Oscar Pistorius on murder charge

[Zemgirl]

(I wonder how long until he goes to trial. That article about the poor conditions for those who don't get bail said the guy had been waiting 2 years for a trial- and living with people with drug resistant TB! That shouldn't be allowed under Human Rights law! Purposefully exposing people to contagious diseases.) Because this is a 'celebrity' I bet it doesn't take 2 years to get a trial.

The OJ case took about a year to come to trial, didn't it? (ETA: I was wrong, it started earlier than I remembered) The case here is high profile and considering how things have gone so far, I am sure the police and prosecutors will want to make sure that the investigation is done right (or at least looks to have been done right).

Re famous murder/kidnapping cases - The Black Dahlia was a notorious Hollywood murder with a brunette victim, but that was a long time ago. Lacy Peterson was a brunette, and IIRC Jessica Lunsford was not a blonde. Those are the ones I can recall, and it feels kind of ghoulish to go looking for others. But I agree that certain crime victims seem to be much more interesting to the media than others.

[Jenny]

Meh, ghoulish maybe, but I've long ago stopped apologizing. My mother has never understood how I can read murder mysteries and watch crime dramas because it's all so horrible, when it fact is was her mother who got me into it at a young age - she loved what she called "whodunnits" and I remember many hours watching them on tv with her when I was a child, and going through her entire collection of Agatha Christie novels. But I don't like slasher movies - and I don't think it's a coincidence that it's the same grandmother whose Dell puzzle books fascinated me, logic problems being our favourites.

[Zemgirl]

Meh, ghoulish maybe, but I've long ago stopped apologizing. My mother has never understood how I can read murder mysteries and watch crime dramas because it's all so horrible, when it fact is was her mother who got me into it at a young age - she loved what she called "whodunnits" and I remember many hours watching them on tv with her when I was a child, and going through her entire collection of Agatha Christie novels. But I don't like slasher movies - and I don't think it's a coincidence that it's the same grandmother whose Dell puzzle books fascinated me, logic problems being our favourites.

I don't think there's anything wrong with being interested in either true crime or mysteries and TV crime dramas. The former is just not something I personally feel comfortable reading about, and I'd rather leave the details to others... I did notice did Wikipedia has an entry on Missing white woman syndrome, BTW, which seems relevant to the current discussion here.

[heckles]

I did notice did Wikipedia has an entry on Missing white woman syndrome, BTW, which seems relevant to the current discussion here.

There is a good program on BET about missing black people, Find Our Missing. I'm glad that someone finally addressed the issue rather than whining, "The media doesn't show what I want them to show."

[Ziggy]

the decision is more a result of a pressure killer
I stand by pistorius being guilty

At this stage you don't have any evidence to base this statement on, so you're just making a fool of yourself.

[heckles]

Any word on the two cell phones that were found in the toilet room, neither of which were the one used by Pistorius to call his friend? Seems off that a woman apparently takes two phones into the bathroom at 3 am if she's just taking a whiz.

[Ziggy]

Any word on the two cell phones that were found in the toilet room, neither of which were the one used by Pistorius to call his friend? Seems off that a woman apparently takes two phones into the bathroom at 3 am if she's just taking a whiz.

Heckles - a fan of golden showers.

[orbitz]

Any word on the two cell phones that were found in the toilet room, neither of which were the one used by Pistorius to call his friend? Seems off that a woman apparently takes two phones into the bathroom at 3 am if she's just taking a whiz.

1. The phones could've been left in the bathroom the evening before.

2. Maybe she wanted to do a quick browse of the internet while whizzing.

3. Could've been just a habit to take the phone with her. Many people are attached to their phones and won't go anywhere without them.

[Coco]

If you are sleeping with someone who is bothered by the light from the ipad or smart phone, um, I could see taking them into the bathroom. Weird that she had 2 with her, though. I wonder who they were registered to.

[Jenny]

Is there are credible source for the location of the phones, and that idea that Oscar didn't use either to make calls? (I could see where one he was using might be dropped in the toilet room after he made the first calls after he found her.) The only mention of technologies I've seen to date is that Reeva's iPad was on the bed or on the floor near the bed.

[Jenny]

On another note, I'm wondering how the process works now. He's been charged with premeditated murder, so the trial (tribunal?) will consider that charge and determine guilty or not guilty. If they decide it was not premeditated and was an accident, will they declare him guilty of that lesser charge at that time? And then what is the punishment for that?

Because here's what I'm thinking - he's admitted he killed her, so it's just a matter if he meant to do it or not. At some point, he's due to go to jail, length of time tbd.

So if that's the case, why is he free now? As a confessed killer, shouldn't he have gone straight to jail, with time served to be credited to whatever sentence he eventually gets?

Or is there a chance that he could somehow dodge jail altogether, in which case yeah, grant bail pending trial.

[Ziggy]

He's confessed but he hasn't been found guilty yet.

[Vash01]

On another note, I'm wondering how the process works now. He's been charged with premeditated murder, so the trial (tribunal?) will consider that charge and determine guilty or not guilty. If they decide it was not premeditated and was an accident, will they declare him guilty of that lesser charge at that time? And then what is the punishment for that?

Because here's what I'm thinking - he's admitted he killed her, so it's just a matter if he meant to do it or not. At some point, he's due to go to jail, length of time tbd.

So if that's the case, why is he free now? As a confessed killer, shouldn't he have gone straight to jail, with time served to be credited to whatever sentence he eventually gets?

Or is there a chance that he could somehow dodge jail altogether, in which case yeah, grant bail pending trial.

I think the South African law makes that determination.

[Jenny]

I think the South African law makes that determination.

Gee thanks for that insightful response to my honest question.

I'm not a lawyer, and certainly not an expert in the laws of South Africa, so I'm just trying to understand why some people who confess to a crime are granted bail until trial, and others are kept in jail with the time credited to whatever sentence is eventually ruled.

[heckles]

Is there are credible source for the location of the phones, and that idea that Oscar didn't use either to make calls?

The two-phones-in-the-toilet-room aspect was mentioned on CNN last night. ABC News says there were two Blackberries, two iPhones, and a fifth phone, the latter of which, according to defense attorneys, was used by Pistorius.

[orbitz]

^ That's a lot of phones between two people.

[Prancer]

Gee thanks for that insightful response to my honest question.

I'm not a lawyer, and certainly not an expert in the laws of South Africa, so I'm just trying to understand why some people who confess to a crime are granted bail until trial, and others are kept in jail with the time credited to whatever sentence is eventually ruled.

Maybe it's based on whether the accused is a flight risk or threat to the community, just like any other bail situation? Even if a person confesses, he hasn't been found guilty yet. Lots of people confess without having actually done anything, so the presumption of innocence still stands, I think.

The two-phones-in-the-toilet-room aspect was mentioned on CNN last night. ABC News says there were two Blackberries, two iPhones, and a fifth phone, the latter of which, according to defense attorneys, was used by Pistorius.

Pistorius says he called the manager of the housing estate, and asked him to place a call for an ambulance. He says that he also called a private paramedic service. According to his lawyers, there was a fifth phone that Pistorius used to make the calls.

He had to make the calls from somewhere (I think it's on the record that they were received, I believe), and he didn't use any of the other phones, so there must be a fifth phone. I think I read somewhere that he also called his best friend (first, too, I think) and his sister?

[Rafter]

I read an article yesterday that said something like the now former lead detective (Botha) testified that he'd been to Pistorious's house before re: a domestic violence issue with another woman. It will be interesting to see if anything more of this comes to light during the trial. Too bad Botha has turned out to be such a disaster.

[heckles]

I think I read somewhere that he also called his best friend (first, too, I think) and his sister?

He called his friend, Justin Divaris, but it's unsurprising that his defense team is not highlighting that questionable move. Doesn't make him look good.

[Prancer]

I read an article yesterday that said something like the now former lead detective (Botha) testified that he'd been to Pistorious's house before re: a domestic violence issue with another woman. It will be interesting to see if anything more of this comes to light during the trial. Too bad Botha has turned out to be such a disaster.

That's been discussed somewhere back in this thread--he was at a party and slammed a door in a woman's face. The charges were dropped. I think he has a suit filed for malicious prosecution in that case.

Otherwise, I don't think anyone has uncovered any domestic violence history, and a women he dated for five years has been one of his staunchest defenders,

He called his friend, Justin Divaris, but it's unsurprising that his defense team is not highlighting that questionable move. Doesn't make him look good.

Yes, but mentions of the fifth phone in the media always seem to imply that there is something shady about this fifth phone. The police seem to know who he called and when, there is no question that there was another phone at the scene, and it doesn't seem like here's anything being hidden, so .

I think the fact that his lawyer got there before the police did looks worse than his calling his friend, although I'm not sure whether that looks worse for him or for the police .