity of skating quality. Chan is still the overwhelming favorite for Canada and I think will remain so until he retires.

Remember when nobody thought Jeff Buttle could be beaten at the national level and Chan took the title in 2008. Granted, Jeff's free program wasn't clean but at the time, Buttle was the reigning master of CoP, too.

[Japanfan]

The question should really be "could Chan and/or Hanyu and/or Takahashi all skate poorly enough to fall behind Kevin?" That's how to frame the discussion since there was less overtaking happening and more screwing up. This conversation is more relevant now because Kevin has broken from the 150-160 pack to begin to approach the others....so he's a bit above the radar.
To 'overtake' you need a big tech base, about 8-10 pts of GOE and PCS well into the 8s. Kevin doesn't have enough of that to control his destiny.

I don't think either of the articles are proclaiming him to be a world podium contender, but rather saying that he could be. Kevin did in fact beat two of the world's best skaters. There have been plenty of times when the top skaters didn't skate their best and it came down to who made the least mistakes as no one went clean.

Yes, Kevin's win was fluke and the stars lined up for him. But he earned it fair and square, more fair and square than Sandhu's GPF win over Plush when Plush lost the title due to a zayack.

Kevin may never again have such a perfect skate but he will always be the 2013 FCC Men's Champ.

And I hope he gets some confidence from the event. If Patrick doesn't defend his title at World's he'll need to improve upon his 12th place finish last season for us to get three men on the Olympic team.

[Ziggy]

What I find extremely frustrating is that Reynolds probably could have been really successful with a proper coach. Who would work on improving his basics and fixing his jumps. But no, he's stuck with McLeod and all he can hope for with her is fluke performances like the one at 4CC where he'll stand up on his jumps and where the cheats will be less than 1/4. He deserves better.

[overedge]

I thought McLeod's quotes were reasonable -- for her -- this time:

Sylvia, I'd agree with you if it wasn't for this one:

"I think what happened with Kevin at Four Continents is, suddenly people are saying, ‘Holy (crap), this guy is capable of taking it all,’ ”

If the story had quotes from other people reflecting the same opinion, I might believe that "people" are actually "saying" such a thing. But as it is, especially with Reynolds' past inconsistencies, it sounds IMO like the usual delusional hot air, or pre-Worlds politicking.

[cbd1235]

If Reynolds overtakes Chan as Canadian #1 then I'll not so shyly pretend I'm no longer Canadian....

[Sasha'sSpins]

I doubt it. I think Patrick would pretty much have to implode.

[FunnyBut]

I would rather Sarah Hughes came back and won a second Olympic Gold Medal

[Nomad]

What I find extremely frustrating is that Reynolds probably could have been really successful with a proper coach. Who would work on improving his basics and fixing his jumps. But no, he's stuck with McLeod and all he can hope for with her is fluke performances like the one at 4CC where he'll stand up on his jumps and where the cheats will be less than 1/4. He deserves better.

This.

[Spun Silver]

Sylvia, I'd agree with you if it wasn't for this one:


If the story had quotes from other people reflecting the same opinion, I might believe that "people" are actually "saying" such a thing. But as it is, especially with Reynolds' past inconsistencies, it sounds IMO like the usual delusional hot air, or pre-Worlds politicking.

Both Dai and Yuzuru singled out Kevin before 4Cs or at least before the FP as one whose strengths they had observed with respect. I doubt they think less of him now.

I was amazed by KR at 4Cs. The ugly duckling has turned into a soulful and brilliant performer. Who knows who will slip on the ice next but at the moment his trajectory is upward and Patrick's I am not so sure about. I am hoping he will kindly delay his dominance of the sport until after Sochi, however.

[Ziggy]

I would rather Sarah Hughes came back and won a second Olympic Gold Medal

AAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH! Stop scaring me!

[triple_toe]

I think Kevin suffers a bit from the perception of how bad his skating used to be. I've certainly done my share of Kevin bashing, from his ridiculous styling to his non-existent choreography and poor skating skills. But to be quite honest, looking at his skating today it's clear he has spent a lot of time on fixing those things. His long program especially has complex, musical choreography. His posture is good (has a beautifully arched back) and he has some lovely port de bras. Even his spins are pretty good. Yes, he has a long way to go, but he's come a long way as well. When I tried to look at his program objectively, instead of seeing it through a "Kevin Reynolds is all jumps and terrible skating" lens, I started to appreciate him much more.

Do I think he's on the level of Patrick's skating? No. Nor Daisuke's or even Hanyu's. But if he knocks it out of the park at worlds, he deserves to be up there. Part of being a good skater is being a good competitor. Worlds and the Olympics are not a lifetime achievement award or even an indicator of who is the best figure skater in the world. It's who is better on that day. God knows we've seen that proved time and time again in skating.

[ks777]

Kevin is slow and even his jumps while he does land them are not really that impressive or big. He just doesn't impress me in any way.

ITA. He is not a powerful jumper nor skater. I could never watch his skating twice.. so boring and nothing is impressive. His lack of power in his skating, height on his jump and technique on his jumps reminds me of a lady's skating.

[Rock2]

In McLeod's defense ( :::: looking around :::: who just said that?? )
She has to be talking up her skater to help fuel the perception that he's coming on strong. Publicly understating his skills and results wouldn't really serve much purpose.
I just hope behind the scenes she's telling Kevin he's got a ways to go, for his sake.

[skateboy]

I just hope behind the scenes she's telling Kevin he's got a ways to go, for his sake.

This.

[PeterG]

ITA. He is not a powerful jumper nor skater. I could never watch his skating twice.. so boring and nothing is impressive. His lack of power in his skating, height on his jump and technique on his jumps reminds me of a lady's skating.

Is it okay if I use " 'You skate like a girl' - ks777" as my new signature?

[PinkFeathers]

I wouldn't say it's a case of 'Can he' but 'Should he' because... I'd have to say no. He has jumps, granted, but that's it. Not the same quality of skating, speed, edges, expression. I say this as no real fan of pchan -- I can appreciate the prettiness of his skating without liking it. I just don't want to live in world where none of the artistic and performance parts are pushed aside for jumping beans like Kevin and Max. Had Patrick been at 4cc, and skated clean (or even just mostly clean with the way that comp went) he would have beat the crap out of Kevin in PCS alone.

[essence_of_soy]

Is it okay if I use " 'You skate like a girl' - ks777" as my new signature?

Don't let Tonya Harding see that. She'd run you over with her pick - up truck.

[Jaana]

Can Kevin Reynolds overtake Patrick Chan as Canadian Number 1?

Definetely not! Reynolds was extremely lucky at 4CC. He cannot compete against e.g Chan, Takahashi, Hanyu or Fernandez if they manage about 80 % of their potential.

[Jaana]

deleted (double posting)

[spikydurian]

But if he knocks it out of the park at worlds, he deserves to be up there. Part of being a good skater is being a good competitor. Worlds and the Olympics are not a lifetime achievement award or even an indicator of who is the best figure skater in the world. It's who is better on that day. God knows we've seen that proved time and time again in skating.

That's life!