Skating 'queen' Kim set to return (Threads merged)

[spikydurian]

Love the fact that Yuna is truly coming back. There were so many talks about come-backs but so far, the only 'come back' I saw was Weir and Yuna. Unfortunately, Weir got injured and a come-back became a non-come back. Yuna still has the talent (they don't disappear) and all she need is training and work towards Sochi. I think she may place a more realistic goal for 2013 Worlds as I believe her sight is set for 2014. Whatever ... it takes a lot for someone who is so famous to come back. It's a huge risk to her reputation not to win OGM but realistically, knowing her calibre, it is possible though not absolute since there are other upcoming skaters. I am not complaining..... the ladies will push each other to excel just like the men.
Welcome back to competitions, Yuna. You can do it!

[Vash01]

Well, Mao got almost 197 with 5 clean triples (only 3F, 3Lo), but Yuna landed 9 triples (including three true 3Lz!), and got 201.6! Compared to Mao, Yuna's score is quite reasonable! (rather underscored)

9 triples???? What are you smoking? The ladies are allowed only 7 triples. It seems you counted some of her doubles (or may be even the fall) as triples. From reading your posts, I am getting that you worship Yu na to the extent you cannot see the reality.

Mao's program was much more polished and delivered better than Yu na's. She had more transitions, better footwork, better spins to justify her tech marks and the PCS. It's not just the number of jumps that is counted. Yu na did a single axel, popped the double toe after that, and she had a fall in her program. She did not have many transitions in this program. I believe it's a work in progress, so it will get better, but at this time this skate was not better than Mao's. The lutzes were gorgeous and for someone that had been away a long time she skated great, but to say her skate in this competition was better than Mao's well delivered skate at GPF is ridiculous.

[giselle23]

9 triples???? What are you smoking? The ladies are allowed only 7 triples. It seems you counted some of her doubles (or may be even the fall) as triples.

9 triples in the short and long combined, maybe?

[naan]

9 triples???? What are you smoking? The ladies are allowed only 7 triples. It seems you counted some of her doubles (or may be even the fall) as triples. From reading your posts, I am getting that you worship Yu na to the extent you cannot see the reality.

Mao's program was much more polished and delivered better than Yu na's. She had more transitions, better footwork, better spins to justify her tech marks and the PCS. It's not just the number of jumps that is counted. Yu na did a single axel, popped the double toe after that, and she had a fall in her program. She did not have many transitions in this program. I believe it's a work in progress, so it will get better, but at this time this skate was not better than Mao's. The lutzes were gorgeous and for someone that had been away a long time she skated great, but to say her skate in this competition was better than Mao's well delivered skate at GPF is ridiculous.

I'm not smoking! I was saying jumps in SP+LP! OK, I'll not count her 3S (even though she landed), because she had a fall in 2T. But still, she landed 8 triples in SP+LP including difficult three 3Lz.
And I DIDN'T say that Yuna was better. I said Yuna's score looks REASONABLE considering Mao's weak jump contents. Mao got 185 with only 4 clean triples in the SP and LP combined (3F, 3Lo) at NHK, and her performance there was just meh!
I agree with you that Mao's skating was more polished and she delivered better than Yuna. It's natural, because it was Yuna's FIRST competition after a long break, and Mao already had a chance to skate her programs 3-4 times this season. Yuna just needs time to improve her spins, steps, and most of all, her stamina.
However, I don't get it about transitions. I don't think Mao has many transitions at all. Nothing special until the step starts.

[cbd1235]

I'm not smoking! I was saying jumps in SP+LP! OK, I'll not count her 3S (even though she landed), because she had a fall in 2T. But still, she landed 8 triples in SP+LP including difficult three 3Lz.
And I DIDN'T say that Yuna was better. I said Yuna's score looks REASONABLE considering Mao's weak jump contents. Mao got 185 with only 4 clean triples in the SP and LP combined (3F, 3Lo) at NHK, and her performance there was just meh!
I agree with you that Mao's skating was more polished and she delivered better than Yuna. It's natural, because it was Yuna's FIRST competition after a long break, and Mao already had a chance to skate her programs 3-4 times this season. Yuna just needs time to improve her spins, steps, and most of all, her stamina.
However, I don't get it about transitions. I don't think Mao has many transitions at all. Nothing special until the step starts.

Agreed that one thing to point out is that Mao has hardly more transitions than Yuna. Mao is fantastic at making very basic edges and steps look like a million bucks, and she does just that. It gives the illusion of fantastic transitions but she really doesn't have that much. Not a criticism of Mao, but you can't say Yuna has a lot less in terms of transitions...

[Vash01]

9 triples in the short and long combined, maybe?

Is it fair to count SP+LP for Yu na but only LP for Mao?

[Vash01]

I'm not smoking! I was saying jumps in SP+LP! OK, I'll not count her 3S (even though she landed), because she had a fall in 2T. But still, she landed 8 triples in SP+LP including difficult three 3Lz.
And I DIDN'T say that Yuna was better. I said Yuna's score looks REASONABLE considering Mao's weak jump contents. Mao got 185 with only 4 clean triples in the SP and LP combined (3F, 3Lo) at NHK, and her performance there was just meh!
I agree with you that Mao's skating was more polished and she delivered better than Yuna. It's natural, because it was Yuna's FIRST competition after a long break, and Mao already had a chance to skate her programs 3-4 times this season. Yuna just needs time to improve her spins, steps, and most of all, her stamina.
However, I don't get it about transitions. I don't think Mao has many transitions at all. Nothing special until the step starts.

Read my post again. I am making concessions for Yu na's program being new, and guessing that it will get better. However, Yu na getting a higher score (>201) than Mao's (< 197) is not right. The polish and delivery do count. Yu na was overmarked.

[giselle23]

Is it fair to count SP+LP for Yu na but only LP for Mao?

I don't know--I wasn't the one doing the counting; just intrerpreting what the poster probably meant.

[cbd1235]

Is it fair to count SP+LP for Yu na but only LP for Mao?

The original poster was excluding underrotated jumps and flutzes:

Mao: 3F sp, 3Lo sp, 3Lo lp, 3T< lp, 3Lz-e lp, 3F< lp, 3Lo lp, 3F lp (I personally would have counted the flutz in there, but I guess it's still a mistake) - 5 triples (6 rotated, one with a flutz)

Yuna: 3Lz sp, 3T sp, 3F sp, 3Lz lp, 3T lp, 3F lp, 3S lp, 3Lz lp, 3S (fall on combo) - 8 triples (9 rotated, 1 fell)

This isn't from me, I'm just counting the way the original poster did. It's clear that Yuna had the technical edge though. Meh axel in sp, fall on sal combo, and popped lp combo are made up by the extra technical content I'd say

[l'etoile]

Oh, please, can we stop going on and on about Yuna vs Mao quarrel(to put it nicely at least)? They're both beautiful skaters who have their own best qualities. (I know I'm being naive.)

[unicorn]

It's nice to see that Kim is coming back like that. And she said she would compete in next year's GPs too?

[naan]

Read my post again. I am making concessions for Yu na's program being new, and guessing that it will get better. However, Yu na getting a higher score (>201) than Mao's (< 197) is not right. The polish and delivery do count. Yu na was overmarked.

It was the B-competition which is generous to every skater! I said Yuna was overmarked on PCS (2-3 points?), so is it that important? Yuna didn't have a controversial winning as Mao did at NHK. Yuna didn't get ridiculous inflated score as Mao did at NHK, either.
They were both overmarked IMO. I think comparing scores in different events is hard and useless. I don't want Yuna vs Mao debate in this thread anymore, so let's just stop it. We can do this as much as we want at Worlds

[puretea]

Hugh Jackman tweeted
https://twitter.com/RealHughJackman/...18320723607552

Amazing performance Yuna. Congrats.
Everyone is very proud of you! Hope to meet you in person next time.
Merry Xmas. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ye0u0lM9IP4

[lakewood]

The GPF scoring was very generous. Not only Mao but Ashley. I don't think Mao delivered great performance. She was very good at the step sequences but other than that ... . And, her jumps were too weak. She was a clear winner though. But, I think it is reasonable YuNa's performance got higher score than Mao's.

[Sylvia]

Opining on NRW Trophy: Kim's comeback, fairly scored? An analysis:
http://www.examiner.com/article/opin...-fairly-scored

[lowtherlore]

...She did not have many transitions in this program. I believe it's a work in progress, so it will get better, but at this time this skate was not better than Mao's...

???

I wonder if we were watching the same program. If we were, I guess the figure skating that I know is a totally different thing from that in your book. Her LP is PACKED with choreographic moves and transitions. Heck, even her choreo sequence – a tiny part among the current TES constituents – is full of significant choreo and transitions, while most other skaters are showing just a token amount of effort for that element.

It’s fair to say that her Les Mis routine looks VERY demanding, and even a speedy one at that. I actually think that likely we might never get to see a clean skate out of it in competitions, because it’s so packed and demanding.

Hugh Jackman tweeted
https://twitter.com/RealHughJackman/...18320723607552

How nice of him. I hope Yu-Na get to see the film when it world-premieres in Korea on 19 Dec. Maybe she would get additional inspiration as Hugh J suggested.

[lowtherlore]

Opining on NRW Trophy: Kim's comeback, fairly scored? An analysis:
http://www.examiner.com/article/opin...-fairly-scored

That sounds about right and balanced.

[Sylvia]

Korean news article in English: http://koreajoongangdaily.joinsmsn.c...px?aid=2963736

“With the requirements fulfilled [for entry to the world championships], I think she won’t compete in other international events before March,” an official of the All That Sports, Kim’s agency, told the Korea JoongAng Daily.

“She will focus on the Korean Figure Skating Championships and the World Figure Skating Championships.”

[aftershocks]

Opining on NRW Trophy: Kim's comeback, fairly scored? An analysis:
http://www.examiner.com/article/opin...-fairly-scored

That sounds about right and balanced.

ITA. I think Jackie Wong provides a very fair and balanced assessment. I enjoy his reporting on figure skating. Even Yu Na herself admitted that she focused mainly on getting through the elements in her sp, and that she will try to improve her presentation later. Therefore, her PCS should not be very high, but PCS aren't always marked on what a skater actually presents on the ice -- they are boosted along with good technique and clean execution, as well as according to the overall rep of the skater, IMO.

It's also true that GPF scoring was fairly high overall. And it is also difficult to compare scoring across events. Still Jackie Wong, all things considered, did a good job of assessing Mao's and Ashley's marks over the course of GP this season vs. Yu Na's marks at her comeback senior B event.

[momsk8]

Very impressive 1A+1T+1Lo for a "queen" in her FS, what next, a novice competition?