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  1. #801
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    Besides with the US Men not strong doing the quad he can still be competitive. Aaron is the only one who is consistent with quads. Minor is of and on and so is Dornbush. Abbott might as well forget doing them and Rippon i don't think tried one all season. A quad does put Josh and Jason right in the thick of things.

  2. #802
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    They also medalled at this event last year and skated well enough to be guaranteed at least one spot for this season's GPs. Didn't stop the USFS from keeping them junior.
    I think the USFS was trying to help Dornbush and Rippon get 2 GPs each though this season and maybe encouraged them to stay junior though. After what went down this season, I don't see them holding Farris and Brown back in favor of Rippon and Abbott and the likes of those guys. These two are realistic contenders for the Olympic team and with Farris being 4th at Nationals I think the USFS has now "invested" in him, and they've loved Jason for years now so now that he put up this great score there is no reason for him to be staying in juniors.

    Also Josh seems close on his 4t. It's always round it just seems like he's prone to overcooking it and crashing into the boards. However, given that he's pretty reliable to skate a good program otherwise and hit both axels (which are quite gorgeous, btw) I think he's really in the shake up. Max's quad is consistent. Miner and Dornbush have a success rate a little better than Josh but are by no means masters of it in competition, plus Farris is more consistent with his 3a than both those guys (Dornbush especially, at least the past couple seasons) and his 3a is also of better quality. Rippon and Abbott can't even be counted on to rotate their quad attempts at this point and Rippon wasn't even attempting them in competition this season at all. Mahbanoozadeh, Razzano, and Messing are all capable of the quad but sort of took themselves off the radar screen with Nationals and other subpar results this season - I doubt we'll be seeing them on the GP. Johnson is fab artistically but he just got his 3a secure and hasn't shown signs of a quad yet. So really, Farris is in the shakeup for the team I would say, and if he can start landing that quad in competition more, I think he's a strong contender. Does he train the 4s as well? I was noticing he has a very nice salchow jump and wondered if he had tried training the quad on that jump too. As for Brown he'd probably need to be at least trying for the quad to be the shakeup, but he might not need to be consistently landing it to make the team.

  3. #803

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    Most of the men of fairly recent vintage who've won the Olympics skated in their previous Olympics (frequently coming in around 4th or 5th).

    If Farris and Brown are serious about the 2018 Olympics, it would help them to skate in the 2014 Olympics first.

  4. #804
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    Quote Originally Posted by missing View Post
    Most of the men of fairly recent vintage who've won the Olympics skated in their previous Olympics (frequently coming in around 4th or 5th).

    If Farris and Brown are serious about the 2018 Olympics, it would help them to skate in the 2014 Olympics first.
    I agree but it's also worth noting they would both be only recently 27 for 2022 so that isn't out of the realms of possibility either.

  5. #805
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    Quote Originally Posted by missing View Post
    Most of the men of fairly recent vintage who've won the Olympics skated in their previous Olympics (frequently coming in around 4th or 5th).
    this surprised me, so I looked up results - and it's true - from 88 on, the OGM's finishes in the previous Olympics were:
    4th: Lysacek 2006
    5th: Yagudin 1998; Urmanov 1992; Boitano 1984
    Other: Plushenko 2002 - silver; Petrenko 1988 bronze
    Did not compete: Kulik 1994 - won junior worlds that year.

    On that basis, it would be promising for Patrick Chan (5th in 2010; 4th was Lambiel)

  6. #806

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    The importance of the quad nowadays (and the effects of training a quad and/or multiple quads) may limit the length of the top men's careers... only time will tell.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    It also looks like both guys should be in the top 24 of the ISU World Standings rankings heading into next season - my calculations have the WS order, with 2010-11 points dropped and 2011-12 points reduced to 70%, as: Miner, Abbott, Dornbush, Farris, Brown (good chance to be in top 24), Rippon (will drop out of top 24 for sure), Aaron.

    ETA Season Best total scores (200+) order for the U.S. men heading into Worlds is:
    Miner 235.37, Aaron 234.65, Dornbush 234.04, Farris 228.32, Abbott 227.63, Brown 224.15 - around cut-off for top 24? - Chen 222.00 (returning to JGP), Rippon 210.47, Omori 204.34 (likely returning to JGP), Mahbanoozadeh 203.65.
    ISU's SB total scores listed updated after Junior Worlds:
    Miner #11, Aaron 13, Dornbush 14, Farris 18, Abbott 19, Brown 21, Chen 23, Rippon 26, Omori 28, Mahbanoozadeh 30.
    Last edited by Sylvia; 03-03-2013 at 05:49 AM.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  7. #807

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    Since this thread is titled "U.S. MEN 2012-2013", I thought I would re-post here what I posted to an interesting thread in the Trash Can section of the forum:


    Btw, more interesting facts (about the American men only), leastways to me:


    Mark Cockerell ~ 1976 jr. world gold medalist; never medalled at the Olympics (13th in 1984)

    Christopher Bowman ~ 1983 jr. world gold medalist; ditto (7th in 1988 & 4th in 1992)

    Rudy Galindo ~ 1987 jr. world gold medalist, 1986 jr. world silver medalist, 1985 jr. world bronze medalist ; never got the chance to skate at the Olympics, yet he did capture bronze at Big Worlds in 1996.

    Todd Eldredge ~ 1988 jr. world gold medalist, 1987 jr. world silver medalist; never medalled at the Olympics (10th in 1992, 4th in 1998, 6th in 2002).

    Michael Weiss ~ 1994 jr. world gold medalist, 1993 jr. world silver medalist; ditto (7th in both 1998 & 2002).

    Johnny Weir ~ 2001 jr. world gold medalist; ditto (5th in 2006 & 6th in 2010)

    Matthew Savoie ~ 2000 jr. world bronze medalist; ditto (7th in in 2006)




    And the following American men never made it to the Olympics, despite medalling at jr. worlds:


    Scott Williams (1982 jr. world gold medalist & 1981 jr. world bronze medalist)

    Erik Larson (1985 jr. world gold medalist)

    Shepherd Clark (1989 jr. world silver medalist)

    Damon Allen (1992 jr. world bronze medalist)

    Jere Michael (1994 jr. world bronze medalist)

    Derrick Delmore (1998 jr. world gold medalist)

    Jordan Brauninger (2004 jr. world bronze medalist)

    Stephen Carriere (2007 jr. world gold medalist)

    Adam Rippon (2008 & 2009 jr. world gold medalist both times)


    ONLY 3 American men have medalled at both Jr. Worlds and the Olympics:


    Paul Wylie ~ 1981 jr. world gold medalist & 1992 Olympic silver medalist

    Timothy Goebel ~ 1997 jr. world silver medalist & 2002 Olympic silver medalist

    Evan Lysacek ~ 2001, 2003, 2004 jr. world silver medalist three times & 2010 Olympic gold medalist

  8. #808

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    ^^ The correlation stats above is depressing. Room on top is very limited. Looks like the Russian men have a better track record? Did Brian B and Scott H participate in any Worlds Junior?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia
    The importance of the quad nowadays (and the effects of training a quad and/or multiple quads) may limit the length of the top men's careers... only time will tell.
    Unless they are prepared to take over the crown of Bionic Skater from Plushenko.
    Last edited by spikydurian; 03-03-2013 at 12:02 PM.
    Prosperity makes friends, adversity tries them. – Publilius Syrus

  9. #809

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    Quote Originally Posted by spikydurian View Post
    Did Brian B and Scott H participate in any Worlds Junior?
    Boitano was bronze medalist at 1978 Jr. Worlds. NadineWhite did mention that in another post in the Trash Can thread.

    Hamilton was already senior by the time Junior Worlds began in the late 70s.

  10. #810

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    Quote Originally Posted by NadineWhite View Post
    Since this thread is titled "U.S. MEN 2012-2013", I thought I would re-post here what I posted to an interesting thread in the Trash Can section of the forum:
    Actually this is a 2012-13 news thread for the U.S. men - the Trash Can is the main place for historical skating results & discussions.

    ETA:
    This Associated Press article on the U.S. men's medal sweep in Milan references two past instances of comparable success at Junior Worlds: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/0...-1st-time.html
    The U.S. men's previous best showing had come back in 1987, when Rudy Galindo won the title, Todd Eldredge was second and Cameron Birky was fourth. Johnny Weir and Evan Lysacek were 1-2 in 2001, but the Americans didn't have a third man that year.
    IFS' Facebook photo of Farris, Brown, and Omori posing with their medals and a big American flag: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater

    Another photo of the sweep : http://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/s...577856/photo/1

    Exhibition performances earlier today in Milan: Shotaro Omori ("Ave Maria"), Jason Brown ("Can't touch this" by MC Hammer ), and Josh Farris ("Ain't no sunshine" cover by Josh Hoge - thanks, TanithandBenFan!).
    Last edited by Sylvia; 03-03-2013 at 09:16 PM.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  11. #811

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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    Boitano was bronze medalist at 1978 Jr. Worlds. NadineWhite did mention that in another post in the Trash Can thread.

    Hamilton was already senior by the time Junior Worlds began in the late 70s.

    Thanks, gkelly, I forgot about B.B.! when I mentioned how many American men have medalled at BOTH jr. worlds and the Olympics!

    Make that 4: B.B., Wylie, Goebel, Lysacek

    Anyhow I thought it would be interesting considering the American Men made history the other day, what ramifications if any we might expect in the future....

    Mayhap one of them can make history again by medalling at next year's Olympics, one can hope and dream....

    Now I'm off obsessing and will enjoy the rest of this Sunday on a gorgeous day in Seattle!!!!

  12. #812

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    Exhibition performances earlier today in Milan: Shotaro Omori ("Ave Maria"), Jason Brown ("Can't touch this" by MC Hammer ), and Josh Farris ("Ain't no sunshine" cover by Josh Hoge - thanks, TanithandBenFan!).
    OMG, how arrogant of Jason to think nobody can touch his talent!
    Only more arrogant selection I can think of is "Girl on Fire"!
    "Marge, if you're going to get mad at me every time I do something stupid, then I guess I'm just going to have to stop doing stupid things!" - Homer Simpson in the Mr. Plow episode

  13. #813
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheylana View Post
    OMG, how arrogant of Jason to think nobody can touch his talent!
    Only more arrogant selection I can think of is "Girl on Fire"!
    I suspect it's not his talent he doesn't want people touching.
    Actual bumper sticker series: Jesus is my co-pilot. Satan is my financial advisor. Budha is my therapist. L. Ron Hubbard owes me $50.

  14. #814

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    IFS' Facebook photo of Farris, Brown, and Omori posing with their medals and a big American flag: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater

    Another photo of the sweep : http://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/s...577856/photo/1

    Exhibition performances earlier today in Milan: Shotaro Omori ("Ave Maria"), Jason Brown ("Can't touch this" by MC Hammer ), and Josh Farris ("Ain't no sunshine" cover by Josh Hoge - thanks, TanithandBenFan!).
    sweep! They all look so excited, as they should be!

    Running off to find videos of the gala now - love Jason's "Can't Touch This" and I'm so delighted to see Josh has got rid of his slightly mournful (IMO) ex and has a new one.

  15. #815
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    I'm so excited about the US sweep. I see star potential in all of Farris, Brown, and Omori...really, they all have something special. It's going to be fun to watch their senior careers unfold.

  16. #816
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    ^With Farris moving up to Seniors and Brown probably moving up as well, this will deepen the US talent pool on the GP circuit / Senior B's (hopefully).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    Jason would be nuts to stay a Junior. He's already better then most of the top Senior men so why stay as on the JGP?
    In this article on the SP ( http://web.icenetwork.com/news/artic...&vkey=ice_news ), Brown states that he's going to leave the decision up to the USFSA:

    Brown said he and Ade had added difficulty to his free skate since the 2013 U.S. Championships, where he placed eighth. Although he would like to compete on the senior Grand Prix next season, he added that if U.S. Figure Skating prefers it, "Another year in juniors would be fine. I think we have a really deep field in the U.S. right now.

  18. #818
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    Quote Originally Posted by Impromptu View Post
    In this article on the SP ( http://web.icenetwork.com/news/artic...&vkey=ice_news ), Brown states that he's going to leave the decision up to the USFSA:
    Interesting re Brown and Juniors. Thanks for the info.

  19. #819
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    I think that's smart of him. He's kind of on the cusp so by letting USFS decide he'll get the max assignments and it will work either way.
    Actual bumper sticker series: Jesus is my co-pilot. Satan is my financial advisor. Budha is my therapist. L. Ron Hubbard owes me $50.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MacMadame View Post
    I think that's smart of him. He's kind of on the cusp so by letting USFS decide he'll get the max assignments and it will work either way.
    Yeah. Korea '18 is probably his goal. No harm in staying a Junior (although, he is technically older than Farris).

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