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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    And it wasn't until Johnny Weir came along circa 2004 - 2006 that those qualities began to be more appreciated, sought after, and rewarded in skaters like Buttle and Lambiel. Even Joubert had to struggle with the new way men were being looked at. IOW, Joubert too had to begin working harder on improving his landing carriage, choreo, stretch, spin positions, and transitions (and obviously all of these factors also became more important under the new judging system).
    Why do you keep saying that it was Weir that made judges notice and start rewarding artistry? Buttle started getting recognition around the same time as Weir, but his programs were far more inventive and sophisticated..

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Why do you keep saying that it was Weir that made judges notice and start rewarding artistry? Buttle's programs were far more inventive and original.
    I know, you'd think Weir skated in an entirely different era from Lambiel and Buttle, who are far more original, inventive, and more successful than Weir.

  3. #83

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    Can't believe it! Getting

  4. #84
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    See what you've done Kurt!

  5. #85
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    ^^ Agree to disagree with you shine and museksk8r. I understand people are loath to consider that Johnny has had any positive impact whatsoever on the sport of figure skating.

    In any case, I did not say that it was Weir who "made judges notice and start rewarding artistry." Those are your words, shine. After all, artistry in figure skating existed long before Johnny was born.

    I said that when Johnny came along with his grace, smoothness, effortless jumps, upright posture on jump landings combined with exquisite ride-out, everyone took notice, including the judges. Plus, it just happens to be my opinion that the creative style and grace of skaters like Buttle and Lambiel also began to be more appreciated circa 2004 to present. Yes, Buttle had/ has great inventive programs, thanks to his collaboration with David Wilson and his own originality. Lambiel is a wonderful free spirit, and very voidy and inventive too. Both of them have contributed much to the sport and have obviously had greater success with the judges than Johnny ever had and likely ever will have.

    Frankly, I would love to interview both Buttle and Lambiel and ask them to answer truthfully whether they were ever inspired by watching Johnny Weir skate. And it certainly doesn't mean that if they were ever inspired by Johnny that they lack creative inspiration, inventiveness and originality themselves.

    Bejesus, I do declare: Within the sport of figure skating, it must be a sin to even think of complimenting Johnny Weir! That devilish, rebellious diva, albeit he's considered somewhat reformed and more accepted these days due to his success beyond the skating world.

    Best wishes to ya Johnny artiste. ...


    And, definitely we too can agree to disagree yaya and lala.


    Yeah, Nan, I know, on second thought, NO!

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by lala View Post
    The truth... only the truth
    Unfortunatly most of my posts here were and will be my opinions. But I will try, I am gonna claim that's the truth, the truth, the truth, the truth.....And hopefully after I repeat it thousands of times, it will finally become the truth.
    And I like this idea too, claim to respect someone first, then it will be safe to downgrade him/her. Or downgrade someone first, then claim to be his or her fan, it will make the opinion looks more like the truth, right?

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Why do you keep saying that it was Weir that made judges notice and start rewarding artistry? Buttle started getting recognition around the same time as Weir, but his programs were far more inventive and sophisticated..
    Oh, I agree with you, shine. If you take for instance Jeffrey's SP and Johnny's SP from the 2006 Olympics, the variety/diversity in Jeffrey's steps, turns and leans with multiple changes of direction is plain awesome. I'd dare to say Jeffrey was doing far more with his blade in his program than Johnny was and his solo jumps come out of nowhere. To me, Jeffrey's SP is way more exciting to watch even with the fall on the 3A than Johnny's clean but pretty simple program for the CoP standards.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxtp5ttzEiQ

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bf5t-4HFPOo

    Johnny had/has beautiful edge quality and beautiful flow in his skating, I don't understand why he never really pushed himself in approaching more complex choreographies. Mind you, I am not a Jeffrey Buttle uber, nor am I a Johnny Weir hater.

    But since this is a Browning thread, here is one of my favorites from Kurt.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPD2I...feature=g-hist

    I suspect this kind of program that I would call a throw-back to the days of figures will never be as popular among fs viewers as those who bring the drama to the ice but I think it's quite enjoyable to see a skater doing totally amazing edgework for a change.

  8. #88
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    ^^ Nice assessment, VarBar. No argument that Johnny has not always had similar "awesome" choreo to Buttle's, but I tend to prefer the simplicity and grace of Johnny's Swan to Buttle's Sing, Sing, Sing program. Yes indeed tho,' fabulous blade work by Buttle.

    IMO, Johnny's sp at 2008 Worlds was fantastic and not a whit less better than Buttle's sp performance. The judges picked Buttle over Weir in that instance, and of course their choice and faith in Buttle was proved correct by Buttle outperforming everyone in his fp at 2008 Worlds.

    So much variety among skaters and differences of opinion among fans re figure skating. As it is and ever shall be.

  9. #89
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    I've gotta ask, aftershocks, you've complained about how Chan ubers talk about their idol to the point where you say they've actually turned you off Chan's skating. I'm wondering what you perceive the difference is between how they talk about Chan and how you talk about Weir?

  10. #90
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    I know I'm days late to the game, but I just have to say, the way fans (over) react to things astonishes me again and again. Kurt chooses to single out Jeff Buttle (who by all accounts, *was* amazing at Japan Open - I know he was at Medal Winners Open) and Evgeni Plushenko to praise them in a Twitter post (that is limited to 140 characters), and instead of taking it as the compliment it is that he was blown away enough by Plushenko's jumping to comment about it, people take it as an insult that he only mentioned the jumping. Wtf?

    BTW I know for a fact that Kurt thought that aside from Patrick, all the other guys in the Japan Open were "out of their minds good". But if you follow him on Twitter, you soon realize that he rarely tweets and only tweets about a subset of what you'd think he'd tweet about (failing to mention events he does, etc). When he writes things like this article, or does extensive interviews, you know he has a lot of deep thoughts and opinions about everything, but on Twitter, he barely skims the surface. Of course, people searching for "@EvgeniPlushenko" on Twitter have no idea of context and leap to their own conclusions based on their own preconceptions. Poor Kurt indeed.

  11. #91

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    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    I've gotta ask, aftershocks, you've complained about how Chan ubers talk about their idol to the point where you say they've actually turned you off Chan's skating. I'm wondering what you perceive the difference is between how they talk about Chan and how you talk about Weir?

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    I've gotta ask, aftershocks, you've complained about how Chan ubers talk about their idol to the point where you say they've actually turned you off Chan's skating. I'm wondering what you perceive the difference is between how they talk about Chan and how you talk about Weir?
    First let me paraphrase a recent Johnny quote: God forbid that you think I am like most Chan fans. “I have a different soul, and a different energy.” Sure there are plenty of open-minded, fair and balanced Chan fans out there, like yourself, Proustable. But there are some too whom I find very scary.

    Johnny Weir is NOT my idol. I do love him for the person he is and the skater he is, but I don't follow his every move or worry about his every performance. I simply enjoy his skating, and I think he's a cool, witty, articulate guy. Chan is a fine person and a talented skater, but I'm not as enamored with his skating. Also, Chan has the benefit of a federation solidly behind him every step of the way through his career. Worlds of difference between Chan and Weir. Worlds of difference between how they have been viewed and scored by ISU judges. Worlds of difference between their fans too, IMHO.

    Most critics of Chan’s bend over backwards trying not to offend because so many of Chan's fans are so aggressive. Many of Chan's fans gang up on the slightest thing someone has to say about him, even when it is mild criticism. I am one of maybe a few Johnny fans who are even that vocal here. Honestly, most of the criticism of Chan that I've seen here has not been directed at him personally, but at the way he has been scored. Fortunately, a lot of the personally-biased "nastiness" toward Johnny on FSU has lessened as he has achieved success off the ice.

    One of Chan's fans in the current GSD thread was so OTT worrying about Chan's relationship possibly affecting his skating, among other things, that it actually made me feel sorry for Chan. It is true that I have made fun of the OTT hype of Chan by some Canadian journalists. But, far from "complaining about how Chan ubers talk about their idol," I'm more aghast at the unreasonable pressure and suffocating adulation they seem to be placing on him.

    Also, I've never read or heard any of Johnny's fans calling mild critics of his "dogs" and "twats." That did occur here in one of the infamous Chan threads. BTW, I did not happen to be one of the critics subjected to the name-calling, at least on that occasion. The other thing about many Chan fans is they seem so unhappy if not everyone loves Chan. I don't care who loves Johnny or who hates him either. I only care about how he makes me feel.

    However, if there is something I read here that I wish to comment on, whether it be about Johnny or about any skater, or any topic, I will say what I have to say. I plead guilty to being opinionated.

    And now, back to Kurt and Plush, perhaps?

  13. #93

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    Quote Originally Posted by Proustable View Post
    I've gotta ask, aftershocks, you've complained about how Chan ubers talk about their idol to the point where you say they've actually turned you off Chan's skating. I'm wondering what you perceive the difference is between how they talk about Chan and how you talk about Weir?

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    Okay, lala, re your #73 post:

    OH BOY, I know Kurt Browning is not coming back to compete eligibly, but at this point in this thread, we need some Kurt quotes and Kurt vids going, don'tcha think? Besides, we must give Kurt some credit that his wife is a ballet dancer.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyUCqUbkvpA Feelin' Good

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMMEa...eature=related I'm Yours

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZI_NV...eature=related (with quotes by S/P no less!)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da8HE...eature=related -- He's so clever, so cool, so funny!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWOQ6...eature=related
    Lightning Crashes, indeed!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTstf...eature=related (with his wife, Sonia)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pL537...feature=relmfu Kurt with his family at the dinner table

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAngx...eature=related Kurt's Serenade to Sonia -- with Nat King Cole


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RtL6...eature=related Brick House, nuff said

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0Izl...eature=related Now that's flamenco on ice!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8F5l4_R_38 (Kurt with hair!) Singin' in the Rain -- Gene Kelly on Ice

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXhe8...feature=relmfu Kurt rockin' his facial expressions w/ first performance of Brick House

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yq8xt...eature=related Kurt Steppin' Out

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgYHsPAEZ2A Summertime, choreographed by Zhulin

    Kurt is one of the best figure skaters to never win an Olympic medal. Like at Academy Awards, there should be an honorary award/ gold medal given to skaters like Kurt for their extraordinary accomplishments and contributions to the sport. Thank you, Kurt!
    Thx for the links, I watched them all, but i have already seen them, of course.. I really liked, especially the "I'm yours". His exhibition numbers and his programs of professional championships are so awesome, and interesting. He is a real dancer.

    I was wrong, Smekalov is a dancer in Kirov Ballet, not in Bolshoi, of course. If you like ballet-Smekalov http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYtbv...ure=plpp_video


    Plushy and his current wife on ice, she is not a skater, not dancer:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPGQDvuB4MM like the Dancing with the star in US.

    I love this Flamenco( flamingo... so cute typo yaya!!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGanRnHVNIs

    Ps.: I like Johnny, and Lambiel, too. I don't argue.
    Last edited by lala; 10-16-2012 at 12:42 PM.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by alilou View Post
    That was an unfortunate decision
    Why? cute montages..
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Dg8CC8fP-c
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMmqFr32hGI

  16. #96
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    Pj Kwong ‏@skatingpj

    @ARBreedon Plushenko-called him a modern gladiator in my blog and @KurtBrowning says he still has HUGE jumps -why do u think him?#cbcskate

    Ashley Breedon ‏@ARBreedon

    @skatingpj @kurtbrowning Plushenko's a total package for the new scoring system-sheer strength&ability, & the guts to get it done #cbcskate

  17. #97
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    My travel and adventure blog http://alisonanddon.wordpress.com

  18. #98
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    Yes very cute but I notice these vids don't include him sticking his tongue out and wiping his fingers down it. Ewwwww.
    My travel and adventure blog http://alisonanddon.wordpress.com

  19. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by alilou View Post
    Yes very cute but I notice these vids don't include him sticking his tongue out and wiping his fingers down it. Ewwwww.
    show me please, i don't remember....wait!!!wait! Do you mean this?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zO1DO...=results_video


    from 2.03 ? I love that and the crowd also adored the whole stuff
    Last edited by lala; 10-20-2012 at 01:42 PM.

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