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  1. #441
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    thank you for the support. i appreciate it.

    so ... sahararainfall noticed that the photo post was missing and kindly sent a few links to get me started. i spent some time putting it together. here it is

  2. #442
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    ...
    Last edited by iggie; 12-19-2012 at 11:50 PM.

  3. #443
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPtVLfASU3U
    For your viewing pleasure!

  4. #444

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macassar88 View Post
    Ooolalaaaa ~

    OTOH i am gutted for them loosing out GPF, oh well there's still worlds to go. Come on Carmen....

  5. #445

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macassar88 View Post
    I think Scott is bigger now

    From FF Look at photo 34
    http://www.yuga.ru/photo/1698.html
    Last edited by pani; 12-20-2012 at 05:50 AM.

  6. #446
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    Quote Originally Posted by Macassar88 View Post
    ooh boy.

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  8. #448

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    Nice physique on Scott...he's very well muscled. Poor Tessa with a "shiner". I'll bet Scott felt bad about that. I guess stuff like that goes with the territory and Tessa didn't seem to be to put out about it.
    Addicted to FSU

  9. #449
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    remember if you havent voted for v/m, go vote now
    http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/show...77#post3775577

  10. #450

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    I'll bet Scott felt bad about that.
    I am sure he felt bad.

    remember if you havent voted for v/m, go vote now
    Look like D-W become more active now

  11. #451

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  12. #452
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    sorry to be such a tease, guys.

    I recorded Étoiles sur glace and the GPF on my PVR, so unfortunately I have no links to provide at the moment.

  13. #453
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    Some very belated thoughts on GPF… or should i say, a little confession as a T/S fan (and walrus).
    I must say that for the first time in my life I’m in disagreement with Tessa and Scott… due to the changes they made to the Carmen FD. The general feeling about the new version was that now the program looks more generic, and that some precious moments of the routine are gone. Now, I think everyone also agree that since the very first tidbits we received about this FD, the feeling has been that this is program meant to take a new direction not only from what they have done before, but from what it has been shown in ice dance under COP. Especially in the case of Carmen, we all witnessed a non-generic take on it, at last, with the potential of becoming one of the greatest programs in ice dance history. Now, maybe after the first two outings in the GP I placed my expectations on the program too high, or something. They talked about changes to earn more points but still keeping the creativity. Sadly, I see less creativity in this program, hence, it is not the same as before, and I’m just a little disappointed. It’s like seeing changes in the famous “Aria” or “Four seasons” legendary, perfect programs. Before GPF, Carmen was perfect as those programs. It really trascended the sport, telling something very deep and new about the story of Carmen, or even about the human heart… it went straight to the soul. Hearing them talk about making some changes to get more points, and then seeing the program changed, well…it was a disappointment and now I can’t watch it with the same enthusiasm and emotional envolvement as before, for I feel kind of…betrayed. Now, why I’m complaining so much? Because I do think Tessa and Scott could have kept it the way it was for the GPF, and practicing it till Worlds, because for me the problem is not the levels of the step sequences, but the slight rustiness of their skating, being a recent, hard program etc. etc. Now, I figure that after Cup of Russia and after checking their rivals’ marks at NHK trophy, they feared to lose the GPF again, so they made the changes. But it was a mistake. Because it was so so clear that Davis and White would have got the gold at this point of the season. I wonder why they didn’t see the similar pattern of last year. They got lower scores than them in both their GP. The other team was getting sky high PCS for a program who’s much less interesting, innovative, well-acted and soul-wrenching. Changes or not changes, they were not supposed to win now. Probably, as last year, they’ll start winning at Four continents, after having trained the FD much more, both technically and artistically, and after a certain shift in “politics”, but let’s not go there. The fact is, they should have been much more aware that their material is superior, and “respect” it more, and just have the patience and confidence to keep it as it was. Announcing changes and then losing doesn’t seem a good strategy. Now, someone could say, well, it’s easy to talk like this when you are not the athlete who competes and wants to win. But we’re talking about a GPF title here. As Patrick Chan said, no one remembers the GPF winner. It seems to count so much at the start of the season, with the Gran Prix drama, the comparisons of the scores and oh my god, but as the seasons progress it clearly starts to count less and less.
    I understand that they want to win. Personally, I’m not a competitive person, because I tend to value less “glorious” things in life, but I respect the mindset of elite athletes. What I say is that changing a masterpiece in the “desperate” effort to capture a silly GPF title is not the right mindset. I think this is the result of the insane pressure they must be under being “neck-to-neck” with their training mates. I can’t even imagine how hard it must be mentally, and forget all the standard talks like “it’s a good thing, we’re pushing each other etc. etc.” It’s not that good if, in order to beat their rivals, they come up with a wrong strategy like this one.
    But I must say, even if we were talking of the World title here, my opinion wouldn’t change that much. Because if two people come up with such an outstanding artistic program, they should stick to it, no matter the outcome. Feel free to disagree but… After winning the Oly medal and two World medals…in the big scheme of things, is it THAT important to win gold again, I wonder? With the competition being in the home town, they will be absolutely adored by the audience and their program(s) will bring down the house. Even if they don’t win, everyone (well, almost everyone) in that arena would absolutely be certain that they were the best on so many levels. At this point of their glorious career, isn’t it a little more important to stick to a fantastic artistic project, instead of adding an other piece of yellow metal to their closet?
    Well, now that it’s out of my chest, I would like to know if I’m somehow misunderstanding something… I would much appreciate to read different views on the subject so that I can get a better picture of the situation. In any case, thanks for reading, friends!

  14. #454

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    Beautifully said Martyross, I hope someone is listening. I will vote for the art more than the sport for sure... for the reason art lasts longer.

  15. #455
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    great to see you here, os! you're a guest of honor in VM thread

  16. #456
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    Firstly, I don't think they changed it to win the GPF. They changed it to win everything.

    Secondly, you forget that at this point last season, they had to make changes to improve and eventually win - indeed, D/W lost just as much because they DIDN'T change or improve as the season went on. V/M changed the first footwork sequence and the lift. They completely rejiggered the short dance. So they did that this season.

    Thirdly, if they weren't interested in winning, we wouldn't have Virtue/Moir competing. No competitive V/M... no Carmen. I'd argue to dismiss winning as a "little piece of yellow" is well..... dismissive.

    As for the changes.... I'm gonna wait and see, honestly. I don't mind the first step sequence changes at all, actually. The second one.... well, I think originally that the second step sequence might be the single greatest piece of choreography they've ever done. I hope that they can bring the second one up to that level. But there's still soo much brilliance in this FD. The challenging audacity of the expression is still there. The soul-stirring connection is still there. The thrilling sexuality, the keening rage, the exhilarating bravado...... it's all still there.

  17. #457

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    I'm gonna take the middle of the road here. While I do care about what Carmen brings in the current world of ice dance (i.e. a glimpse of what was great about the old system), I also understand and respect their competitive fire. Being number 1 isn't just about hanging a few more golds around their neck, it's a validation of their hard work, not only by fans, but also by people who belong to the same world as Tessa and Scott. Being recognized within that world, as well as outside it, gives meaning to everything they've been working on for the last 15 years.

    Personally, I don't feel that the changes they've done alter the spirit of the program. The circular step sequence is only slightly modified and, although I do miss the old diagonal SS, I think the new one is very intricate and difficult as well. They just haven't had time to polish it yet, and I hope they add a little more fire to it. I loved that the two original step sequences were in such total contrast in terms of feeling - it's what I want them to capture again. Otherwise, for me, it's the same "Carmen" we all fell in love with at Skate Canada.

    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable
    But there's still soo much brilliance in this FD. The challenging audacity of the expression is still there. The soul-stirring connection is still there. The thrilling sexuality, the keening rage, the exhilarating bravado...... it's all still there.
    You've said it so much better than me.

  18. #458
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    Yeah, I wouldn't say the program is now a generic one. It's VERY FAR from being generic, even with the changes. I've watched the GPF performance many times now and I can say that there are actually bits I like better now. I wouldn't have tinkered with the diagonal step sequence, but even there, the changes do not betray the soul of the program. For example, I miss Tessa's mad twizzle, but now that they do it together, it works and it still pretty damn intricate. I understand your protectiveness towards the program, I feel the same way, but there's a lot of brilliance in there and I do not feel the changes (which were not as drastic as I thought they would be) compromised the artistry? My two cents.

    Also, keep in mind that the camera work was atrocious, so we didn't really see the diagonal step sequence. Oh, and I like the circular one better now, especially the transitions. BEAUTEOUS.

  19. #459
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    I don't feel the same way with you at all Martyross. I know they changed the step sequences as an attempt to get more levels, but in what way do you think these changes made the whole FD more generic and less creative? As Proustable said, the highlights that made this FD a standout are still there.

  20. #460
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    Sorry, martyross, but too. Besides the step sequences, they haven't changed anything - not even one of the dance moves, lifts, their spin or transitions. And the change in the first step sequence is not even that noticeable. In the second sequence the changes are more noticeable, but I don't think that it leaves such a huge impact on the artistry of the program as you say. In short, I agree with Proustable, IoanaC, Golightly and walei.

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