Oscar Pistorius on murder charge

[allezfred]

Indeed, because when I think of what's fresh and relevant, I think of the guy who channels Ernie from My Three Sons.

You're very environmentally friendly with all the recycling you're doing in this thread.

[heckles]

You're very environmentally friendly with all the recycling you're doing in this thread.

Likewise, I am forever impressed at your ability to reuse your cranky-old-alkie routine.

[Zemgirl]

In rapid succession, Pistorius and Lance Armstrong have ruined their "physically-challenged athlete becomes a role model" narratives. Hopefully, surfer Bethany Hamilton doesn't come out as a tweaker next month.

Are you suggesting that doping and murdering a woman are comparable offenses?

I'll qualify this by noting that even if Pistorius is a jerk with a nasty past, his guilt has not been proven in court.

[Gazpacho]

Are you suggesting that doping and murdering a woman are comparable offenses?

I can't speak for heckles, but my interpretation of their comment is that our society makes heroes out of athletes. That hero persona is based on their athletic accomplishments, in this case their athletic accomplishments in the face of enormous physical challenges. Our society assumes that heroism athletically equates to goodness in a non-athletic context, and the athletes often actively fuel that assumption. But that assumption can be unwarranted.

I didn't see the comment as equating murder and doping, not in the least.

[Zemgirl]

I can't speak for heckles, but my interpretation of their comment is that our society makes heroes out of athletes. That hero persona is based on their athletic accomplishments, in this case their athletic accomplishments in the face of enormous physical challenges. Our society assumes that heroism athletically equates to goodness in a non-athletic context, and the athletes often actively fuel that assumption. But that assumption can be unwarranted.

I didn't see the comment as equating murder and doping, not in the least.

I don't know what heckles was getting at, but there have been a number of cases of athletes charged and sometimes convicted of violent crimes, so I don't see why Armstrong was the most relevant comparison. Other than recency and the involvement of high-profile athletes, the two cases have little in common. It goes without saying that there's quite a difference between someone whose fall from grace was due to doping - a sports-related offense - and someone who likely committed murder.

[Gazpacho]

I don't know what heckles was getting at, but there have been a number of cases of athletes charged and sometimes convicted of violent crimes, so I don't see why Armstrong was the most relevant comparison. Other than recency and the involvement of high-profile athletes, the two cases have little in common. It goes without saying that there's quite a difference between someone whose fall from grace was due to doping - a sports-related offense - and someone who likely committed murder.

It's foremost the recency of it. The other similarity is that these were both athletes exalted for their overcoming of physical challenges, and society extended their ability to overcome their physical challenges into assumptions about their goodness as people. The athletes themselves parlayed that perception into fame, fortune, and influence. These two were held up as role models and inspirations in ways that other elite athletes have not been.

The offenses are naturally not comparable, but the shattering of their good-guy perception has similarities. Another way to put it is that the cases are very dissimilar in their severity and victimization of others, but they are similar in making society question some of its tendencies.

Sort of switching topics--A lady posted a comment at the bottom of a news article that I found worth repeating. Her child also has two prosthetic legs. Until they saw Oscar Pistorius at the Olympics, they were ashamed and felt hopeless. But Oscar Pistorius, even though they had never met him, gave the child the confidence to stand up for themselves to bullies, push themselves to try new physical activities, and re-evaluate what they felt was possible for themselves. Children like these are among society's most vulnerable, and they need a role model like Oscar Pistorius. (To a lesser extent, Lance Armstrong had this effect among some cancer survivors who were physically traumatized by the disease and the side effects of the treatment--another similarity to the Pistorius case.)

This mother is struggling with how to break the news to the child. The child is 5 or 6 years old and may not understand the concept of murder or even death.

I'm not a parent, so I ask the parents on this board--what would you do?

[heckles]

I don't know what heckles was getting at, but there have been a number of cases of athletes charged and sometimes convicted of violent crimes, so I don't see why Armstrong was the most relevant comparison.

Armstrong was cited as a recent example of "physically-challenged athlete becomes a role model" narrative. You're right that the sports world in general has plenty of cretins.

[Prancer]

Apparently he is claiming the shooting was an accident?

If what is reported here is true, I don't see how he intends to make a case for an accident: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1226579685203

How do you accidentally shoot someone four times? Through a door yet?

[Ziggy]

Well I guess he just happened to walk down the corridor holding a loaded gun as one does in South Africa, given the crime rate, and then he tripped and whilst he was falling down, he accidentally fired the gun four times. That's totally plausible.

[Vash01]

Children like these are among society's most vulnerable, and they need a role model like Oscar Pistorius. (To a lesser extent, Lance Armstrong had this effect among some cancer survivors who were physically traumatized by the disease and the side effects of the treatment--another similarity to the Pistorius case.)

This mother is struggling with how to break the news to the child. The child is 5 or 6 years old and may not understand the concept of murder or even death.

I'm not a parent, so I ask the parents on this board--what would you do?

I am not a parent either, but my opinion is that she does not need to tell him anything right now. After he grows up enough to understand, she can explain that a person can be good in someways and not in other, and to follow only the good in him. Right now he has no concept of death/murder/bullets, etc.- that is assuming he does not hear it from other children. That could complicate matters and in that case the mother can explain the same thing.

[Zemgirl]

Apparently he is claiming the shooting was an accident?

If what is reported here is true, I don't see how he intends to make a case for an accident: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1226579685203

How do you accidentally shoot someone four times? Through a door yet?

It can happen if you believe you are at risk, and in a place with a high crime rate, I can see how someone would believe that. Take a look at this case, for instance - the guy fired three shots, thinking home invaders were threatening him and his daughter. He was tragically wrong.

That's not to say this is what happened in this case, of course, and I don't get the firing through a door thing, either.

BTW, the link you posted requires login to view anything past the first paragraph.

[IceAlisa]

Reports of arguing prior to the shooting are in conflict with the burglary defense. And again, shooting through a door, presumably a bathroom door are also hard to reconcile with that. Was she inside the bathroom?

[twinsissv]

There must have been so many children in need of prostheses who were counting on his foundation for help. How sad for them.

[equatorial]

According to the latest reports, the victim was wearing a night gown, she also had suffered a head injury prior to her death, and a blooded cricket bat was discovered at the scene.

[orbitz]

Article

This is chilling:

Steenkamp was reportedly cowering inside the bathroom after a late-night fight when Pistorius blasted four 9-mm. bullets through the door, authorities said. Steenkamp, struck in the head, hip, arm and hand, was mortally wounded.

I wonder why the authorities are going after the premeditated murder charge instead of something like involuntary manslaughter, for example. I think it was a crime of passion that happened in an instance of rage and not something that he had planned to do, since early reports said that a panicked Pistorius tried to revive Steenkamp after the shooting. If it was planned then I think he would have probably killed himself also.

It's such a sad story. Two young lives with bright futures and their families are completely ruined.

I personally would never date someone with a gun in his house, especially if the person has shown any type of temper. People are just too darn quick to grab that gun as a mean to resolve problem.

[Anita18]

This diagram of how it happened is from a South African newspaper: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BDSizBgCAAAI5x0.jpg

If accurate, it is immensely incriminating.

[millyskate]

It truly is a horrible crime. I do wonder if drugs were involved.

[BigB08822]

Wow, he sure seems guilty as hell if all this is true. He shot her first, in plain sight, after allegedly hitting her with a cricket bat. Then she runs into the bathroom and he shoots through a door 3 times and kills her. There is no way that was an accident. What a monster.

[heckles]

If it was planned then I think he would have probably killed himself also.

Is there statistical data that suggests that most premeditated murders also involve suicide?

[orbitz]

^^ I was only guessing for someone in Pistorius's position. If he had planned the murder then he must have had also thought about the consequence of its aftermath; He's only 26 and has looks, fame, money, popularity, etc. It's going to be hell giving all of that up for a lifetime in prison. So if the murder was premeditated, I think someone like him would've chosen suicide over going to prison.