View Poll Results: Can Russia win the 2018 Olympics in Ice Dance?

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  • Yes

    47 65.28%
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  1. #41

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    I think Victoria Sinitsina & Ruslan Zhiganshin have the greatest potential amongst the Russian Ice Dance teams to win the 2018 Olympic title. However, they seem to have gone backwards this season. Nevertheless, they have improved as the season has progressed, and they are just finding their feet in the senior ranks. I think they will be much stronger for that next season.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post
    Interesting that nobody has brought up C&L as a threat to the Russians or the NA. Will they be able to dominate?
    They would need a big name coach and a stronger federation. Ice dance is all about reputation and federation's deals.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maofan7 View Post
    I think Victoria Sinitsina & Ruslan Zhiganshin have the greatest potential amongst the Russian Ice Dance teams to win the 2018 Olympic title. However, they seem to have gone backwards this season. Nevertheless, they have improved as the season has progressed, and they are just finding their feet in the senior ranks. I think they will be much stronger for that next season.
    but somewhere in their careers they will be stagnant unless they leave Kustarova
    this summer is the time they leave her and go to either Zhulin, Shipilband or Krylova

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by love_skate2011 View Post
    but somewhere in their careers they will be stagnant unless they leave Kustarova
    this summer is the time they leave her and go to either Zhulin, Shipilband or Krylova
    Sinitsina & Zhiganshin have just finished second to Monko & Khaliavin in the short dance at the Russia Cup final with a rather disappointing score of 59.62.

    I agree, a coaching change would almost certainly do them good. They are capable of producing so much more than they are at the moment.

    Sinitsina & Zhiganshin - Art on Ice 2013
    Last edited by Maofan7; 02-16-2013 at 05:44 PM.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by IceIceBaby View Post
    They would need a big name coach and a stronger federation. Ice dance is all about reputation and federation's deals.
    They are also getting old. Luca is gonna be 28 this year. A decade ago it would be a perfect age for a dance team to dominate, but ice dance has changed. Which I still mourn, by the way. There is nothing like maturity and elegance of 30-year-old ice dancers.

    Which is also a reason why Meryl and Charlie will most likely retire after Sochi. This, and if they win gold there, they will get to retire in glory, having achieved everything there is to achieve in the sport. I really don't know where the speculation they will last till 2018 comes from. Even thoguh I would love them to, I think it's very unlikely.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post
    Simple - give them some decent bloody music and programs instead of the crap that most of them are skating to these days.
    ^^^^^ THIS!!!!

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maofan7 View Post
    Sinitsina & Zhiganshin have just finished second to Monko & Khaliavin in the short dance at the Russia Cup final with a rather disappointing score of 59.62.

    I agree, a coaching change would almost certainly do them good. They are capable of producing so much more than they are at the moment.

    Sinitsina & Zhiganshin - Art on Ice 2013
    they are a Navka/Kostomarov 2.0 , they need better programs, I think Krylova would do wonders for them !

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maofan7 View Post
    I think Victoria Sinitsina & Ruslan Zhiganshin have the greatest potential amongst the Russian Ice Dance teams to win the 2018 Olympic title. However, they seem to have gone backwards this season. Nevertheless, they have improved as the season has progressed, and they are just finding their feet in the senior ranks. I think they will be much stronger for that next season.

    Should they change coaches next year...:? Also it won't be that hard, since they already have good technique, and Krylova would probably love to have them.

    D&W will do worlds in 2014, and probably another one next year but they won't last til 2018 (only because they won't want to be fighting for bronze). They haven't said anything about retiring, but i guess their fans want to feel something nostalgic watching them, telling themselves this is their last year of competing, bla blah blah bla .

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by love_skate2011 View Post
    they are a Navka/Kostomarov 2.0 , they need better programs, I think Krylova would do wonders for them !
    I don't see the resemblance between them and N/K.
    I do agree that they need better dances though.

  10. #50
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    I think Sinitsina looks like Navka a little and has a similar slinky quality, but Navka was much better, of course.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by mia joy View Post
    They are also getting old. Luca is gonna be 28 this year. A decade ago it would be a perfect age for a dance team to dominate, but ice dance has changed. Which I still mourn, by the way. There is nothing like maturity and elegance of 30-year-old ice dancers.

    Which is also a reason why Meryl and Charlie will most likely retire after Sochi. This, and if they win gold there, they will get to retire in glory, having achieved everything there is to achieve in the sport. I really don't know where the speculation they will last till 2018 comes from. Even thoguh I would love them to, I think it's very unlikely.
    D/w are getting 10's in pcs if they don't win in Sochi and vm retire they would be crazy to give up that level of scoring for whatever program they do! I doubt if another team would start to get close to them right away or thy would start falling dramatically in pcs down from 10. They could go backward technically though so the 10's in pcs wouldn't help them forever but they could sail through at least one season with no one close!
    Last edited by caseyedwards; 02-16-2013 at 11:11 PM.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by escaflowne9282 View Post
    ^^^^^ THIS!!!!
    You have so many coaches involved! Morozov, zhulin, kustarova, spiliband, gorshkov. I mean change all the music and programs? Lol like they can't all be coached by krylova and camerlengo.

  13. #53
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    Thought I would bump this up now that Stepanova/Bukin have won junior worlds, making it four in a row for Russia. Here is a look back at the Russian JW medalists from the past 20 years (skaters who won a medal at senior worlds - not necessarily for Russia) - in bold:

    Ekaterina Svirina / Sergei Sakhnovski - 1993 gold, 1994 silver
    Olga Sharutenko / Dmitri Naumkin - 1995 gold
    Ekaterina Davydova / Roman Kostomarov - 1996 gold
    Russia Nina Ulanova / Mikhail Stifounin - 1997 gold
    Oksana Potdykova / Denis Petukhov - 1997 silver, 1998 bronze
    Natalia Romaniuta / Danil Barantsev - 1999 bronze, 2000 and 2001 gold
    Elena Khaliavina / Maxim Shabalin - 2001 bronze, 2002 silver
    Oksana Domnina / Maxim Shabalin - 2003 gold
    Elena Romanovskaya / Alexander Grachev - 2002 and 2003 bronze, 2004 gold
    Anastasia Gorshkova / Ilia Tkachenko - 2005 bronze
    Natalia Mikhailova / Arkadi Sergeev - 2006 silver
    Ekaterina Bobrova / Dmitri Soloviev - 2007 gold
    Kristina Gorshkova / Vitali Butikov - 2008 bronze
    Ekaterina Riazanova / Jonathan Guerreiro - 2009 bronze
    Elena Ilinykh / Nikita Katsalapov - 2010 gold
    Ksenia Monko / Kirill Khaliavin - 2010 bronze, 2011 gold
    Ekaterina Pushkash / Jonathan Guerreiro - 2011 silver
    Victoria Sinitsina / Ruslan Zhiganshin - 2012 gold
    Alexandra Stepanova / Ivan Bukin - 2012 silver, 2013 gold

    So, only a handful won world or Olympic medals, and B&S and I&K have Euro medals (with R&T, who medalled at JW with different partners, getting close to the podium), but the vast majority did not go on to do great things. In some ways that's to be expected because there are just so many of them, and I doubt that the non-Russians have fared so much better (from a quick glance, Delobel & Schoenfelder, Faiella, Belbin & Agosto, Virtue & Moir, Davis & White, and the Shibutanis went on to medal at senior worlds during the same period).

    What should a team like Stepanova & Bukin do to ensure that they don't get lost in the shuffle? I noticed that the ice dancers who were most successful right away in seniors made their debut at a time when there were retirements. Domnina/Shabalin turned senior in 2003 when Lobacheva/Averbukh were about to retire and Kulikova/Markov were splitting up. Ilinykh/Katsalapov turned senior in 2011 just after Dom/Shab retired and Kokhlova/Novitsky split. Are they really more talented than the other juniors or was it just luck and timing?

    Couples like Monko/Khaliavin and Sinitsina/Zhiganishin come into seniors in 4th or 5th place and it seems like they will have a hard time moving up. I don't expect I&K, B&S, or R&T to retire until 2018. It's almost like an embarrassment of riches but not really, because they have lots of solid couples who could make the top 10, but no outstanding couples who can contend for a World title (I suspect the Russian federation would trade these mid-tier teams for another Navka/Kostomarov in a heartbeat).

    Another interesting thing about these couples is that some of them just seem to fade away (Romanovskaya/Grachev, Gorshkova/Butikov, Mikhailova/Sergeev) rather than switching up partnerships (which seems more common in the US, although I won't undertake a study).

    I really want Stepanova/Bukin to make it. He has such a wonderful quality and she is so elegant. I'm wondering if they should just switch coaches right now. I realy like Svinin & Zhuk actually, but they were never able to take Kokhlova all the way a lot of people felt that their politics were lacking compared to Linichuk's for DomShab. I think they need to make a huge splash coming out of juniors in order to get noticed. S/Z won a medal on the GP but that wasn't enough. The problem is that R/T are pretty good, and more polished than these out of junior teams, but not really good enough that I think they will ever medal at Worlds, so the third spot is kind of wasted on them. These young teams should be making a run at that spot (actually for me the best team would be I/K, R/T, and S/B, but now that B/S won Euros, forget it).

    I like the fact that Stepanova/Bukin have been skating together since 2006. So when they make their senior debut they will already have 8 years together. That's almost Virtue/Moir territory! I think Bukin is a star and with his pedigree I would expect him and his beautiful partner to have the best coaching and lots of attention and success, but looking at Artur Dmitriev jr, it isn't necessarily the case....

  14. #54
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    I think there has already been a shift. They are in position now to take over once V&M and D&W retire and I wouldn't be shocked at all if one of them win at least a bronze in Sochi. If it's B&S it will be bronze at best but if I&K actually get it together AND learn some decent lifts I think Sochi will be very interesting.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmcg View Post
    I think there has already been a shift. They are in position now to take over once V&M and D&W retire and I wouldn't be shocked at all if one of them win at least a bronze in Sochi. If it's B&S it will be bronze at best but if I&K actually get it together AND learn some decent lifts I think Sochi will be very interesting.
    If only they had paced themselves and did what you said a year or two ago, they would be in such a great position right now. I really feel like the judges are ready to dump P&B at any opportunity (they have always been undermarked), yet the Russians just haven't been able to step through the door.

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post
    If only they had paced themselves and did what you said a year or two ago, they would be in such a great position right now. I really feel like the judges are ready to dump P&B at any opportunity (they have always been undermarked), yet the Russians just haven't been able to step through the door.
    I don't know, I feel that after Euros the judges are ready to go with I/K. They broke 100 in the FD with two level 2 elements, the PCS are huge, the GOE on every element was positive. Their lifts aren't spectacular but they still get level 4 and good GOE everytime. If they get their levels at Worlds, even just increasing those level 2s to level 3s, I think it will be very very close between them and P/B, especially with Bourzat coming back from his injury.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post

    I really want Stepanova/Bukin to make it. He has such a wonderful quality and she is so elegant. I'm wondering if they should just switch coaches right now. I realy like Svinin & Zhuk actually, but they were never able to take Kokhlova all the way a lot of people felt that their politics were lacking compared to Linichuk's for DomShab. I think they need to make a huge splash coming out of juniors in order to get noticed. S/Z won a medal on the GP but that wasn't enough. The problem is that R/T are pretty good, and more polished than these out of junior teams, but not really good enough that I think they will ever medal at Worlds, so the third spot is kind of wasted on them. These young teams should be making a run at that spot (actually for me the best team would be I/K, R/T, and S/B, but now that B/S won Euros, forget it).

    I like the fact that Stepanova/Bukin have been skating together since 2006. So when they make their senior debut they will already have 8 years together. That's almost Virtue/Moir territory! I think Bukin is a star and with his pedigree I would expect him and his beautiful partner to have the best coaching and lots of attention and success, but looking at Artur Dmitriev jr, it isn't necessarily the case....
    hmmmm... I wouldn't call Dmitriev Jr. a star anyways, I think Stepanova/Bukin if they turn Senior after Sochi they will really be making a splash but will they ? they might be tired already still in the Junior circuit. They have the qualities to become Russia's Top Team along with Ilinykh/Katsalapov.

    Stepanova/Bukin reminds you of Domnina/Shabalin, especially Stepanova I'm getting Domnina flashbacks.

  18. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post

    Another interesting thing about these couples is that some of them just seem to fade away (Romanovskaya/Grachev, Gorshkova/Butikov, Mikhailova/Sergeev) rather than switching up partnerships (which seems more common in the US, although I won't undertake a study).
    .
    R/G and M/S did switch around. Grachev teamed up with Platonova whose previous partner Maximishin teamed up with Mikhailova. None of them proved succesful though and I agree its a shame soo many very nice teams get lost in the shuffle all the time. The field at Russian dance is totally crowded right now but hardly any of them will make a big impact until 2017, 18 at least.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by morqet View Post
    I don't know, I feel that after Euros the judges are ready to go with I/K. They broke 100 in the FD with two level 2 elements, the PCS are huge, the GOE on every element was positive. Their lifts aren't spectacular but they still get level 4 and good GOE everytime. If they get their levels at Worlds, even just increasing those level 2s to level 3s, I think it will be very very close between them and P/B, especially with Bourzat coming back from his injury.
    That tells you so much about lifts under this judging system. Do you think I&K will pass B&S at Worlds? I am thinking they well might. I don't want to wuzrob for them with the Ghost FD, but I thought B&S were a bit overmarked in the SD at Euros, and I&K were better overall through both programs. I don't expect either to pass P&B although they are definitely getting closer.

    Quote Originally Posted by love_skate2011 View Post
    hmmmm... I wouldn't call Dmitriev Jr. a star anyways, I think Stepanova/Bukin if they turn Senior after Sochi they will really be making a splash but will they ? they might be tired already still in the Junior circuit. They have the qualities to become Russia's Top Team along with Ilinykh/Katsalapov.
    I was thinking they would turn senior in 2013-14, no? They already went to JGPF three times and JW twice. Maybe strategically, it would be better to wait, because the GP will be less crowded.

    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiK View Post
    R/G and M/S did switch around. Grachev teamed up with Platonova whose previous partner Maximishin teamed up with Mikhailova. None of them proved succesful though and I agree its a shame soo many very nice teams get lost in the shuffle all the time. The field at Russian dance is totally crowded right now but hardly any of them will make a big impact until 2017, 18 at least.
    I forgot all about those... shows what an impression they made on me. Platanova/Grachev were actually a very nice team, so were Rubleva/Shefer... they didn't have very interesting programs but they had some of that old school elegance.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post


    I was thinking they would turn senior in 2013-14, no? They already went to JGPF three times and JW twice. Maybe strategically, it would be better to wait, because the GP will be less crowded.

    Stepanova is 17 and Bukin is 19 so they are still eligible for another year as juniors I think
    but being in juniors for three seasons they probably might not wait after 2014 Sochi ?

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