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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Wang/Wang - I haven't been this excited about a Pair team for a very long time.
    Ziggy excited about Wangs. Imagine that.

  2. #302

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    Not sure if it is because of the change of coaches, but Sui's basics are so much better this year. I remember watching them 2 years ago and although they had VERY impressive elements, the state of their basic skating and transitions were quite painful. For example, I don't remember seeing another senior pair who would scratch so much on back crossovers. Watching her now at Cup of China, their basics look so much better...I wonder if the year when she was injured, maybe they couldn't do anything difficult (jumps, lifts etc) but maybe she could do basic skating and worked on that a lot. Or it might be that their new coach spent a lot of time fixing that.
    And they are in sync in their crossovers! I was during the parts of the program where they weren't doing elements. Now if Sui doesn't outgrow Han.

  3. #303
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    I read an interview quoting Hongbo saying that the five young teams spend the morning doing skating skill lessons. They also have core strength training and dance training. That might explain the changes we see here. Even for Hao Zhang, Hongbo has been trying to loosen his upper body stiffness through modern dance training. It also helps that Xue Shen was there helping the girls with throw landings and refine body movement. In addition, they have a ice dance coach and Nan Song's coach to help the girls' jumps. So it seems they are really serious about getting the new batch out there with good skills and polish. Way to go!

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    Actually, based on the results of Cup of China, I don't really worry about the results of Chinese pairs at the Olympics or generally about the future of Chinese pairs. Both Sui-Han in Skate Canada and Peng-Zhang in Cup of China looked pretty decent. I am impressed how quickly Peng caught up- she definitely did not look out of place at this senior international competition. And despite their injury Pang-Tong managed to beat Savchenko-Szolowy in the SP and placed pretty decent 2nd place overall. There was quite reasonable pair Wang-Wang; their time will come in the next four years after Pang-Tong retires.
    Major kudos to P&T for skating so well depsite being so severely injured. They have great programs this season, and the injury really allowed them to work more on expressions, unison and finetuning all those little details.

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfanfun View Post
    I read an interview quoting Hongbo saying that the five young teams spend the morning doing skating skill lessons. They also have core strength training and dance training. That might explain the changes we see here. Even for Hao Zhang, Hongbo has been trying to loosen his upper body stiffness through modern dance training. It also helps that Xue Shen was there helping the girls with throw landings and refine body movement. In addition, they have a ice dance coach and Nan Song's coach to help the girls' jumps. So it seems they are really serious about getting the new batch out there with good skills and polish. Way to go!
    That's excellent. It's time to have a structured approach when it comes to training top national competitors. You don't come across a pair like Shen & Zhao or Pang & Tang every day.

    I would also like the Chinese Fed to hire someone from overseas to work on the crossovers of all top Chinese skaters (maybe sans Yan Han). The abundance of sloppy forward crossovers with bad posture hurt my soul. All the single skaters (again, maybe sans Yan Han) also need dance and music lessons and be whipped everytime they skate through music.

  6. #306
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    Thank you for the info, skatingfanfun!

    Hao Zhang might need to do some work, but I can see him thriving with modern dance lessons. At early as 2006 Skate Canada in Victoria, where Gary Beacom did group choreography for the gala, you could see that he could really boogie when given a chance to let loose, and he looked like he was having a great time. I've always wished he could do a competitive program that would showcase this.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    All the single skaters (again, maybe sans Yan Han) also need dance and music lessons and be whipped everytime they skate through music.

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfanfun View Post
    I read an interview quoting Hongbo saying that the five young teams spend the morning doing skating skill lessons. They also have core strength training and dance training. That might explain the changes we see here. Even for Hao Zhang, Hongbo has been trying to loosen his upper body stiffness through modern dance training. It also helps that Xue Shen was there helping the girls with throw landings and refine body movement. In addition, they have a ice dance coach and Nan Song's coach to help the girls' jumps. So it seems they are really serious about getting the new batch out there with good skills and polish. Way to go!
    Thank you for this information. They are finally getting it right! I remember a Chinese poster saying that they watched Luan Bo's practice and all her teams were doing was jumps. Sui/Han always had incredible potential and a lot of personality but they were so unpolished. Fortunately Zhao and Shen are using all of their experience and working on the whole package and not just the big tricks. The Ice Dance coach that is part of the team is Han Bing, I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I would also like the Chinese Fed to hire someone from overseas to work on the crossovers of all top Chinese skaters (maybe sans Yan Han). The abundance of sloppy forward crossovers with bad posture hurt my soul. All the single skaters (again, maybe sans Yan Han) also need dance and music lessons and be whipped everytime they skate through music.
    Yes, this approach is needed all across and not just in Pairs. I guess Pair skating is getting the most resources though given it's their best discipline.

  9. #309

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    All the single skaters (again, maybe sans Yan Han) also need dance and music lessons and be whipped everytime they skate through music.
    Please don't give them such ideas. I am sure the training in china is sadistic enough even without your suggestions.

  10. #310
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    You're welcome kwuanfan and Ziggy! I was so excited about the young Chinese pairs' performances that I went to Chinese website to dig out information about their training and preparations.

    The new coaching structure sure shows positive results! I'm impressed by Sui/Han and P/Z, but most excited about the Wangs! The basic skating is quite decent besides their outstanding performance skills. They are by far the the most natural performers among Chinese teams, including the past top three. Looking forward to their development, they could do fairly well in the World next year if they got to go, but I don't think so. Hopefully P/Z and Sui/Han can earn 3 spots but still the Wangs might not be going as there is another pair that is quite good in Junior level that should be old enough to move to senior. What a change. I thought Chinese pair skating was done after the big three, now there are just not enough spot to show all the decent teams, something to worry about but better than there is not enough to send.

  11. #311
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    I wonder what is happening with Yu/Jin who also trained with Bo Luan.

  12. #312
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    Please don't give them such ideas. I am sure the training in china is sadistic enough even without your suggestions.
    I was totally kidding. But it does bug me a lot to see Zhang Kexin land her jumps, do her spins but ignore everything else. She is the Chinese Leonova.

  13. #313
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    I have never seen a skater as thoroughly disinterested in their own performance as Zhang Kexin.

  14. #314
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I have never seen a skater as thoroughly disinterested in their own performance as Zhang Kexin.
    Last season I thought she lost her spirit because the federation was politiking hard for Li Zijun and ignoring her. But I thought they worked it out and she resumed training and went to Worlds.

    The fact that she is still skating like that this season means one or more of the following:

    1. she really is disinterested
    2. she is a huge introvert
    3. she doesn't get music or expression
    4. she is all focused on her jumps because she has significantly upgraded her content

    I think its a combination of all of the above, with an emphasis on 4. I don't expect her to turn into a Proklova over night, but at least smile or flick an arm once a while?

  15. #315
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    It was a pain to watch Kexin. She used to be a bit better, at least not skating with two fists. I wanted to scream when she didn`t make an effort to make any of her choreographed move meaningful, what a waste. I believe she got her programs from Lori too. Come on girl, give it a try.

  16. #316
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I have never seen a skater as thoroughly disinterested in their own performance as Zhang Kexin.
    I think Boyang Jin is worse...

  17. #317

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    I wonder what is happening with Yu/Jin who also trained with Bo Luan.
    in the junior grand prix luan was with them; so we'll see. for sure she really wants to hang on to this couple, if she even has lost the other

  18. #318

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Last season I thought she lost her spirit because the federation was politiking hard for Li Zijun and ignoring her. But I thought they worked it out and she resumed training and went to Worlds.

    The fact that she is still skating like that this season means one or more of the following:

    1. she really is disinterested
    2. she is a huge introvert
    3. she doesn't get music or expression
    4. she is all focused on her jumps because she has significantly upgraded her content

    I think its a combination of all of the above, with an emphasis on 4. I don't expect her to turn into a Proklova over night, but at least smile or flick an arm once a while?
    I think it's no.4 and no.2! I hope she'll get better as her skating improved.

    Quote Originally Posted by Macassar88
    I think Boyang Jin is worse...
    Boyang is very young. I think the training in China puts emphasis on technical skills first before emphazising 'artistic' skills.
    Prosperity makes friends, adversity tries them. – Publilius Syrus

  19. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfanfun View Post
    It was a pain to watch Kexin. She used to be a bit better, at least not skating with two fists. I wanted to scream when she didn`t make an effort to make any of her choreographed move meaningful, what a waste. I believe she got her programs from Lori too. Come on girl, give it a try.
    Kexin has a neurological issue that causes her hands and fingers to tremble so that she has no control over them. The doctors can't figure out what's wrong. So for now she has to skate with fists. Obviously it affects her presentation overall as well.

  20. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeschke View Post
    in the junior grand prix luan was with them; so we'll see. for sure she really wants to hang on to this couple, if she even has lost the other
    Really? Which video? I think they've moved over to zhao hongbo's group in Beijing. Hence the major improvement in skating skills and presentation.

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