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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    Sorry. I think he made the decision to come back for the same reason he has made EVERY decision since Vancouver....,publicity.

    IMHO Weir believes all the stuff he spouts about being robbed. The fact that it has no reality basis is irrelevant.

    I wish that my first reaction to his withdrawal was not "here we go again".

    Why "Sorry." You're essentially questioning Johnny's integrity, so what's the point of saying, "sorry," when you don't mean it. What you or any of us here believe have very little to do with who Johnny is and what motivates him and the reasons why he makes the decisions that he makes. It's his life.

    IMO, Johnny is a very caring and talented person who has brought a great deal of joy and special moments to the lives of many people. I applaud him for living his life out loud and with conviction and the courage to be himself. Your negative views of Johnny are definitely in the minority ... not necessarily here perhaps but in the world at large.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    Sorry. I think he made the decision to come back for the same reason he has made EVERY decision since Vancouver....,publicity.
    You know, I'm beginning to think that people who seek the spotlight do so to get attention. I think this would make a great thesis, because I don't believe any human has ever made this point before.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    (and as for his TV shows, I could not stand to watch any of them. )
    I also love objectivity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    I loved his skating but the act has just gotten old
    Hmm, yes. But what is it about this "old schtick" that draws us in, makes us open up threads, read them, and post in them so often? It's so old and boring, but draws us in so temptingly! A question for the ages, no?
    It's official. I am madly in love with Meryl Davis.

  3. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    IMO, Johnny is a very caring and talented person who has brought a great deal of joy and special moments to the lives of many people. I applaud him for living his life out loud and with conviction and the courage to be himself. Your negative views of Johnny are definitely in the minority ... not necessarily here perhaps but in the world at large.
    Having met Johnny several times I agree. I found him to be very kind and patient with his fans, remembering their names and making them feel special. Earlier today (Russian time), Johnny and his husband spent four hours meeting and answering questions from his fans, how many skaters do you know who would do that?

  4. #84

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    Re-posting this link from Kiss and Cry (interview was before today's CoR exhibition):
    Quote Originally Posted by Lexxandra View Post
    Johnny's interview from today about injury and his plans
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLeXAOjzgAM
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  5. #85
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    Wait, why did Johnny withdraw from CoR? http://i.imgur.com/vK4iN.gif


    eta: Oh nevermind.

  6. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    You know, I'm beginning to think that people who seek the spotlight do so to get attention. I think this would make a great thesis, because I don't believe any human has ever made this point before.



    I also love objectivity.



    Hmm, yes. But what is it about this "old schtick" that draws us in, makes us open up threads, read them, and post in them so often? It's so old and boring, but draws us in so temptingly! A question for the ages, no?
    Hope springs eternal... I keep hoping he will get back to what I enjoyed and away from the "act for attention"

    He had the ability to really maximize the points system, but he never has. He has beautiful basic skating and used to do great programs that under 6.0 weren't really rewarded. So they bring out a system that's SUPPOSE to rewards spins, transitions etc.. and he suddenly seems to lose those. (Plus watching Weir lately is kind of like a train wreck "what will he do next for attention' The lady Gaga get ups etc.. )

    Trash away, my fireproof suit is on.

  7. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    I wish that my first reaction to his withdrawal was not "here we go again".
    My first reaction to his bomb in the SP was "I bet he withdraws." It was kind of funny when my friend looked up results on his phone while out for Sat night dinner, dropped the phone and I spewed my drink because, "Oh My God Liz you were right!!!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    I loved his skating but the act has just gotten old
    And awfully predictable.

    Johnny was really at his prime physically 2004-2006 and he didn't captialize, perhaps the introduction of CoP in that timeframe killed him. He's right about one thing - he can't mount a comeback like Plushenko. Few have that type of mental or physical makeup, especially not Johnny who has always been too fragile and too sensitive in both categories to max out his real potential. The only time he did was 2004, when he showed up at Nationals focused, prepared and with nothing to lose, ditto 2004 Worlds. Once people were again talking him seriously as a real World/Oly medal candidate in the 05 season, all the little mistakes, physical irritations, distractions, rumors of his non-optimal training habits, etc. started creeping back little by little.

  8. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    Why "Sorry." You're essentially questioning Johnny's integrity, so what's the point of saying, "sorry," when you don't mean it.
    How do you know if Carolla means it or not?

    What you or any of us here believe have very little to do with who Johnny is .
    But apparently everything you believe or know about him is right.
    You should never write words with numbers. Unless you're seven. Or your name is Prince. - "Weird Al" Yankovic, "Word Crimes"

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by BreakfastClub View Post
    Johnny was really at his prime physically 2004-2006 and he didn't captialize, perhaps the introduction of CoP in that timeframe killed him.
    I always thought it was a lousy break for skaters working towards 2006, that CoP was implemented a year prior to the Olympics. It was the same as compulsory figures being phased out in 1991. It favored a completely different kind of skater.

    The US was one of the last countries to implement CoP scoring at the national level as well, as they were still using the 6.0 format at the 2005 Championships.
    Last edited by essence_of_soy; 11-12-2012 at 11:21 PM.

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    This is why skaters like Even and Johnny who took a couple years off and now are trying to comeback will probably fail. That much time away from competition and age is catching up with them. Add in that neither Even or Johnny could do quads even when they were younger and i don't see a lot of success for either of them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    This is why skaters like Even and Johnny who took a couple years off and now are trying to comeback will probably fail. That much time away from competition and age is catching up with them. Add in that neither Even or Johnny could do quads even when they were younger and i don't see a lot of success for either of them.
    Exactly. That's why Plushenko bombed big time in 2010.
    It's official. I am madly in love with Meryl Davis.

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    Exactly. That's why Plushenko bombed big time in 2010.
    And at 2012 Euros.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

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    Add in that neither Even or Johnny could do quads even when they were younger
    Skating moves along in advances and plateaus about one thing or another if you observe it long enough (I've been a skating fan for over 5 decades). We have just been through the addition of the quad as well as CoP recently - both advances (well, that's a matter of opinion but let's say they are). Both are firmly grounded in athleticism (no matter what the intention of CoP is) and that's a killer of a challenge for skaters even a few years older than their prime skating years.

    If the advance had been in expressiveness or musicality then the maturing skater might even have an advantage but this is sheer athleticism and that doesn't mitigate for the maturing skater. I agree that if a skater didn't have an element as demanding as a quad jump (any one of them) at his peak, achieving it with any consistency several years later in one's eligible career is very unlikely. It's not a matter of will or hard work, but may be what the body's limits are at any given point.

    And Plushy developed a quad quite a long time ago (in competitive years which is sorta like dog years); he's not trying to develop at a new level of athleticism now. He is also the exception to almost every rule!
    Last edited by Willowway; 11-13-2012 at 03:43 AM.

  14. #94
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    I think it was interesting that Weir said that his body wasn't used to falling, which, if a skater is trying to re-master a jump that wasn't consistent to begin with, would be frequently.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

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    Quote Originally Posted by overedge View Post
    How do you know if Carolla means it or not?
    How do you know what you know, overedge, or think you know?

    As far as Carolla saying "sorry," obviously she did not specifically say what she's "sorry" about. She prefaced "Sorry," and then rushed right into voicing her critical and negative views of Johnny, so I doubt she's really apologizing for her views, apologizing for stating them, or just apologizing to the air, and she's certainly not apologizing to Johnny for what she thinks about him. If she were actually "sorry," she might have thought about keeping her views to herself, or maybe phrasing them in a less negative way. But alas, that's apparently not what most of us come here to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by overedge View Post
    But apparently everything you believe or know about him is right.
    No, everything everyone believes they "know about him is apparently right." Even, if I do say so myself, 9 times out of 10, I may just be right, or wrong. At the least, I admire Johnny so I tend to look more at the positives I associate with him, not the negatives. In the long drawn out scheme of the universe, who cares really? Certainly not Mr. Johnny Weir-Voronov. He doesn't need to stoop low enough to care what fans who really don't care about him have to say, or even what fans who do care about him have to say especially in this here "train wreck."

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    Hope springs eternal... I keep hoping he will get back to what I enjoyed and away from the "act for attention."
    Well, just like your saying "sorry," your "hoping" IMO also lacks credibility. Even if you were being genuine, in heavens name, why would you "hope" or think he needs to get back to what you personally "enjoyed"??? We all have our skater preferences and likes and dislikes and desires, but the way you are personalizing it with such nose-in-the-air pretentiousness, IMO, smacks of Republican self-righteousness.

    Skaters don't need or have to "get back" to what any one of us "enjoyed." And unfortunately, neither will CoP ever "get back" to 6.0. IMO, it's difficult enough and more than enough for skaters to work hard on achieving their own goals and desires and attempting to live up to their own expectations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    He had the ability to really maximize the points system, but he never has. He has beautiful basic skating and used to do great programs that under 6.0 weren't really rewarded. So they bring out a system that's SUPPOSE to rewards spins, transitions etc.. and he suddenly seems to lose those.
    More of same. You don't sound like you really really care all that much, Carolla. Were you truly a Johnny Weir fan back in the day, or just someone waiting around to see "a train wreck" in the making?

    Quote Originally Posted by Carolla5501 View Post
    ...(Plus watching Weir lately is kind of like a train wreck "what will he do next for attention' The lady Gaga get ups etc.. )
    Trash away, my fireproof suit is on.
    Honestly, Carolla, you've got that backwards. Innit more like you're the one "trashing" the skater whose skating you characterize as "like a train wreck." Funny thing tho' unlike you I doubt Johnny would require "a fireproof suit" to shrug away and dismiss the utter disdain and random piling on toward him that apparently will continue in one way or another here ad infinitum, and at every possible opportunity. Of course, neither Johnny nor his skating, nor watching his skating has anything to do with a "train wreck" but usually all the threads about him on FSU tend to turn into one.


    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    I think it was interesting that Weir said that his body wasn't used to falling, which, if a skater is trying to re-master a jump that wasn't consistent to begin with, would be frequently.
    True, and definitely hard on an older skater's body. BTW, Johnny specifically said: "... I had a very rapid weight loss to get prepared, and my body hasn't completely learned again what it's like to fall."
    Last edited by aftershocks; 11-13-2012 at 03:21 AM.

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    Exactly. That's why Plushenko bombed big time in 2010.
    Weir is no Plushenko. Also skating regressed after 2006 and made it easier for Plush to be competitive since his strength has always been his jumps. Not only that now you need to do quads to even have a chance to win and Johnny and Evan are trying to learn quads after taking a couple years off at an advanced age for skaters.
    Last edited by Jammers; 11-13-2012 at 07:16 AM.

  17. #97

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    I think the type of competitors we have at a given time is important. For example during legendary Michelle Kwan years, to beat her, one need to do more than what she could do. Just like to beat Yuna in 2010, the competitors will need to match her in every element. In short, we look at the top few and say.... what does it take to beat them in order to overtake them. Now if Weir or Evan want to podium, they must have quads since the top few now have quads ..... Chan, Hanyu, Dai, Kozuka, Fernandez, Machida .. and they are really the ones you must beat.

    I am sure we will know in due course whether Weir will return to competition. He doesn't have much time left to start competing after a couple of years off training. Yuna is returning this year, and so must all those who want to return and compete in Sochi. Good luck to Weir and all these skaters. Though I am very curious as to which come back skater will prevail to Sochi. It is not an easy route..... IMO.
    Prosperity makes friends, adversity tries them. – Publilius Syrus

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    We all have our skater preferences and likes and dislikes and desires, but the way you are personalizing it with such nose-in-the-air pretentiousness, IMO, smacks of Republican self-righteousness.


    DEMOCRATS FOR JOHNNY WEIR!!!

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    I am not sure if Johnny really is injured or if he just panicked and started to feel so unsure of himself that he had to withdraw. I read that during the practices he just stood in front of his coach for 10 minutes repeating that "He can't". I think he is very sensitive and coming back to competing again is very hard for him. He needs to find a positive attitude towards competing otherwise his come back is not going to last very long.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterG View Post
    You know, I'm beginning to think that people who seek the spotlight do so to get attention. I think this would make a great thesis, because I don't believe any human has ever made this point before.


    I can completely believe that poor Johnny is indeed injured. He's had MANY injuries over the years, and a dicey ACL is NOT something you want to mess with, because it can be career-ending if you rupture that. Better to be cautious about it.
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