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  1. #301

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    To clarify - these 3 years cover the period when the U.S. Collegiate National top medalists were given partial funding by USFS' Collegiate program to attend this competition as a reward. They were not selected by USFS' international committee like Baga and Flatt were this year. The men and pairs selected by USFS to compete in Nice in recent years also were based on a majority vote by the international committee -- Max Aaron, Keegan Messing and Scimeca/Knierim last year, and Leng/LeDuc and Calalang/Sidhu this year.


    I already answered this earlier in the thread: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...=1#post4007962
    Excerpt: "Only Alissa Czisny of the ISP ladies who have previously competed as a senior internationally has not been assigned an international to date and I assume she may not be competition-ready yet."

    Your knowledge, Sylvia, of all things skating truly astounds me. You are the ultimate fan of skating, the best kind. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. Seriously, all the time I read your posts I discover something new, like today. Thank you.

    Sincerely,

    Nadine White

  2. #302
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    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    Yes, but who knows which Mirai would've shown up at '11 Worlds. It could just as easily have been splat city
    Exactly. And if Mirai had gone and bombed, there'd be people still saying that "reliable Rachael" should have gotten the nod in order to earn three spots again. I do think that Mirai should have been selected over Rachael that year, but to claim that she would have automatically done better is preposterous.

    I hope Rachael does awesome at her Senior B event and feels happy with her season. She really is a great addition to the skating world, no matter what happens from here on out.

  3. #303
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.Cooper View Post
    I am sure that this is not a vacation for Flatt. She is a full time college student
    I cannot fathom how anyone would think a full-time student from an elite school would take time out to compete in a sports competition in the midst of a compressed 10-week fall quarter for vacation purposes. Really now....

    Best of luck to Rachel, in school and on the ice!

  4. #304

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    Heads Up for Rachael Flatt Fans like myself!

    She's skating tomorrow at Regionals (thanks to Sylvia as always for supplying that magical bit of info. over in the K&C):
    http://www.usfigureskating.org/leade...s/results.html

    Here's my reply (copied & pasted over there a little while ago):

    Thanks, Sylvia, for the info.

    Here's wishing them all good luck, in particular my fave Rachel Flatt!

    As an aside, I just love the month of October, the beautiful leaves turning from lush green to spectacular gold, bronze, fiery red, and every shade in between... (ps: now's the time to plant your tulips so they'll look breathtaking when Spring gets here!)

  5. #305

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    New article titled "Former Olympian Flatt aims at comeback the hard way": http://www.nbcolympics.com/news/form...eback-hard-way
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  6. #306

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    Great read (thanks for finding & posting it Sylvia).

    Nice positive sunny article, reminiscent of Rachael, the Pollyanna of the here & now, though this one was from another generation.

    http://www.jinni.com/movies/pollyanna

  7. #307

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    Rachael came in 1st during the SP. She scored 49.82 ~ she landed 2Z (- GOE), 3R/2T (+ GOE), and 2A (+ GOE), and she must've had problems on her layback spin (- GOE).

    Imho Rachael should've went for the 3F instead of the 3Z, as her 3F looks really good (also she landed it at Evening With Champions just last week).

    Still, good job, now onto the FS!

    Scores for all: http://www.usfigureskating.org/leade...s/SEGM016.html

  8. #308

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    Thank you for posting the result, NadineWhite! Shame for the 2Lz and LSp2. But she got Lv4 for StS. Yay!

  9. #309

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    Saw that Rachael posted this on Facebook after a friend "liked" it:

    Even though it wasn't my best short, a mother of a skater came up to me after my program and said I had inspired her daughter to skate again. Those moments are always special. On to the long program tomorrow.
    So much for her competing potentially causing multiple skaters to quit.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    As long as she is happy I fail to see why the rest of us should care.
    Because USFS pays for it and there are many other, more promising US skaters out there (who would love that spot but cannot take it because of USFS' anachronistic, counter-productive rules).

    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    There are only 30 women in the USFSA International Selection Pool. I think all have been offered competitions. If you know of someone who hasn't been offered a competition, please list their name.
    Why is Flatt even in the pool, given she hasn't competed at 2013 Nationals and her Skate America 2012 outing was just embarrassing to watch (especially considering Flatt is a former Junior World medallist who was landing all the triples and triple/triple combinations)?

    I just don't understand why USFS keeps investing in her. Her being at Stanford means she isn't able to commit herself fully to skating. Give opportunities to those that can.
    Last edited by Ziggy; 10-14-2013 at 07:22 AM.

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Because USFS pays for it and there are many other, more promising US skaters out there (who would love that spot but cannot take it because of USFS' anachronistic, counter-productive rules).

    I just don't understand why USFS keeps investing in her. Her being at Stanford means she isn't able to commit herself fully to skating. Give opportunities to those that can.
    Except for the cost of sending her to Coupe de Nice (entry and travel fees) which I assume the USFS is paying, I'm not sure they are "investing" in her. She is not in a Team A,B or C Envelope and to my understanding is therefore not getting funding from USFS. And I can't think of any other senior lady that is getting passed over for this competition in favor of Flatt, at least not any that one can make an "is more worthy" argument for. If she feels physically, mentally, and financially up for the training and can come up with a creditable set of goods to sell to tech panels and judges, she's as entitled to consideration for competitions as anybody. For US domestic competitions, as a USFS member she can enter club or qualifying competition as her right. As for international competitions, it's up to the other US ladies to prove on the ice, that they deserve the assignment more than Flatt.

  12. #312
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    Her being at Stanford means she isn't able to commit herself fully to skating.
    So do you think those that work shouldn't be funded by USFS either? They have jobs, so they can't fully commit to skating. (Of course, without those jobs, they couldn't skate...)

    There are many athletes who are in school- don't almost all the ice dancers go to Michigan? And pretty much all the younger skaters have commitment to high school, and if any of them are in physical schools (which some do) that is generally less flexible than college schedules. Why should Rachel be knocked out of contention for internationals because she is?

    The idea of 'fully commit' to skating meaning 'nothing else in their life' is ridiculous- pretty much ALL the athletes have something else going on.

  13. #313
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    Quote Originally Posted by jiejie View Post
    As for international competitions, it's up to the other US ladies to prove on the ice, that they deserve the assignment more than Flatt.
    Again: Flatt has competed at one competition last year and she has done very poorly for her standards there. So other US Ladies have proven on the ice that they are better than her (Flatt's SA score would have her 13th at Nationals) but more importantly even more US Ladies have proven that they are improving and gaining new skills whilst Flatt is regressing and is nowhere near the shape that she used to be in the past. Why invest in a skater like that? Why not give an opportunity to somebody who is showing potential and making improvements instead? I just don't understand it at all. To me, it looks like Flatt is getting preferential treatment and I don't understand why.

    Quote Originally Posted by Skittl1321 View Post
    So do you think those that work shouldn't be funded by USFS either? They have jobs, so they can't fully commit to skating. (Of course, without those jobs, they couldn't skate...)
    I am fully aware that most skaters have jobs and study. Yet some of them are able to combine it with training full-time and competing both nationally and internationally.

  14. #314
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    To be fair to Flatt's credentials.....when she has been healthy, she has been a terrific competitor. She stated in the interview on NBC.com that she has been dealing consistently with injuries for over two full seasons, and she took the time off to heal, following 2012 SA until May 2013, and trained all summer in Colorado as well as competed in a summer event. I would also hazard a guess that since she was training at her former training site, that USFS probably poked their heads in the rink and observed her progress. She has committed the time and the energy to training following her recovery. This has nothing to do, IMHO, if she, or any other skater, is solely focused on skating. Flatt was and has always said, that focusing singularly on skating was not the proper mix for her. She was a full time high school student, involved in many outside activities while skating. And, as others have pointed out, who of us is to determine what is the proper combination of daily activities for each athlete. IIRC, Mark Ladwig balanced training with home life as a husband, father and working at his rink to pay the bills. Ashley Wagner has held various part time jobs over the years to cover skating expenses and has dabbled in local community college classes. John Coughlin has always worked while skating. It is just that Flatt goes to a brick and mortar college full time. Alissa attended Bowling Green while skating, albeit much of her course work over the years online, and most of the Detroit ice dancers attend college classes, usually carrying full loads during the summer, and quite often going down to just one class, or perhaps two classes during the competition season. What works for one athlete does not necessarily work for another.

  15. #315
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    Denis Ten, who no one thought would medal last world, did just that.
    Since USFS cannot predict which US lady would surprise, the only fair and safe thing to do is send every possible contender, however unlikely, to get a qualifying score, since top six are gonna get a championship assignment (Olympics + 4cc where a qualifying score is necessary), and there is jw for younger girls too. So there are about 6-9 girls needing qualifying score for their assignment, and with this deep field about 18 girls can place top 9 on a good day
    Last edited by jlai; 10-14-2013 at 04:29 PM.

  16. #316
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Again: Flatt has competed at one competition last year and she has done very poorly for her standards there. So other US Ladies have proven on the ice that they are better than her (Flatt's SA score would have her 13th at Nationals) but more importantly even more US Ladies have proven that they are improving and gaining new skills whilst Flatt is regressing and is nowhere near the shape that she used to be in the past. Why invest in a skater like that? Why not give an opportunity to somebody who is showing potential and making improvements instead? I just don't understand it at all. To me, it looks like Flatt is getting preferential treatment and I don't understand why.
    If Rachael was getting preferential treatment, they would have found a way for her to by-pass the regionals and sectionals process by assigning her to international events that conflict with both events. As it is, she may be going to Nice, but she also is at regionals as we speak and as it stands she doesn't have an event that would conflict with sectionals.

    And okay, Rachael would have been 13th at Nationals. As others have pointed out, everyone in the Top 12 have received some sort of international assignment. 1-5 (plus Mirai and Samantha and Caroline Zhang in 7th and 8th and 11th) got GPs, Siraj (5th), Wang (9th) and Miller (10th) got JGPs and Cain got Nebelhorn. In additional Gold, Zadwadski, Hicks and Cesario went to Salt Lake Senior B and Mirai and Vanessa Lam (who like Rachel was also injured and did not compete at Nationals) got Finlandia. The top 5 in juniors all have JGP as well. So I'm still not sure who is exactly being deprived of an assignment cause of Flatt. I guess you could argue any of the folks above should get a second assignment, but there are still some other Senior Bs, so there are opportunities for that too.

    FWIW, the person who did finish 13th at Nationals, Kiri Baga, is also going to Nice.

  17. #317

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Again: Flatt has competed at one competition last year and she has done very poorly for her standards there. So other US Ladies have proven on the ice that they are better than her (Flatt's SA score would have her 13th at Nationals) but more importantly even more US Ladies have proven that they are improving and gaining new skills whilst Flatt is regressing and is nowhere near the shape that she used to be in the past. Why invest in a skater like that? Why not give an opportunity to somebody who is showing potential and making improvements instead? I just don't understand it at all. To me, it looks like Flatt is getting preferential treatment and I don't understand why.
    As others have already asked then - who do you think should go in her place? Who is this hypothetical skater that is missing out?

  18. #318

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    I see Flatt and Czisny in the same boat. Both were injured last year, both had terrible outings at their last international assignment, both have been top ten in the world, both are returning from injury. I realize it may not be the same posters, but there seems to be a lot more slack given to Czisny, who even in her prime, has never been as consistent a skater as Flatt. Heck, some people seemed to think that Czisny should be able to get to Nationals with only doubles! Seriously?
    A good rant is cathartic. Ranting is what keeps me sane. They always come from a different place. Take the prime minister, for example. Sometimes when I rant about him, I am angry; other times, I am just severely annoyed - it's an important distinction. - Rick Mercer

  19. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by mag View Post
    I see Flatt and Czisny in the same boat. Both were injured last year, both had terrible outings at their last international assignment, both have been top ten in the world, both are returning from injury. I realize it may not be the same posters, but there seems to be a lot more slack given to Czisny, who even in her prime, has never been as consistent a skater as Flatt. Heck, some people seemed to think that Czisny should be able to get to Nationals with only doubles! Seriously?
    It's one thing to say Flatt has been more consistent, but if you actually look at their competitive records Czisny shines a lot brighter than Flatt IMO. Up to this point, she and Wagner have been the only two US women to win gold at a major Sr. international since Kimmie Meissner retired. (No, I'm not counting Hicks or Zawadzki at the US Senior B the last two years, or Nagasu at Finlandia a few years back as having a major impact)

    That being said, I don't see either of them having a shot at an Olympic spot. I do wish them both the best in achieving their personal goals this season.

  20. #320

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    Rachael has a realistic shot at finishing in the top 6 at Nationals and making the 4CC team. I really fail see how making sure she has a chance to compete internationally and fulfill the min TS scores requirements shows any preferential treatment from USFSA.
    Last edited by ioana; 10-14-2013 at 05:37 PM.

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