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  1. #1
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    Where to for Mirai Nagasu now?

    When Mirai finished her free skate tonight, I was truly happy for her. Besides the step out on the triple flip, I thought everything was clean, and I was thinking she would score somewhere in the 120-125 range. When I saw 109 on my TV screen, I screamed and almost lost it. I had my heart in my mouth . I can go on endlessly on my opinion of how it was rigged, how she was unfairly punished, and all...but it's useless trying to change what can't (the results).

    I started this thread because I'm curious to hear (and brainstorm!) what Nagasu needs to do to get back to the form that got her in 1st place after the short program at the World Championships in 2010. I love her and her skating so much, and I truly want her to succeed...Is her career a lost cause? Is USFSA black-bombing her to make way for new talent? What does she need to do? Was it just terrible, terrible luck to be feeling ill during Nationals? Just curious to hear everyone's opinions.

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    I mentioned this before but I think her career peaked in 2010-2011. That said if she keeps working hard, and really works hard on those jumps especialy, and getting more life into her presentation again maybe she could have a shot at the 3rd spot on the Olympic team next year if the U.S regains a 3rd (Wagner and Gold are going to Sochi barring a disaester) and then if she is willing to keep going from there and keep working hard maybe she could shine after 2014. She seems to be recommited this year, but whether it is too little too late, well hard to say, like I said I think after 2014 would be her next possible window to really shine, and she would need a decent season next year to even set herself up for that. It depends how hard she is willing to keep working, if she is successful continuing to make the changes and improvements needed, and how much patience and perseverance she has.

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    I too love Mirai and I hated the 109 she got for that LP. IMO she did expect to lose to Ashley because not only did she have that mistake on the 3f, but she also ur'ed 2 jumps I think (haven't seen the replay). She looked very disappointed when she finished, but I was hoping that she could still medal- whether she makes the world team or not. IMO dropping her from 3rd to 7th place was cruel, and that's how the politics are.

    It seems the USFSA has given up on Mirai. The only way she can reestablish herself is what Ashley did. Start skating consistently well, especially in the GP series until the USFSA starts taking notice. She has so much talent. All she needs is a coach who believes in her, and a choreographer who brings out her finer points.

  4. #4

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    Mirai is only 19. She has had to get used to body changes both before and after the 2010 Olympics. Her star was starting to rise again this fall. She had an unfortunate bout with the flu just a week ago. You could tell from her press conference that she was still nursing a cold. Her voice sounded scratchy too. The SP wasn't a problem but I knew the FS would be. I think she fought through pretty darn well considering. That being said-I don't like her FS. I'm not in love with her SP but it's okay. Okay however isn't good enough. She's got to find better choreographers and come up with Olympic worthy programs. And she's got to just keep working hard just as Ashley did. She could really use Wagner as her model if she wanted to and Kostner as well. Both improved massively in their 20s as did Czisny. Slutskaya overcame a heart issue and IIRC Lu Chen overcame a disastrous skate the year prior to the Olympics and came back to win bronze. While there is life, youth, and health all of which Mirai has on her side there is a chance. I believe in second, even third and fourth chances. Mirai should let herself grieve a little and then get over it. The Olympics are next year and if she REALLY wants it she's going to have to just keep fighting for it.

    ETA: One of the articles on Mirai mentioned that she was trying to get back to the little girl who had the dream of winning a medal at the Olympics. In the same article she went on to say that her current choreographer is giving her programs that worked for her when she became National champion. I remember she spoke of 'balletic' programs for the FS. I think Mirai should be careful there. She needs to look to the fresh, innovative programs of some of the other skaters at their best. Mirai's own Pirates program of the Olympic season remains, imo, her best to date. She needs to try and find something that will bring that spark back into her programs. I also wish she would re-think some of her costumes. The FS dress was nice (at least on tv), the SP not so great imo. Others she has worn this season haven't been that great either. I'm also worried that funding will be a problem for her now. That might limit her choices in choreographers and styling.
    Last edited by Sasha'sSpins; 01-27-2013 at 08:39 AM.
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    ITA that Mirai's best program was her Pirates program.

    I really, really hate to say this, because I feel like it's crummy, but I think leaving Frank Carroll really hurt her, politically speaking. It's hard, because she seems to have a great relationship with Amy and Wendy, but I feel like leaving Frank was a "bad thing" in USFS' book. Stupid, because she seems a lot happier and freer now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by victoriaheidi View Post
    ITA that Mirai's best program was her Pirates program.

    I really, really hate to say this, because I feel like it's crummy, but I think leaving Frank Carroll really hurt her, politically speaking. It's hard, because she seems to have a great relationship with Amy and Wendy, but I feel like leaving Frank was a "bad thing" in USFS' book. Stupid, because she seems a lot happier and freer now.
    I agree and it stupid. Frank is a legend but a very old coach who has to retire soon I would think, and currently has no noteworthy pupils anymore except for one who will spend 3 years talking about a comeback that never happens. It should not be a death knall to leave him these days at all, and if it for the USFSA it is only further evidence of the blockheads they often are.

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    Watching the skates again though I cant say she was robbed or 7th was wrong. Everyone who beat her apart from Wagner and Zawadzki skated pretty much clean while she had mistakes.

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    YES!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha'sSpins View Post
    Mirai is only 19. She has had to get used to body changes both before and after the 2010 Olympics. Her star was starting to rise again this fall. She had an unfortunate bout with the flu just a week ago. You could tell from her press conference that she was still nursing a cold. Her voice sounded scratchy too. The SP wasn't a problem but I knew the FS would be. I think she fought through pretty darn well considering. That being said-I don't like her FS. I'm not in love with her SP but it's okay. Okay however isn't good enough. She's got to find better choreographers and come up with Olympic worthy programs. And she's got to just keep working hard just as Ashley did. She could really use Wagner as her model if she wanted to and Kostner as well. Both improved massively in their 20s as did Czisny. Slutskaya overcame a heart issue and IIRC Lu Chen overcame a disastrous skate the year prior to the Olympics and came back to win bronze. While there is life, youth, and health all of which Mirai has on her side there is a chance. I believe in second, even third and fourth chances. Mirai should let herself grieve a little and then get over it. The Olympics are next year and if she REALLY wants it she's going to have to just keep fighting for it.

    ETA: One of the articles on Mirai mentioned that she was trying to get back to the little girl who had the dream of winning a medal at the Olympics. In the same article she went on to say that her current choreographer is giving her programs that worked for her when she became National champion. I remember she spoke of 'balletic' programs for the FS. I think Mirai should be careful there. She needs to look to the fresh, innovative programs of some of the other skaters at their best. Mirai's own Pirates program of the Olympic season remains, imo, her best to date. She needs to try and find something that will bring that spark back into her programs. I also wish she would re-think some of her costumes. The FS dress was nice (at least on tv), the SP not so great imo. Others she has worn this season haven't been that great either. I'm also worried that funding will be a problem for her now. That might limit her choices in choreographers and styling.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by victoriaheidi View Post
    ITA that Mirai's best program was her Pirates program.

    I really, really hate to say this, because I feel like it's crummy, but I think leaving Frank Carroll really hurt her, politically speaking. It's hard, because she seems to have a great relationship with Amy and Wendy, but I feel like leaving Frank was a "bad thing" in USFS' book. Stupid, because she seems a lot happier and freer now.
    Wow-I hadn't even thought of the Frank angle! That could be very true but what could Mirai do? She didn't do well when she was commuting four hours a day to and from Frank's rink. And perhaps financially she might no longer be able to afford him. There was definite politiking at this event-and it hurt Mirai the most imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by lahaa968 View Post


    OT but some fans on twitter are really letting US Figure Skating have it regarding Mirai!
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by lahaa968 View Post
    I can go on endlessly on my opinion of how it was rigged, how she was unfairly punished, and all...but it's useless trying to change what can't (the results).
    I don't think that it was rigged and I don't think that she was unfairly punished.

    Pretty much everybody has delivered very strong performances whilst Nagasu has made a number of errors.

    You might have thought that everything other than the flip was clean but it wasn't. Nagasu has cheated a number of jumps and this is something that has always plagued her and has intensified recently.

    The question is: Can it be changed at this point?

    I think it can. She is still young and it would take a lot of hard work and maybe even taking a year off but I believe that it's something that can be addressed. She just needs to accept that this is an issue and commit to re-working her jump technique.
    Last edited by Ziggy; 01-27-2013 at 11:52 AM.

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    Well,I certainly hope that she will continue towards Sochi and even after.
    I do find it heartbreaking to hear how she cried after her LP (have not seen her program yet). For me,she seemed like a different person this year and working harder than ever to get back on that podium.
    After a while, I hope she will be able to focus on all the good things that she actually did this season..getting that 3/3 under the belt for her SP,a great 3rd place finish at NHK (should have been 2nd imo..) and some lovely moments in all her LP's..flying high on her 3Z's,trying the 2A/3T (every time!),some beautiful choreography in the end into her lovely layback and finally some fighting spirit despite not being in top shape..I still believe she is a late season bloomer and to see her doing well on the GP circuit this year was a bit of a surprise (in a good way!)

  12. #12

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    She was sick and had no energy to properly present her programs or rotate her jumps. That's all. I don't want to hear about a downward slide or political loss of respect being with the wrong coach, that's all rubbish. That said, some time with Krall or Zayak could help her dramatically, just to really figure out her jumping issues so she can do them in her sleep. I really couldn't have expected anything better than what she put out last night- that was amazing given the circumstances.

  13. #13

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    Regarding funding- http://www.usfsa.org/Athletes.asp?id=350

    Envelope B

    Placements 11th and lower at the 2013 ISU World Figure Skating Championships
    Placements 2nd-4th in the senior events at the 2013 U.S. Figure Skating Championships
    Placements 4th-6th at the ISU Senior Grand Prix Final in the 2012-13 season
    Placements 2nd-3rd at the 2013 ISU Four Continents Championships
    Placements 1st-3rd at the 2013 ISU World Junior Championships
    2013 U.S. Junior Champion
    Placements 1st-3rd at the ISU Junior Grand Prix Final in the 2012-13 season
    Placements 1st-3rd at any of the six ISU Senior Grand Prix competitions in the 2012-13 season
    World Team 1st Alternate in the 2012-13 season
    Placement 5th in the senior events at the 2013 U.S. Figure Skating Championships

  14. #14

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    She wasn't robbed...she just made so many mistakes. Do I think she could have been placed higher? Maybe; I think some skaters get the benefit of the doubt but Mirai will never do so. Oh, well. The best two are going to Worlds.

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    Perhaps Mirai can re-use POTC and Carmen LP for next year's Nationals/Olympic trail. She looked great in the SP, but that program as a whole wasn't memorable like POTC was.

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    It's hard to remember that Mirai really is so young, considering that she's been skating senior for what, six years? Maybe she'll be like Ashely and be a late bloomer...who knows.

    Either way, I felt worse seeing her reaction then I did her skate. She seemed to take it really hard, which guts me because that LP wasn't something to be devastated about. She can do better, but she can (and has!) done far, far worse. Considering everything, I thought it was a good effort and I hope she feels better about it soon.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spareoom View Post
    It's hard to remember that Mirai really is so young, considering that she's been skating senior for what, six years? Maybe she'll be like Ashely and be a late bloomer...who knows.

    Either way, I felt worse seeing her reaction then I did her skate. She seemed to take it really hard, which guts me because that LP wasn't something to be devastated about. She can do better, but she can (and has!) done far, far worse. Considering everything, I thought it was a good effort and I hope she feels better about it soon.
    Her reaction wasn't to her skate. It was to her marks. She had done what she appeared to think was a pretty great program, her best in a long time, then proceeded to get her ass handed to her by the judges. She probably felt like "What more can I possibly do?" The answer is "Clean up your damn URs!" I was proud and impressed to see her skate without a total meltdown. Despite her placement, I think she's a better skate than she was last year, and she has another year to work out the kinks and make it back to the Olympics. I still think her current coaching situation is a good fit for her. They need to buckle down and focus on her technique and come back strong.

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I don't think that it was rigged and I don't think that she was unfairly punished.

    Pretty much everybody has delivered very strong performances whilst Nagasu has made a number of errors.

    You might have thought that everything other than the flip was clean but it wasn't. Nagasu has cheated a number of jumps and this is something that has always plagued her and has intensified recently.

    The question is: Can it be changed at this point?

    I think it can. She is still young and it would take a lot of hard work and maybe even taking a year off but I believe that it's something that can be addressed. She just needs to accept that this is an issue and commit to re-working her jump technique.
    This. I love Mirai. She's my favorite ladies skater at the moment. However, even I could tell that a number of jumps were cheated. Reworking her jump technique is what she needs to work on. When she gets nervous or loses stamina, she cheats her jumps. That kills her TES and then she takes herself out of the running for a number of titles. This problem seemed to get better under Frank Carroll but it has returned with a vengeance now that she switched coaches. She's been plagued by cheated jumps in her LP all season. Next season, she does need to look at reworking her jump technique. It might cost her at least a season but it could be worth it in the long run. If Mirai had more confidence in her jumping technique (and overall) it might help the performance aspect of her skating as well.

    BTW, I don't think she should switch coaches. Maybe work with some other coaches during the summer but keep her primary coaches.
    "If people are looking for guarantees, they should buy appliances at Sears and stay away from human relationships."~Prancer

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    Mirai is amazing, her jumps need serious tweaking. This has been a problem for years. Frank made progress with her. Sadly once you have a rep for urs you are always going to be a target by judges.

  20. #20
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    Aside from the obviously underrotated jumps, the program had no energy at all. I was sad to see someone who can have such captivating presentation basically just go through the motions while skating to (IMO) heavy music. Not the best program choice or choreography.

    Placement was rough, but fair.

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