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  1. #561
    Brezina's Nemesis
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    Dunno. His movements are so small, the skating is rushed and he reminds me of Stojko not in a good way.
    A smallest flop and he's going to be dropped, esp. given the incredible level of men lately.
    I respect the "fair principles" of US fed, but this is the second time in 3 years that I find it rather stupid.
    In Soviet Russia, the skaters lobbychick YOU.

  2. #562

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    Quote Originally Posted by dots View Post
    After breaking your back there is not much upper flexibility.
    Good point.

    However, I am still in favour of FREE MAX AARON!

  3. #563

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Just off the top of my head: He's slouched, he has shallow edges and needs to scrape a lot of small cross-overs in order to generate speed (it looks like he's running on a treadmill). His movements are off-time most of the time.
    Ah so I'm not the only one who doesn't get his placement then. I think I figured it out! The US is making sure someone else will win the olys So they must select their worst skater
    poths Void: MarieM carries a rusty old blade in her handbag!

  4. #564
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    Maybe some people haven't noticed yet that the era of the quads is back? And that Max Aaron just landed a quad/triple in his short program and two more quads in his free skate? I know, I know, there's more to figure skating than just jumps and Aaron may not be an artistic skater but the US male skating wasn't getting anywhere with artistic Abbott and artistic Rippon anyway, sorry to say this.

    For what it's worth, I was rooting for Ross Miner to win Nationals last week.

  5. #565

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    Quote Originally Posted by dots View Post
    After breaking your back there is not much upper flexibility.

    Sorry but that is/will be part of his skating. However, I do think we can get him to feel the music a bit better much much BETTER!!


    Glad he won nationals*
    Jeremy Abbott has broken his back, too. Ain't no excuse to slouch.
    BARK LESS. WAG MORE.

  6. #566
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    For those who dont think Max should go to worlds, who else do you think could be sent in his place? It was not exactly a lights out nationals, and the US men didnt do so well at the gp either

  7. #567

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrey aka Pushkin View Post
    There MUST be something between the American "ah, we are so strict" and the Russian "we do what we want" approaches
    The Italian approach "ah, we are so strict...oh wait, we actually do want we want!"
    A grumpy Canadian will always be nicer than a polite Milanese

  8. #568
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    I am enjoying the conversation above re Max Aaron.

    Both sides make good points -

    Max can jump, but his other elements and PCS leave something to be desired. Therefore, he risks getting hammered with low scores at Worlds a la Bradley.

    OTOH, 'artistic' skaters with potential to score big have not been getting the job done either.

    I feel that it is what it is. The US would've probably had the same shot of getting 3 spots back w/ Aaron (low PCS) or Abbott (headcase who can't hold it together). The US judges are rewarding a newbie like Aaron for clean, technically dynamic skates and passing over the seriously gifted Abbott who didn't melt down, but they are probably finally moving on, feeling that they've given Abbott enough opportunities already.

    To be fair to Max, I find him more 'watchable' than even a year ago. It may be Camerlango's choreography. Still, he really needs to learn to stretch out the spins and extend his body on non-jump moves and choreography.

  9. #569

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    I have no doubt that a multiple-quad Aaron will end up doing well at worlds. In the past, plenty of somewhat-unknown men with questionable artistry but solid jumps have done better than expected at worlds. (Agreed that Bradley was a bust... but Aaron is not Bradley. Remember that Bradley didn't land clean quads in his FS at US nats.)

  10. #570

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    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    Max can jump, but his other elements and PCS leave something to be desired. Therefore, he risks getting hammered with low scores at Worlds a la Bradley.
    I beg to differ. Bradley skates so slowly. He's like the male version of JSlow. Max is better IMHO.

    Quote Originally Posted by olympic View Post
    OTOH, 'artistic' skaters with potential to score big have not been getting the job done either.
    I disagree again. Alexander Johnson is probably one of the most artistic male skaters in the U.S. right now. He got the job done. Two 3-Axel and 3Lz+1Lo+3F. Only one -1 GOE (not even warranted) in the FS. His Spiral is GORGEOUS! He should be getting 9s in the PE, CH, IN marks. I cannot think of any male skaters in the past 4 years that are as artistic and technically sound as Alexander. He pays so much attention in details while skating in lightning speed, it's astonishing. For crying out loud, he actually extends and points his toe doing back XO. Did I mention he points his fingers like a ballet dancer? His basic skating skill reminds me of Katia Gordeeva and Ilia Kulik. Too bad he was judged so harshly in the SP. I'm going to start a campaign to promote Alexander Johnson! He is such a joy to watch. He is one of the reasons why I watch figure skating.

    If you haven't seen Alexander's FS, here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-1AI1fXdiE

  11. #571
    I <3 Kozuka
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    Quote Originally Posted by dots View Post
    After breaking your back there is not much upper flexibility.
    Urmanov didn't have a lot of flexibility in his upper body, but he had gorgeous posture.
    "The team doesn't get automatic capacity because management is mad" -- Greg Smith, agile guy

  12. #572
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    Max Aaron's basics are fine. His artistry needs work, I'll give you that, but he in no way has bad basics nor is his skating inferior in any aspects..
    His basic skating is clearly inferior to that of Miner, Abbott, and Farris, not to mention several who finished off the podium (Johnson and Brown, for example). His choreography and transitions, such as they were, started about 48 seconds into the Free Skate when he went from his quadruple salchow into his first spin. The marks for each of his Program Components went up by more than a point between his (clean) Short Program and his (clean) Free Skate for no apparent reason other than factors that are not supposed to be considered in the marks.

    If the judges had given Aaron PCS in the Free Skate commensurate with what they gave him in the Short Program, he would not have won and might not even have made the Worlds team.

  13. #573

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    A word for Max - he is FAST! He skates like he's been shot out of a cannon. And speed is probably the biggest factor in components. I agree, the second mark is his weakness, but let's see how he does.

    And I totally agree with luenatic about Alex Johnson. He had the best program of the men, and his jumps are gorgeous, too. It's a tragedy that he didn't get any international assignments, doesn't have a SB or technical minimum and can't even be a 4CC alternate.

  14. #574

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    The good news for Alex Johnson is that his 7th place finish in Senior qualifies him for Team C envelope funding next season and should give him a Senior B international at least (his most recent and only senior international to date was 2009 Finlandia Trophy where he placed 10th). Johnson's bio on IN: http://web.icenetwork.com/skaters/de...=100072&mode=I

    ETA: I hope Johnson wins the PSA Edi Award for the best men's performance (FS) at Nationals.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  15. #575

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    I hope Johnson wins the PSA Edi Award for the best men's performance (FS) at Nationals.
    ITA.

  16. #576

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    Thanks Sylvia! After reading his bio, now it makes sense to me why I thought of ballet when I saw him skate: "Favorite performer: Mikhail Baryshnikov"

  17. #577
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlai View Post
    For those who dont think Max should go to worlds, who else do you think could be sent in his place?
    Miner & Farris

    Quote Originally Posted by kwanfan1818 View Post
    Urmanov didn't have a lot of flexibility in his upper body, but he had gorgeous posture.

  18. #578

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    If the judges had given Aaron PCS in the Free Skate commensurate with what they gave him in the Short Program, he would not have won and might not even have made the Worlds team.
    I went to the numbers to try to prove you wrong, but I couldn't.

    Aaron's components for the short averaged 6.728 (factored comp score 33.64), while for the LP, they averaged 7.948 (factored comp score 79.48). So if he had been scored the same for the LP as he was for the SP, his score would be 12 points lower.

    However, those around him had an improvement from the SP to the LP in their PCS as well. The judges were PCS-happy that night. Miner's went up by about 6 points, Abbott by about 6, Farris by about 7. So, stripping away the across-the-board inflation, Aaron gained about 6 points. The numbers show that you are correct; he would not have won without that extra boost.

    That being said, I was at the rink, and Aaron's free skate was electric in person.

  19. #579
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    Are the judges for the short program the same people as the long program?


    If it is all a conspiracy, I'm just baffled why judges would give Aaron a PCS boost to win- even he said coming into the competition he had no goal of even medaling. Why would they annoint him the chosen one if his skating didn't warrant the scores he got (and I personally think they did, at least within the 'nationals scores are always higher' range- PCS is not the artistic mark. His basics are not as good as Abbott's but I think he met the criteria he was scored on.)

  20. #580
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    My husband , who knows very little about figure skating, watched the men's long with me. He loved Max!! He said that it was about time that we have a men's champion who actually skates like a man. My 27 yr. old son agrees!

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