Is it physically possible to land a clean quadruple axel in competition?

[Maofan7]

Of course, anything is possible with the help of CGI, but is it physically possible to land a legitimate clean quadruple axel in competition? Or have we almost reached the limit of what is humanly possible in jump terms?

In terms of the 6 types of jump, quad jumps have been accomplished in 3 of them in competition - the 4T (first - Kurt Browning: 1988 World Championships), the 4S (first - Timothy Goebel: 1998 JGPF), and the 4Z (first - Brandon Mroz: Colorado Springs Invitational 2011). Nobody, however, has yet landed a 4R, a 4F, or a 4A in competition. Daisuke Takahashi has attempted the 4F (e.g. 2010 Worlds FS, 2010/11 GPF LP), but they have either been deemed underrotated or downgraded. Konstantin Menshov has attempted a 4R in practice, whilst Kevin Reynolds recently attempted one in his SP at the 2012 BC Summerskate. Hence, its likely that the 4F and 4R will be successfully landed in competition at some point in the next 10 years. But what about a 4A? Is that a step too far, and does it take us beyond what is humanly possible?

[ehdtkqorl123]

I don't think so. Just like there is no lady who does fully rotated 3A, there won't be a man who will be able to do fully rotated 4A.

[Aussie Willy]

I don't think so. Just like there is no lady who does fully rotated 3A,

Except for Midori Ito and Tonya Harding.

I think someone will try to attempt it one day and I will be amazed when they do. But it is never going to be a mainstay of competiton like the quad has now become because you have to be a freak to be able to do it.

[bardtoob]

Maybe if the skater is very tall, very thin, has a very deep step into the jump, and really goes for height rather than distance . . .

. . . it would probably still be a 1/4 turn underrotated

[Ziggy]

I don't think it will ever be done, no.

[orbitz]

Maybe if the skater is very tall, very thin, has a very deep step into the jump, and really goes for height rather than distance . . .

Fast, straight rotations plus distance covered will negate the lack of height in the multiple revolutions jump. I think a 4A is possible with a heavy pre-rotation on the ice on the skid edge take-off.

[Sasha'sSpins]

I'm going to say 2020. I think the skate boot may need a bit more tweaking but I totally believe it's possible. I'm sure there was a time even DOUBLE jumps weren't considered possible, the skate boot itself evolved and look at us now!

[danceronice]

I'm going to say 2020. I think the skate boot may need a bit more tweaking but I totally believe it's possible. I'm sure there was a time even DOUBLE jumps weren't considered possible, the skate boot itself evolved and look at us now!

Exactly. Go back to 1970 and ask if men would be doing a quad lutz. You'd get a LOT of "that's physically impossible."

[Sasha'sSpins]

Exactly. Go back to 1970 and ask if men would be doing a quad lutz. You'd get a LOT of "that's physically impossible."

And I am positive some men from earlier eras were at least trying quads in practices!

Until I saw the practice video of 1960 Olympic Champ David Jenkins Triple Axel I had no idea that men were even attempting that jump prior to the '70's! Never mind in 1957! . Correct me if I'm wrong anyone-but haven't skate boots advanced a great deal since David's time?

To be sure-there are young men out there attempting quad axels in practices-here's Ryan Bradley's attempt -and here's another guy's (don't know his name) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1e7rg1hNQIw and the same guy in real time http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uG_uc4O3DVE one day...

[shine]

What, by 2050 there'll be genetically engineered humans?
Or a dominant mutation takes over the population?

[victoriaheidi]

Not that I mind or anything, but where did all this quad axel talk come from lately?

[Ziggy]

Not that I mind or anything, but where did all this quad axel talk come from lately?

And it wasn't even caseyedwards that started the thread.

[Sasha'sSpins]

Not that I mind or anything, but where did all this quad axel talk come from lately?

Ask Maofan who started the thread.

[Maofan7]

Not that I mind or anything, but where did all this quad axel talk come from lately?

Ask Maofan who started the thread.

Came across the CGI video (see post 1), and wondered whether we would ever see one for real one day, and whether it was even possible.

[Vash01]

There was a time when people believed that the triple axel was an impossibility because it required 3 and a half rotations in the air.

I don't see why someone could not land a quad axel some day in competition. It's a matter of when. I don't see it happening in 2015- that's just 2 years from now. However, 2020 is very possible. I am also guessing that in the next 7 years there will be improvements in boot designs which could help skaters trying this jump. However, I don't see anyone going for it for competitive advantage in a competition; it's more likely to get credit for 'first', like the quad lutz done by Brandon Mroz.

[Vash01]

I don't think so. Just like there is no lady who does fully rotated 3A, there won't be a man who will be able to do fully rotated 4A.

You must be very young. Midori and Tonya fully rotated the 3As routinely, just like the men did.

[Maofan7]

There was a time when people believed that the triple axel was an impossibility because it required 3 and a half rotations in the air.

I don't see why someone could not land a quad axel some day in competition. It's a matter of when. I don't see it happening in 2015- that's just 2 years from now. However, 2020 is very possible. I am also guessing that in the next 7 years there will be improvements in boot designs which could help skaters trying this jump. However, I don't see anyone going for it for competitive advantage in a competition; it's more likely to get credit for 'first', like the quad lutz done by Brandon Mroz.

If it is achieved, then it will be a bit like the 3A in Ladies, something that is deployed by a skater in competition only now and again with large gaps in between. That is, it will be a jump that only a very few skaters can do

[ks777]

No unless we see a male version of Midori Ito. Or Midori and Elvis decided to have a baby together. Or Midori have a baby with a Japanese gymnast Uchimura.

[chantilly]

I believe Kurt once said that he thought it would happen eventually but that would be it,i.e that is as far as it would go.

[aims]

No unless we see a male version of Midori Ito. Or Midori and Elvis decided to have a baby together. Or Midori have a baby with a Japanese gymnast Uchimura.

I like that, although, alas, Kohei is already married