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  1. #41
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    I don't think Yuka and Jason are great technical coaches. Jeremy picked them because he was good technically already, and he needed someone to encourage him to take ownership of his own skating

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by leafygreens View Post
    Hypothetically, if Jeremy can still go to the worlds with a triple, and his quad is so inconsistent, why not leave out the quad? Just do an immaculate triples program. He is more than capable of that. It may help his confidence just to skate cleanly. I'm afraid all the talk about "needing" a quad has gotten to him, and he is doing a jump he's not as capable of.
    I did not read this post before I posted #29 and I am just now seeing this. Great minds do think alike.

    Todd Eldredge ruined his chances of being in medal contention at the 2002 Olympics by insisting on going for a quad even though he had not mastered it. In retrospect it would not have made a difference in the medal podium, but at least he would have had the satisfaction of skating well.

    ETA: The reason I even thought of the coaching change was that his current coaches used incorrect strategy. If Jeremy wanted to try the quad anyway, the coaches needed to talk him out of it because making the world team had to be his priority at this time.

  3. #43

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    I haven't followed Jeremy closely enough this year to know if he changed his spin to make it be illegal or if it was illegal all season. I was always under the impression that the skaters had judges who monitored them. And didn't Jeremy do Champs Camp and several GPs? I really would just like to know why no one noticed his pointless spins (wasn't it in both short and long?) until Nationals. Really, in the middle of the biggest competition of the year. Think how that must have disconcerted him. If it were me, I would think about whether or not I was with the right coaches.

    Also, I have to say that Adam Rippon is tremendously improved and much happier with a new coach...

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lacey View Post

    Also, I have to say that Adam Rippon is tremendously improved and much happier with a new coach...
    Hasn't Rippon been doing worse this season?

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lacey View Post
    I haven't followed Jeremy closely enough this year to know if he changed his spin to make it be illegal or if it was illegal all season. I was always under the impression that the skaters had judges who monitored them. And didn't Jeremy do Champs Camp and several GPs? I really would just like to know why no one noticed his pointless spins (wasn't it in both short and long?) until Nationals. Really, in the middle of the biggest competition of the year. Think how that must have disconcerted him. If it were me, I would think about whether or not I was with the right coaches.

    Also, I have to say that Adam Rippon is tremendously improved and much happier with a new coach...
    My thoughts too. I'm not sure why people wouldn't recommend looking into a change. Again, the Satos seem to be where everyone in both USA and Japan has gone to suck competitively. Alissa is their success story, and she benefited from the positive change from her previous situation. If Abbott can find a suitable system for training elsewhere, he should try it. I think with his talent-level it's worth it.
    Last edited by TheIronLady; 01-29-2013 at 04:19 AM.

  6. #46

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    I understand that Jeremy changed the spin after the GP to the illegal one that was pointed out as an issue at Nationals.

    Either way it is a deficiency in himself and the coaching team that no-one bothered to read the rules...

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by leafygreens View Post
    Hypothetically, if Jeremy can still go to the worlds with a triple, and his quad is so inconsistent, why not leave out the quad? Just do an immaculate triples program. He is more than capable of that. It may help his confidence just to skate cleanly. I'm afraid all the talk about "needing" a quad has gotten to him, and he is doing a jump he's not as capable of.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    ETA: The reason I even thought of the coaching change was that his current coaches used incorrect strategy. If Jeremy wanted to try the quad anyway, the coaches needed to talk him out of it because making the world team had to be his priority at this time.
    There may have been some Sunk Cost Fallacy going on here. Jeremy was chasing the quad in vain all season; perhaps he felt like he needed to stay the course and eventually it would all pay off. Unfortunately for him, it never did this season.
    "Marge, if you're going to get mad at me every time I do something stupid, then I guess I'm just going to have to stop doing stupid things!" - Homer Simpson in the Mr. Plow episode

  8. #48
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    Jeremy never does any mid-season program changes well. I was kinda worried when I heard he was rearranging his jumps again.

  9. #49
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    I think Jeremy needs to retire and join a show (I'm sure he'll get many offers).

    He's a stunning, unique skater but if it didn't happen already, it's not going to happen now. Especially at his age. He's had plenty of opportunities.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I think Jeremy needs to retire and join a show (I'm sure he'll get many offers).

    He's a stunning, unique skater but if it didn't happen already, it's not going to happen now. Especially at his age. He's had plenty of opportunities.
    I don't see what harm going on does. Using your logic, he should have retired years ago, like after 2010 (that might not have been a bad idea then actually). He was never going to get a new personality. Let him try with some new variables like a new coach. He enhances his career and the Olympic year scene just by showing up (it's the only year the public watches), even if due to age he may not have the best odds he's ever had.

  11. #51

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    Has anyone remembered that Jeremy has a few bulging disks and a history of back injury? I'm not an uber but I would think that this is his biggest problem.

  12. #52
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    What was so illegal about the spin anyway? Now I want to see it.... perhaps a double Biellman butt spin ending a la Candeloro with knees on the ice?

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post
    What was so illegal about the spin anyway? Now I want to see it.... perhaps a double Biellman butt spin ending a la Candeloro with knees on the ice?
    It wasn't anything super- a flying upright spin. The ISU just decided this year that those don't fulfill the requirements, so it would have gotten no points (illegal might have been the wrong word- I think illegal elements incur deductions.) If you go back in the Men's thread you can see his programs at the Detroit Send off show, and he does the spin there.

  14. #54
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    Jeremy was 2 points away from going to Worlds so it's not like his skating was at an embarrassingly low level, and next year is an Olympic year. It's so easy to sit at a keyboard and say he should retire, but this is his life and if there is even a chance he could make another Olympic team, he doesn't have anything to lose by going for it. Yeah, there are a lot of younger skaters on an upswing and next year at US Nats will probably be even tougher, but you never get anything if you don't try and give it your best. At least he won't look back and have regrets wondering "what if?"

    Not that I know for sure that he plans to stay in; but unless the injuries get to be too much, I don't think it would make sense to retire now.

  15. #55
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    Jeremy was 2 points away from going to Worlds so it's not like his skating was at an embarrassingly low level
    But it's the second time in 3 years this has happened even though he is the best, most accomplished skater US currently has and has had for a while. He just doesn't have "it" in him. And that's nothing to be ashamed of. For years he has been able to deliver about one strong free skate per season and that's good, just not enough for a elite competitor.

    In my mind, he is heaps and bounds the better skater, but I wouldn't hesitate for a split second to send Miner to Worlds instead (both times, actually).

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    But it's the second time in 3 years this has happened even though he is the best, most accomplished skater US currently has and has had for a while. He just doesn't have "it" in him. And that's nothing to be ashamed of. For years he has been able to deliver about one strong free skate per season and that's good, just not enough for a elite competitor.

    In my mind, he is heaps and bounds the better skater, but I wouldn't hesitate for a split second to send Miner to Worlds instead (both times, actually).
    So if you don't get the results you want, you should quit trying? Most other countries would be thrilled to be able to send a skater like Abbott to Worlds; the US happens to have a lot of depth in mens skating at the moment. I could see that if he had placed 10th or something, he might want to think about quitting- but 2 points away from the World team? Not so much. Maybe he doesn't have "it" in him, but why shouldn't he give it one more try if that's what he wants? I do think his team needs to be more aggressive about making sure that he gets higher levels on spins etc.

    FWIW I agree with the decision to send Miner to Worlds. But if every skater who didn't make Worlds quit, that would make one hell of a boring competition. (yeah I know, only the older skaters should be put out to pasture...)

    I don't get all these calls for skaters to quit in general. It's their lives, their dreams; it doesn't hurt anyone if they stay in. (especially those like Jeremy who will have a bye to US Nats and would not potentially be preventing someone else from making it through sectionals)

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by leafygreens View Post
    Hypothetically, if Jeremy can still go to the worlds with a triple, and his quad is so inconsistent, why not leave out the quad? Just do an immaculate triples program. He is more than capable of that. It may help his confidence just to skate cleanly. I'm afraid all the talk about "needing" a quad has gotten to him, and he is doing a jump he's not as capable of.
    that's what he said in a interview
    he should have gone for a easier and safer jump.

  18. #58
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    No he needs to retire. When you are almost 30 and havent broken through at the amateur level it is never going to happen.

  19. #59
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    Oh I wasn't calling for him to quit, but just that he needs to realize two things:

    1) whatever issue he has must have been there for years now and still can't be fixed by him, his coaches, his physicians and his shrinks. It's the only thing separating him from success. He is too good not to have at least a world medal. But then if this issue can't be fixed for so many years, I am not optimistic that it can magically be fixed next season. Brown and Rippon are fixing their 3axel demons with some success yet he hasn't been able to fix his.

    And since he hasn't been able to skate great more than once each season, even if he skates great and make it out of Nationals 2014, chances are he will have a hard time delivering at Sochi.

    2) The USFS really did the best they could to lowball Farris' PCS and save the bronze for him instead. On the flip side, if they had wanted to keep him on the world team, a tiny little bump on each PCS component would have sufficed. IMO it was a calculated 3rd place for him.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andofanatic View Post
    No he needs to retire. When you are almost 30 and havent broken through at the amateur level it is never going to happen.
    He is 3 time US Champion and an Olympian. What exactly do you think skaters need to do to "break through"?

    2) The USFS really did the best they could to lowball Farris' PCS and save the bronze for him instead. On the flip side, if they had wanted to keep him on the world team, a tiny little bump on each PCS component would have sufficed. IMO it was a calculated 3rd place for him.
    Said it in another thread and I'm going to say it again here: there is no way the 9 judges are good enough at math, and also working together to place the skaters that they would be able to place him just above Farris but off the world team, intentionally. It is possible they judged his PCS more harshly than other skaters, or more favorably- who knows, but I just don't think they can manipulate the results to the extent some people believe. It isn't like voting as a block in 6.0. To keep him off the world team, but at the bronze would have taken an insane level of coordination and calculation. (Okay- if he happens to double the salchow, then give him X for transitions, if his step sequence gets called Level 3, make sure to only give +2 GOE, +3 will ruin everything!)

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