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  1. #201

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post
    There is no misunderstanding - to quote you -

    Why mention Non-Asian if you were not suggesting I were? And what do you mean by being part of a buddy group? And to be so rude about someone does not suggest that it is fun reading my posts.

    Well you were incredibly wrong but because I am gracious I appreciate that you have apologised and I will accept it. But you really should think before you write something like that again about anyone on this forum.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post
    I had a look at IceAlisa's posts and all I can see is that she is just not a fan of Yu Na. Just basically said Yu Na does nothing for her. Totally acceaptable to say that. But at no time is she putting her down, espousing hate nore being incredibly negative. It is just about personal preference. But the fact you are interpreting that way indicates that I think you are being particularly sensitive.
    That was my take, too. If anything, most of what IceAlisa has been saying/criticizing about Yuna could only help Yuna in her overall skating.

  2. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtherlore View Post
    Sorry if I offended you. But I meant it. I have some doubt if she's from down under and non-Asian as her nickname suggests. Hope I'm wrong, but the pattern and repetition seem so typical.
    LMAO. Not every person who doesn't think Kim is a heavenly creature or the goddess of figure skating is Japanese. Although OTOH I do strongly suspect that a lot of the Kim fanaticism is strongly tied to patriotism.
    You are so ridiculously deluded. You need to realize that figure skating has been in existence long before Yuna Kim was born and there have been/are MANY skaters who have made a stronger artstic impression than she ever did and you need to stop blaming people who are simply not THAT impressed by her in that respect. Perhaps get out there and watch more figure skating would help?!

  3. #203

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    Michelle is my favorite skater of all time but, really, saying "those same feelings came across to everyone in the arena" is not likely to be accurate. Personally, I appreciated her lots more on tv than live.
    Fair enough. Obviously not EVERYONE felt that way but I think my point still stands.
    -Brian
    "Michelle would never be caught with sausage grease staining her Vera Wang." - rfisher

  4. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Willy View Post
    I had a look at IceAlisa's posts and all I can see is that she is just not a fan of Yu Na. Just basically said Yu Na does nothing for her. Totally acceaptable to say that. But at no time is she putting her down, espousing hate nore being incredibly negative. It is just about personal preference. But the fact you are interpreting that way indicates that I think you are being particularly sensitive.
    Perhaps, this was the first time you read Icealisa's post about YuNa. She has been saying exactly same story on YuNa again, again, over the years.

  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by l'etoile View Post
    That was my take, too. If anything, most of what IceAlisa has been saying/criticizing about Yuna could only help Yuna in her overall skating.
    Sorry, but how could "I don't like her" comment in any way help YuNa in her overall skating? Could "I think she is ugly" comment help any woman to become beautiful?

  6. #206
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    Aussie Willy and l'etoile, thank you for understanding what I mean. And yes, I have been saying similar things about Yuna because the aspects of her skating that keep me from being a die hard fan haven't really improved. Every season that she competes I look for that change and every season I am disappointed.
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  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by bardtoob View Post
    If you are talking about the word emotion/emotional being in an ISU Communication or the rule book in the description for the category Performance/Execution, I was uncertain I knew a reference. If you had a particular reference to the rule book or an ISU Communication, like Aussie, you should have provided it
    I should have, why exactly? Almost every figure skating fan who posts on a forum and discusses figure skating in this day and age has come across that document, and if not, most are acquainted with a site called Google. I did not have a particular reference, since I was going by memory; hence the "if I remember correctly."

    http://www.isu.org/vsite/vfile/page/...-0-file,00.pdf

    There it is. If you don't have Adobe Reader or Acrobat, again, try www.google.com

    Quote Originally Posted by bardtoob View Post
    If your point is that the content of ISU Communications and the ISU rule book in the PCS descriptions is in "plain English", meaning clear descriptions in English, I would say that the language in the PCS descriptions is a load of garbage in English words that mask the political nature of the category, and Performance and Execution have no business being combined. However, that is off topic.
    Uh, yeah. It's completely off topic, I disagree with you, and that's NOT my point at all.

    My point was to reassert that while I agree with you that emotions are not judged as part of Choreography, they are judged as part of Performance. Then for some unknown reason you stated you had uncertainty on your part and that there is a PCS category of "Performance Execution" [sic], and that it's "not just performance" (an assertion that no one made.)

    If you are going to try to "correct" someone, at least be correct.

  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman View Post
    I have never connected or been moved by Yu-na until this performance. She was a revelation to me. Her performance is a finely nuanced one with delicate subtlety. For me, it is the most exciting and moving performance I have seen from a male or female since Michelle left competition. The sheer beauty of it. A few of the hand movements seemed more mechanic than felt, but when a skater knows a difficult jump is coming up I would expect these kinds of occasional lapses.

    Does anyone think she might have peaked and too soon? I remember when Michelle skated Arianne (spelling) for the first time, at the world pro competition. She was absolutely brilliant and flawless. This was the program she did the Charlotte at the beginning. She never was able to skate the program that way again, not at nationals nor at worlds, albeit she was not feeling her best at worlds due to flu or cold.
    I doubt she peaked already. Remember this girl just started her come-back training regimen a few months ago! She made some serious mistakes in the SP at nationals and she's publicly acknowledged in her interviews after the competition that she still has to work on her spins and other elements. I expect she'll be much improved by Worlds. Granted, I don't expect her to pull off another clean LP at Worlds, since Yuna rarely does clean LP's, but who knows, right?

    I also expect her to be much improved expression-wise. She must have focused at least 80% of her efforts in regaining her technical skills in the last few months, given her long break. Had she simply been in maintenance mode, she would have had more time to focus on and refine her choreography and performance. But based on what we know, she's spent most of her efforts rebuilding her stamina, retraining spins and refining jumps. I think now she's reached a point where she can concentrate more of her training time on musicality and expression for the next two months leading up to Worlds.

  9. #209
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    I have been following this thread closely and my feelings have shifted from being extremely proud of Yuna's accomplishment to a big disappointment when reading some of the exchanges that happened in this thread. I am really saddened by the fact that some posters whose opinions I respect deeply were treated the way they were for expressing an opinion.

    I am a huge Yuna fan (see my user name) but I would be the first to say that Yuna's performances at Korean nationals, to me, were not yet at her peak artistic standard. That does not take away from the fact that they were brilliant performances, technically outstanding, and got me tearing up at the end out of happiness for her and all her fans, especially in Korea, in that great moment. But, artistically, for me, the performances were "just" very good in comparison to her previous level. It is understandable that she woukd have been more focused on the technical side, especially after that much time away. In fact, as far as timing is concerned, this feels more like a summer competition for Yuna. I fully expect her to be at her artistic peak come worlds. There was already a huge difference from NRW, as far as i could see.

    So, i encourage Yuna fans to take a deep breath and not interpret any criticism of Yuna as an attack on her. Like all great skaters, she has strengths and weaknesses. Yuna herself acknowledged that she is not perfect and that, as of NRW three weeks ago, she was still more focused on the technical side. Programs take time to grow. Besides, no matter how much we, her fans, like her skating, some people, while still acknowledging her technical prowess, will not be as emotionally attached to it as we are. As far as I could tell, all posters were very complimentary of her achievement.

    Let's all enjoy these historical moments because, unfortunately for us Yuna fans, there aren't many of those left.

  10. #210

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    Quote Originally Posted by PUNKPRINCESS View Post
    My point was to reassert that while I agree with you that emotions are not judged as part of Choreography, they are judged as part of Performance. Then for some unknown reason you stated you had uncertainty on your part and that there is a PCS category of "Performance Execution" [sic], and that it's "not just performance" (an assertion that no one made.)
    I am thinking this went in a direction neither of use intended, PUNKPRINCESS. I'm hoping we can get past it. I did actually learn something despite this going all wrong.
    Last edited by bardtoob; 01-10-2013 at 05:45 AM.

  11. #211

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    Quote Originally Posted by IceAlisa View Post
    Aussie Willy and l'etoile, thank you for understanding what I mean. And yes, I have been saying similar things about Yuna because the aspects of her skating that keep me from being a die hard fan haven't really improved. Every season that she competes I look for that change and every season I am disappointed.
    I agree. Her line, toe point and over all positions are not attractive to me, and there for, I am not a fan.

  12. #212

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    Quote Originally Posted by yunasashafan View Post
    Whole post.
    Excellent post.
    When you are up to your arse in alligators it is difficult to remember you were only meant to be draining the swamp.

  13. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    LMAO. Not every person who doesn't think Kim is a heavenly creature or the goddess of figure skating is Japanese. Although OTOH I do strongly suspect that a lot of the Kim fanaticism is strongly tied to patriotism.
    ....
    Don’t push it, troll. You don’t know better.

    I believe those who go after her and her fandom repeatedly with the same pattern and contents, in many occasions in concerted efforts, are strongly tied by nationality or (Japanese) nationalistic origin. I suspect many of them are with fake or misleading identities or multiple ids, and I experienced a ghost nic responding to my post in this forum.

    About Aussie Willy, read my posts. I’ve never conceded to her self-implied identity. I actually think I nailed her.

  14. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by yunasashafan View Post
    I have been following this thread closely and my feelings have shifted from being extremely proud of Yuna's accomplishment to a big disappointment when reading some of the exchanges that happened in this thread. I am really saddened by the fact that some posters whose opinions I respect deeply were treated the way they were for expressing an opinion.

    I am a huge Yuna fan (see my user name) but I would be the first to say that Yuna's performances at Korean nationals, to me, were not yet at her peak artistic standard. That does not take away from the fact that they were brilliant performances, technically outstanding, and got me tearing up at the end out of happiness for her and all her fans, especially in Korea, in that great moment. But, artistically, for me, the performances were "just" very good in comparison to her previous level. It is understandable that she woukd have been more focused on the technical side, especially after that much time away. In fact, as far as timing is concerned, this feels more like a summer competition for Yuna. I fully expect her to be at her artistic peak come worlds. There was already a huge difference from NRW, as far as i could see.

    So, i encourage Yuna fans to take a deep breath and not interpret any criticism of Yuna as an attack on her. Like all great skaters, she has strengths and weaknesses. Yuna herself acknowledged that she is not perfect and that, as of NRW three weeks ago, she was still more focused on the technical side. Programs take time to grow. Besides, no matter how much we, her fans, like her skating, some people, while still acknowledging her technical prowess, will not be as emotionally attached to it as we are. As far as I could tell, all posters were very complimentary of her achievement.

    Let's all enjoy these historical moments because, unfortunately for us Yuna fans, there aren't many of those left.
    Of course not. YuNa's greatest performances all came out at Worlds and Olympics, at her 4th or fifth performances of the year. Not only YuNa but most other skaters too. Did any skater give her or his best performance on GP? Further, this was only her 2nd performance after 2 years break. But, there were unjusitifiably slanted criticisms.

  15. #215

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    Quote Originally Posted by lakewood View Post
    Sorry, but how could "I don't like her" comment in any way help YuNa in her overall skating? Could "I think she is ugly" comment help any woman to become beautiful?
    Phrases can be harsh sometimes when they're criticisms. And, to be clear, IceAlisa never said "I think she is ugly" but she did point out her leg line could improve a lot more which is correct. Sure, if "I don't like her" is what IceAlisa said, it's true that it has no way of actually helping Yuna's skating, yet you should know that it was her opinion, not a criticism. People don't have to like Yuna like they don't have to like any other skaters.

    Quote Originally Posted by IceAlisa View Post
    Aussie Willy and l'etoile, thank you for understanding what I mean. And yes, I have been saying similar things about Yuna because the aspects of her skating that keep me from being a die hard fan haven't really improved. Every season that she competes I look for that change and every season I am disappointed.
    Like above, AFAIK, IceAlisa has been consistent in a way that she expresses her complaints about Yuna's line, so it prevents her from being an invested fan of Yuna's overall. That is just it.


    Quote Originally Posted by yunasashafan View Post
    I have been following this thread closely and my feelings have shifted from being extremely proud of Yuna's accomplishment to a big disappointment when reading some of the exchanges that happened in this thread. I am really saddened by the fact that some posters whose opinions I respect deeply were treated the way they were for expressing an opinion.

    I am a huge Yuna fan (see my user name) but I would be the first to say that Yuna's performances at Korean nationals, to me, were not yet at her peak artistic standard. That does not take away from the fact that they were brilliant performances, technically outstanding, and got me tearing up at the end out of happiness for her and all her fans, especially in Korea, in that great moment. But, artistically, for me, the performances were "just" very good in comparison to her previous level. It is understandable that she woukd have been more focused on the technical side, especially after that much time away. In fact, as far as timing is concerned, this feels more like a summer competition for Yuna. I fully expect her to be at her artistic peak come worlds. There was already a huge difference from NRW, as far as i could see.

    So, i encourage Yuna fans to take a deep breath and not interpret any criticism of Yuna as an attack on her. Like all great skaters, she has strengths and weaknesses. Yuna herself acknowledged that she is not perfect and that, as of NRW three weeks ago, she was still more focused on the technical side. Programs take time to grow. Besides, no matter how much we, her fans, like her skating, some people, while still acknowledging her technical prowess, will not be as emotionally attached to it as we are. As far as I could tell, all posters were very complimentary of her achievement.

    Let's all enjoy these historical moments because, unfortunately for us Yuna fans, there aren't many of those left.
    Thank you for this!

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    So much drama. LOL.

    I'm a Yuna fan. Obviously. But I agree that Yuna is not known for her good lines or flexibility. I think it's a valid criticism. I think she will never have a good line like Alissa, Mao or Michelle, so I just give up on that.

    As for her LP, I can understand why some are having a hard time liking this program. It's underwhelming I guess. But I appreciate her skate here. It's so rare when skated clean in LP. You could see she's a competitor and based from her interviews I'm liking her fire after the competition.

    Wish Yuna the very best.

  17. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by l'etoile View Post
    Phrases can be harsh sometimes when they're criticisms. And, to be clear, IceAlisa never said "I think she is ugly" but she did point out her leg line could improve a lot more which is correct. Sure, if "I don't like her" is what IceAlisa said, it's true that it has no way of actually helping Yuna's skating, yet you should know that it was her opinion, not a criticism. People don't have to like Yuna like they don't have to like any other skaters.
    To be clear, I did not say Ice Alisa said "I think she is ugly". It was an example to point out that such comment would not be helpful. She has been saying virtually "I don't like her and her skating" so many times on this board over the years. I am sure her point was taken sufficiently by everybody.

  18. #218
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    Poor ubers.

    I think that someone who works as hard as Yuna to become the best jumper in woman's skating IMO, could certainly improve the line, toes, layback, etc., if she chose, if she thought it was important and/or if she were pushed by the judges. Just to think how many more of us would get onto the Yuna train if she did! I think that someone like her could do almost anything in skating, which means I hold her to a very high standard, the standard she sets herself with her work ethic and her stunning technical ability.

    But one thing is definitely a lie: that I don't like Yuna, the person. I have nothing but respect and admiration for her athleticism and persistence. She is not just coming back, she is coming back very strong, not a half-a$$ed comeback that some attempt. Some sadly delusional statements here. Oh well. That's FSU.
    "Nature is a damp, inconvenient sort of place where birds and animals wander about uncooked."

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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    LMAO. ... You are so ridiculously deluded.
    This troll never goes away, does it? The same stuff written in every thread about a skater it despises and links what one group of people says to an entire ethnic group.

  20. #220

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    It's like watching a pack of piranhas fight for food. A title with "Yuna" and bam! The fish are there.

    I adore Yuna's 3-3 consistency, her arms, and the spark she has in some of her programs; the (lack of) flexibility, layback, and toe-points, I'm not a fan of. Overall, I don't feel any way in particular about her - I appreciate her hard work and look forward to what she'll accomplish in the next 14 months.

    I wonder if anyone would ever ask her about her layback and feet though, as an open, no-judgment, super peaceful kind of conversation. Like IceAlisa said, I'm sure it's not without thought, and I'm curious why. This conversation is probably an impossible fantasy.

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