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  1. #21
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    More from AP:

    .. police spokesperson Brigadier Denise Beukes said that Pistorius was at his home at the time of the death of Steenkamp and “there is no other suspect involved.”

    “Yes there are witnesses and there have also been interviews this morning,” Beukes told reporters outside the gated complex where Pistorius lived. “We are talking about neighbours and people that heard things that happened earlier in the evening and when the shooting took place.”
    Doesn't sound like another quiet evening in the neighbourhood, disturbed only by an intruder.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by oleada View Post
    With the mentions of previous domestic disturbances and her being shot 4 times, I have a harr time believing this is a case ot mistaken identity
    I agree, oleada. Being shot four times and the other domestic disturbances seem to point to this being an example of violent behavior escalating. Certainly, we have to wait for all the evidence, but I agree with oleada.

    How unbelievably sad for this woman and her family.

  3. #23

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    Did they live together? If you're in bed and you hear a noise and your girlfriend isn't in bed with you, wouldn't you first assume that it was your girlfriend making that noise?

  4. #24
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    I would like to get more information on this.. as from what our news said the assault he was arrested for was because a woman had broken into his apt and he forced her out and a piece of wood fell on her from the door but the charges were dropped? I think the fact that there was yelling and screaming (apparently) would suggest that it wasn't an accident.. but again would like some more information.. I am biased anyway (against him) as I always thought he seemed arrogant.. and I don't like his accent
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  5. #25

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    Pistorius Charged With Murder in Shooting of Girlfriend: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/15/sp...th-africa.html
    Early news reports here that Mr. Pistorius, a gun enthusiast, had accidentally shot his girlfriend, thinking she was intruder, gave way to grim police news conferences announcing previous law enforcement complaints about domestic incidents at his home and the current charges of murder. The development stunned a nation that had elevated Mr. Pistorius to the status of a national sporting hero, an emblem of the ability to overcome acute adversity and a symbol of South Africa’s ability to project achievements onto the world stage.

    “He was an icon for South Africa,” said Hennie Kotze, one of the coaches who worked with Mr. Pistorius as part of the 400-meter relay at the London Olympics. “It was the way he handled his disability with such character and discipline. It is a big shock for everyone.”

    Mr. Pistorius was arrested on Thursday and taken to a Pretoria jail, where he will spend the night in anticipation of a bail hearing to be held Friday morning. The police have said that they plan to oppose bail in the case.
    Reuters article: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...91D0AE20130214
    [Reeva] Steenkamp's colleagues in the modeling world were distraught. "We are all devastated. Her family is in shock," her agent, Sarita Tomlinson, tearfully told Reuters. "They did have a good relationship. Nobody actually knows what happened."
    ...
    Steenkamp, a regular on the South African social scene, was reported to have been dating Pistorius for several months.

    In the social pages of last weekend's Sunday Independent she described him as having "impeccable" taste. "His gifts are always thoughtful," she was quoted as saying.

    Some of her last Twitter postings indicated she was looking forward to Valentine's Day on Thursday. "What do you have up your sleeve for your love tomorrow???" she posted.
    Last edited by Sylvia; 02-14-2013 at 10:12 PM.
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  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4rkidz View Post
    I would like to get more information on this.. as from what our news said the assault he was arrested for was because a woman had broken into his apt and he forced her out and a piece of wood fell on her from the door but the charges were dropped?
    The CNN story said his arrest in 2009 was because of something that happened at a party (not someone breaking into his home):
    Pistorius was arrested and accused of common assault in 2009, but the case was thrown out because of a lack of evidence, police told CNN on Thursday. That incident involved Pistorius allegedly slamming a door during a party, and a piece of the door fell off and hit someone, said Capt. Marissa Van der Merwe of South African police.
    Not even sure at this point if this information is correct -- will have to wait and see what is reported in coming days.
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  7. #27

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    Last edited by Sylvia; 02-14-2013 at 10:21 PM.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeperryfan View Post
    Yeah, but shooting someone in the arm only makes sense if a) you're a lousy shot or b) you're trying to stop them from using a weapon or c) you're doing it on purpose to disguise the scene , so shooting arm and then head is what people would do for stopping an intruder with a gun quickly, if you shoot them in the chest they could still shoot you back... at least that's what I've seen in movies.

    I agree that it's preventable, but I also imagine that a person who can't walk without prosthetics would enter survival mode much faster than the average Joe and wouldn't even think before acting, of course we don't know enough details about this case but so far it's a feasible scenario. From the accounts I've read of house invasions in South Africa they are much more brutal than in the US, I don't think most people there would ask anything before acting.Again, I'm not saying any of this happened, at this point nothing conclusive has been reported. Apparently the police isn't very willing to endorse the mistake scenario so that could be a clue...
    You may have a point there.

    Quote Originally Posted by oleada View Post
    With the mentions of previous domestic disturbances and her being shot 4 times, I have a harr time believing this is a case ot mistaken identity
    Even though it is hard to believe it, it is still possible that it could have been a case of mistaken identity in this sad event.

    We just don't have enough information to draw conclusions at this time. We may have to wait and see what the courts in SA decide.

  9. #29
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    How can anyone shoot such a gorgeous person?
    Happiness is being married to your best friend!

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    You may have a point there.
    That someone without legs has a higher survival instinct and therefore it's understandable that they would shoot somebody without thinking more quickly than an able-bodied person? Is there any scientific evidence to support that?



    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post

    Even though it is hard to believe it, it is still possible that it could have been a case of mistaken identity in this sad event.

    We just don't have enough information to draw conclusions at this time. We may have to wait and see what the courts in SA decide.
    We have plenty of information to draw conclusions and they are all pointing to it not being a case of mistaken identity.
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  11. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by joeperryfan View Post
    You bet... I was just reading an article about this on a portuguese site it had such gems as "... the police charged him with homicide(translated from portuguese so I don't know what the actual accusation was) so the the hypothesis of accidental murder was discarded..." , erm, what exactly do they think would have been the charge had it been an accident? The degree or murder differs but t's still murder even if accidental...
    No, it's still homicide even if it's accidental, but murder requires intent.

    All murders are homicides, but not all homicides are murders.

    At least in English. I don't know how the words are used in Portuguese.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by FGRSK8 View Post
    How can anyone shoot such a gorgeous person?
    Would it have been better if she were ugly?
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  13. #33

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    If he had a semiautomatic weapon shooting four times might still be mistaken identity intruder situation.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by manhn View Post
    Did they live together? If you're in bed and you hear a noise and your girlfriend isn't in bed with you, wouldn't you first assume that it was your girlfriend making that noise?
    My first thought too. We don't have a gun at home, but we have a big heavy flashlight by the bed and a crowbar in the closet. When I come home from work/gym at 2am (which I sometimes do), my fiance never has either in his hands thinking I'm an intruder.

    Quote Originally Posted by allezfred View Post
    That someone without legs has a higher survival instinct and therefore it's understandable that they would shoot somebody without thinking more quickly than an able-bodied person? Is there any scientific evidence to support that?
    In the same vein, it also could be argued that smaller women are justified in shooting first, asking later...

  15. #35

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    Was she driving an unfamiliar car? That's the only way I would find the mistaken intruder theory plausible. Each car has a sound, and a familiar car pulling into the driveway sounds different than an unfamiliar car.

    I imagine that a gated community with high profile residents would have security cameras that could provide more information.

  16. #36
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    I admit I was stunned when I heard this today. I certainly never would've guessed. Proof once again that you never truly no someone especially when you only no them through the media and the image they present. Interestingly enough tonight on a sports radio station they had a writer from Sports Illustrated that followed him and they asked him if he was surprised. He said he wasn't surprised that something happened but surprised that it ended up being a murder charge. He said Pistorious lived fast and that he was aware he needed to make changes but that no one around him ever seemed to want to intervene. He stated that there had been numerous incidents(public drunkeness, calls to police for domestic 'incidents', etc) but that you really couldn't report on them because you were looked down on. Pistorious was a hero, polite to the media, and inspiration and to do anything to taint that was frowned upon. He then spoke to how it should be the responsibility of the media to report on the facts no matter what because maybe in some way it could've helped. It's just so sad for the poor womans family. She seemed so hopeful and lovely and now she's gone and Oscar Pistorious will forever be remembered as a murderer instead of everything else good that he use to be.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeperryfan View Post
    You bet... I was just reading an article about this on a portuguese site it had such gems as "... the police charged him with homicide(translated from portuguese so I don't know what the actual accusation was) so the the hypothesis of accidental murder was discarded..." , erm, what exactly do they think would have been the charge had it been an accident? The degree or murder differs but t's still murder even if accidental....
    Manslaughter, perhaps? Or does South Africa now have that legal category?
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  18. #38
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    Very sad news
    My thoughts are with her family and friends.

  19. #39
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    It's a tragedy that this happened, though it's strange that in all the statements regarding domestic abuse, more attention was initially paid to people carrying weapons than the very high rate of domestic violence in South Africa. I haven't done anything in this field for a few years, but when I was working with an NGO in Ghana we did review the substantive differences in domestic violence legislation between Ghana and South Africa.

    South Africa has been quite aggressive in its DV legislation to try and give a public forum for this problem, but it was spurred into this because the rate of actual physical, economic or emotional violence was thought to be very high. At a forum I attended in Ghana, a spokesperson from a pan-African women's rights NGO had estimated South Africa to have the highest rate of domestic violence on the continent, though they also noted this may be due to a higher rate of documented/reported cases as opposed to countries with fewer resources.

    Some have theorized that because of South Africa's high rate of crime and violence, that translates into a high rate of gender-based and domestic violence. There may be some links there, but regardless, I think the big culprit is the overall difficulty that South African women face in bringing forth charges of DV in spite of legislative efforts. Then again, such legislative efforts have been both encouraged and frustrated by the ANC at various turns.

    A few articles/sites for reference include:

    http://www.genderlinks.org.za/articl...ats-2011-09-13

    http://www.womeninaction.co.za/socia...-south-africa/

    My condolences to Reeva Steenkamp's family.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by jl View Post
    It's a tragedy that this happened, though it's strange that in all the statements regarding domestic abuse, more attention was initially paid to people carrying weapons than the very high rate of domestic violence in South Africa.
    Pistorious may become something of a negative poster child for domestic violence in South Africa, given the timing.

    Pistorius appeared in court in Pretoria Friday morning, which coincided with "Black Friday," a day when people were being urged to wear black to protest rapes and violence against women.

    South Africa has one of the highest rates of gun homicides, with killings of women by intimate partners the leading cause of female homicide in the country. Some 57% of female homicide victims were killed by their partners in 2009, according to a report last year by the Medical Research Council, a rate of 5.7% per 100,000. One-third of female homicides were committed by partners with a history of prior violence against their partners, according to the report.

    He's being charged with premeditated murder.

    http://www.latimes.com/news/world/wo...,1295646.story
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