"If I agree well it's just to appease you 'cause I don't remember what were fighting for..." - Sarah McLachlan
IMO it qualifies more as faux classical.I don't know if we can consider Otonal as classical music
I do not think anybody, including Katarzyna, thinks Otonal is classical since Raul di Blasio is considered a contemporary jazz artist, but it does have the qualities that gkelly previously mentioned that make it easy to use in a skating program.
Last edited by bardtoob; 01-05-2013 at 11:45 PM.
For the whole discussion what’s classics and what not, I’ll stick with the definition of Wikipedia (though of course wiki cannot be considered high science ), that the common period of classics was between 1550 and 1900, which means that music composed after 1900 fitting the characteristics of classic is not automatically considered as not being classics.
I remember when I was at secondary school in Austria (probably kind of Junior High school compared to U.S.) we had musical education as a subject and we had to learn about classic composers, their lives, their works and so on. – And this included many composers who actually were born / composed after 1900, e.g. Stravinski, Rachmaninov or Karl Orff - Carmina Burana for example was composed in 1937. Here is another clip:
Anissina / Peizerat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fsvq-N7xAtc (WC 2000, FD)
I also think that skaters using classics have another big advantage: as the majority of programmes was and is done to classics, it is kind of well accepted practice among the judges. Though I love classics in skating, I actually don’t like that as reasoning for choosing classics, but just look how often even skaters who didn’t always skate to classics stick with it e.g. during a Olympic season.
Beethoven's Seventh Symphony
Leonova & Khvalko - can't find vid
Gliere Harp Concerto
Sasha Cohen - Mendelssohn Cello Concerto
Rachmaninoff Piano Concerto (#2 and 3)
Naomi Nari Nam
Mikkeline Kierkegaard - Rondo Capriccioso
Meditation de Thais
Mahler's 5th Symphony
Virtue & Moir
Sibelius - Valse Triste
Virtue & Moir
Drobiazko & Vanagas, 1999
Drobiazko & Vanagas, 2012
Rahkamo & Kokko
Grishuk & Platov
Rossini - La Pie Voleuse
Gordeeva & Grinkov
Denkova & Staviyski
Mussogorsky - Night on Bald Mountain
Kohklova & Novitsky
Grieg - Peer Gynt
Totmianina & Marinin
Peter Barna - Paganini Violin Concerto
More Valse Triste by Johnny Weir:
More Meditation de Thais by Berezhnaya Sikharulidze:
I like to add Sailor dance by Gliere (I love this music piece, possibly because I also love Russian Music):
Artem Borodulin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NguravwO0iA (EC 2009, SP)
Viacheslav Zagorodiuk: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kr-gqGxwQXI (1996 Centennial on Ice, SP)
and my favourite one:
Sasha Abt: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8v4qLdIJp0s (CoR 2003, SP)
Well, that's good to know. It would certainly be a shame if somebody from Austria did not have a decent grasp of Classical music, even as it is formally defined. The last time I was there I vowed I would go to listen more so than sightsee the next time.I remember when I was at secondary school in Austria (probably kind of Junior High school compared to U.S.) we had musical education as a subject and we had to learn about classic composers, their lives, their works and so on. – And this included many composers who actually were born / composed after 1900, e.g. Stravinski, Rachmaninov or Karl Orff - Carmina Burana for example was composed in 1937.
... I would still call music of the middle 19th century to the early 20th century that followed common practice "Romantic", possibly qualifying it with "that is, late Classical music", depending on my audience, since the Romantic era is generally well understood as immediately preceding the Modern era in so many disciplines.
Last edited by bardtoob; 01-06-2013 at 02:48 AM.
Man, y'all are way overthinking and overanalyzing this. Whoever said classical music is like porn is right. You know it when you hear it. I've never ever heard anyone debate the term "classical music." There is a classical period within the overarching genre of classical music that is epitomized by the music of Haydn, Mozart and early Beethoven , but to parse the definition of classical music over this and argue that Bach nor Brahms can be called classical composers is beyond ridiculous.
This is much more accurate from wikipedia:
The dates of the Classical period in Western music are generally accepted as being between about 1750 and 1820. However, the term classical music is used colloquially to describe a variety of Western musical styles from the ninth century to the present, and especially from the sixteenth or seventeenth to the nineteenth.
Generally, I do consider most 20th century composers to still be in the colloquial "classical music" genre, Schoenberg, Berg, Stavinsky, Hindemith, Ravel, Poulenc, Vaughn Williams... in fact, the 20th century was the great age for American composers: Bernstein, Hanson, Piston, Copeland, Ives, Persichetti. There is absolutely not doubt that I would describe all of these composers as "classical."
(Note that I say the above as someone who was an accomplished classical musician, playing/performing internationally in several top US youth ensembles (orchestras/quintets), studied privately under a member of a Big 5 orchestra for eight years. I decided not to go the conservatory route or make it my career but did minor in music theory and history at an Ivy with a well respected musicology program.)
Edited to add some actual skating content to my post:
Best program representing the Baroque period of classical music, Denkova/Stavski's 2003 OD!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsAhLiGTva8
Last edited by BreakfastClub; 01-06-2013 at 03:41 AM.
More Valse Triste by Alissa Czisny:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA158YOWQVE (TEB 2011, LP)
Shen/Zhao: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHQRfNDX3kI (GPF 2004, LP)
Bechke/Petov: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWaSkMn25Kw (OG 1992, LP)
Sasha Cohen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PddOi_Dmlc (WC 2005, LP)
All I'm saying is, if you put Bach and Stravinsky and Verdi into the same genre/category, this genre would be too large and too diverse to be meaningful or insightful for the purpose of grouping and comparing with other genre (e.g., jazz, popular, folk, dance, music theater, modern). It becomes increasingly ambiguous and pointless if we are to put Leonard Bernstein, who did a little of everything, (as well as George Gershwin) into the class of "classical composers".
I am often bemused and disappointed that Bolero is Ravel's most popular, most well-known work. I have by no means heard everything by Ravel, but anything else of his I've heard is more interesting and less boring than Bolero. (There is speculation that the repetitiveness in Bolero was actually an early manifestation of Ravel's dementia. See report on RadioLab.) Figure skating does little to correct this injustice, but there have been some good and interesting programs using Ravel's music that's not Bolero:
1. Amanda Evora & Mark Ladwig 2011-12 free skate to Daphnis et Chloe, choreographed by Jim Peterson. A lovely and difficult program. Unfortunately I cannot find a video on YouTube.
2. So Youn Park (KOR) 2012-13 short program to Pantoum. The program's requirement for interpretation is subtle but in fact quite difficult.
3. Paul Wylie 1992 short program to La Valse. The interpretation is textbook.
4. Yasmin Siraj 2011-2013 short program also to Daphnis et Chloe, choreographed by Jamie Isley. Full of transitions with difficult, precise interpretation.
It seems that Ravel's music puts out a tall challenge for choreography and interpretation, and those who take it on have to be very good at it or the result would be a hot mess.
Last edited by Jun Y; 01-08-2013 at 02:37 AM.
brb, this thread sent me on a Sasha Abt trip.