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  1. #861

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    Quote Originally Posted by love_skate2011 View Post
    Just as I suspected, Gachinski has nerve issues when competing
    and needs psychological help, he just doesnt have the nerves like Plushy and even Tuk's
    I figured Artur's resident hater would turn up.

    How about putting yourself under the level of pressure Artur is under (to be the "next Plushenko" - from both himself and the federation...to lead Russian men's skating in Plushenko's place...to redeem his Worlds performance...and so on) and let me know how you get on.

  2. #862

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    Quote Originally Posted by love_skate2011 View Post
    he is getting too inconsistent
    his last good skate was at Euros, his scores now is in 190+ range. I bet he will finish at the bottom of the men in CoR


    Oh yes, Euros. That was so long ago! Years and years and years and years...oh wait. Sorry, it was only two competitions ago.

  3. #863

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    Quote Originally Posted by babayaga View Post
    I/K free dance from Crystal Skate competition last week: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfOiZRQOh6Q
    I finally got around to watching it, and I think it might be better if Morozov just sticks with his usual CD in the future.

  4. #864
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    Does anyone know what are the dialogues in I/K program? Is it the part of the film by Demi Moore?

  5. #865

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    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post


    Oh yes, Euros. That was so long ago! Years and years and years and years...oh wait. Sorry, it was only two competitions ago.
    The problem isn't the music.
    The problem is everything else : the composition, the elements, the non existent transition, even the skating that hasn't shown as much progress as Bobrova/Soloviev. Even with music everyone can forget, last year's program wasn't as bad as was told. At least the elements (steps, spins, composition of the elements and transitions) were very neatly put together.
    But what we've seen so far is a badly put together program. Even the lifts haven't progressed one bit and it's not Zhulin's fault anymore, so whose fault is it ?
    poths Void: MarieM carries a rusty old blade in her handbag!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarieM View Post
    Even the lifts haven't progressed one bit and it's not Zhulin's fault anymore, so whose fault is it ?
    CoP? ITA with everything you said.

    Quote Originally Posted by robinhood View Post
    Does anyone know what are the dialogues in I/K program? Is it the part of the film by Demi Moore?
    Even "better": it's from the new musical version of Ghost that was on Broadway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Macassar88 View Post
    Although I also feel like the bombastic nature of their FD is meant to distract from the fact that they haven't made any improvements. People are so focused on the gun shots that fewer people are talking about the fact that there aren't any transitions and that they don't keep the performance level up by the halfway point of the program.
    Good point. While it is early in the season and I expect their conditioning to improve to a degree, their late starts are becoming a problem. I'm happy they at least did a tune up event which they didn't the past two years, but it was scheduled very late. By the time they were debuting their programs, B&S for example were skating in their 3rd international and locking up their spot in the GP Final (and I believe they did internal Russian competitions and test skates as well). It's always this way, I&K start out slowly, and then by Euros they have decent skates, but never really great ones. There is hardly time to make changes between Crystal Skate and CoR, so what is really the point? And the way they withdrew from Cup of Nice, and switched to Crystal Skate where they got ridiculous scores seems fishy somehow... like Morozov had a friend on the panel or something. And both of those choices are really low-level events where they wouldn't face any competition, compared to events like Nebelhorn and Finlandia. I just feel like they aren't challenging themselves whatsoever and if Morozov is saying they need to be fighting for the podium at Worlds, this is not good strategy.

    The idea of them with Krylova is interesting. As we've discussed before IMO they need a coach who is a strong disciplinarian. She's still pretty young, and her top teams have been P&B and W&P who are mature, hard-working, and I think realize how lucky they are to get the opportunity to work with her. I don't know how she would deal with I&K.

  7. #867
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    Quote Originally Posted by robinhood View Post
    Does anyone know what are the dialogues in I/K program? Is it the part of the film by Demi Moore?
    I assume it's from the musical, since that's the music they're using?

  8. #868
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    I figured Artur's resident hater would turn up.

    How about putting yourself under the level of pressure Artur is under (to be the "next Plushenko" - from both himself and the federation...to lead Russian men's skating in Plushenko's place...to redeem his Worlds performance...and so on) and let me know how you get on.
    Im not a hater just being realistic

    and Gachinski being beaten by the likes of a Voronov and Menshov
    I doubt he is that pressured to be the " Next Plushenko ", the younger juniors are more promising

    I bet Kovtun or even the younger kids like Petrov and Samarin will do better and Gachinski will be dumped once these 3
    turn seniors for 2018

  9. #869

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherub721 View Post
    Good point. While it is early in the season and I expect their conditioning to improve to a degree, their late starts are becoming a problem. I'm happy they at least did a tune up event which they didn't the past two years, but it was scheduled very late. By the time they were debuting their programs, B&S for example were skating in their 3rd international and locking up their spot in the GP Final (and I believe they did internal Russian competitions and test skates as well).

    [...]

    And both of those choices are really low-level events where they wouldn't face any competition, compared to events like Nebelhorn and Finlandia. I just feel like they aren't challenging themselves whatsoever and if Morozov is saying they need to be fighting for the podium at Worlds, this is not good strategy.
    I agree with you about their consistantly slow starts being concerning, but the comparision with B/S doing early GPs and skating at Finlandia is a little unfair, firstly because skaters are limited in how much say they get to have over which GPs they are assigned, and secondly there would have been little point in them entering Finlandia, Nebelhorn or the internal Russian competitions this year as Elena was still recovering from her shoulder injury. I believe she was only able to start fully training again in the last month. We will only be able to see if they really are off to another poor start after this weekend.

  10. #870
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post


    Oh yes, Euros. That was so long ago! Years and years and years and years...oh wait. Sorry, it was only two competitions ago.
    Only 2 competitions ago, and even now he isn't getting back in his real strength yet. I hope he will stand on the podium at CoR or NRW. He needs to win for recovering fully. I mean, mentally.

  11. #871
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    Quote Originally Posted by morqet View Post
    I agree with you about their consistantly slow starts being concerning, but the comparision with B/S doing early GPs and skating at Finlandia is a little unfair, firstly because skaters are limited in how much say they get to have over which GPs they are assigned, and secondly there would have been little point in them entering Finlandia, Nebelhorn or the internal Russian competitions this year as Elena was still recovering from her shoulder injury. I believe she was only able to start fully training again in the last month. We will only be able to see if they really are off to another poor start after this weekend.
    You're right - I was probably being a bit harsh.

  12. #872
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    I figured Artur's resident hater would turn up.

    How about putting yourself under the level of pressure Artur is under (to be the "next Plushenko" - from both himself and the federation...to lead Russian men's skating in Plushenko's place...to redeem his Worlds performance...and so on) and let me know how you get on.
    The pressure obviously is a lot, but I do think a sports psychologist could maybe help him. It's not like he's lost his jumps, he can still do the quads and 3a easily, it's just that, he has to keep the rest of the performance together, otherwise he won't score well and will not earn the PCS he deserves when he's skating with conviction. He landed 2 quads in his SC FS and still ended up 9th...clearly, it isn't just about the jumps. Idk what was going on with his 3a being so wonky there, usually it's his money jump, so let's hope those issues are a temporary fluke, but he can't just give away points with careless mistakes and uninspired skating like that. He seemed depressed or really discouraged, he is a good skater, he knows the judges won't hesitate to give him good scores when he skates well, he's still a teenager and has already medaled at Worlds and Europeans, seems to me he just needs a push or influx of motivation of some sort to get his spark back. It's still early, and maybe with the mega scores being earned by the likes of Hanyu and Fernandez (both around his age) recently, how Patrick Chan continues to score well for terrible performances (like at SC - I'm sorry but that FS was a mess), Plushenko and others like Lysacek making comebacks, and Kovtun tearing up the JGP and gaining lots of attention as the next star, he just feels kind of lost in the shuffle and like the odds are against him.

  13. #873
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    It's still early, and maybe with the mega scores being earned by the likes of Hanyu and Fernandez (both around his age) recently, how Patrick Chan continues to score well for terrible performances (like at SC - I'm sorry but that FS was a mess), Plushenko and others like Lysacek making comebacks, and Kovtun tearing up the JGP and gaining lots of attention as the next star, he just feels kind of lost in the shuffle and like the odds are against him.
    Takahashi's free skate at Cup of China was an even bigger mess than Chan's at Skate Canada, up to Takahashi looking labored and quite overpowered by the music but he still scored pretty high on the components and I have this feeling he will continue to score high, mistakes or no mistakes.

    What I think that affected Artur's PCS at SC apart from the missed jumps and his slowness was that he skated on two feet for most of his long program, as well as the obvious - to me - lack of valuable transitions.

    I see more modern skating in Kovtun than Artur these days. I am not an Artur hater and I had high hopes for him this season with new choreographies.

  14. #874

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    For most of the preseason gachinski had 3a but not quad and he goes to Canada and basically no 3a but quad. Sports psychologist is an obvious investment that should be made. Worlds 2011 was despite low pcs and all jumps so he knows no mistake is possible ever on a jump for success internationally.

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    I think Menshov will finish higher than Gachinski at CoR

    I hope Martiusheva/Rogonov have a decent skate
    she's landing throws but I don't want too see them getting a fluke fall going in to a death spiral

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiJs0geWWNQ&feature=plcp

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    Quote Originally Posted by VarBar View Post
    What I think that affected Artur's PCS at SC apart from the missed jumps and his slowness was that he skated on two feet for most of his long program, as well as the obvious - to me - lack of valuable transitions.
    Hasn't this always been the case for him though? His skating is very Russian - just focused on the jumps and some on showmanship, but he never does much with his blades or with the music. I would hate to be labelled as a hater but I truly do not see what is so good about his sakting that got him the high PCS to medal at Euros and Worlds. Would someone please enlighten me?

  17. #877
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I would hate to be labelled as a hater but I truly do not see what is so good about his sakting that got him the high PCS to medal at Euros and Worlds. Would someone please enlighten me?
    Other skaters sucked out loud?? Nothing really special about him that I can see, other than his ability to elicit, uhm, STRONG reactions by certain "fans" when anything remotely critical is posted about him? (Hmm, that would actually put him on par with Weir, Virtue/Moir, Davis/White, etc....maybe he IS better than I thought )
    I am free of all prejudices. I hate everyone equally.~W. C. Fields

  18. #878

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    OMG, Martiusheva and Rogonov!!! Two freaky falls that could have been avoided. What is going on with them? I really like this pair, but the competition just a few days ago shows that they skate worse than ever! (Usually she struggles with jumps. Here she doubled, but lands throw jump. But the fall on nothing and another one on death spiral!)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCyKL0OzzII&feature=plcp

  19. #879

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    OMG, Martiusheva and Rogonov!!! I really like this pair, but the competition just a few days ago shows that they skate worse than ever!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCyKL0OzzII&feature=plcp
    Worse than ever? Please come on. there were times in the past few years, where she hits the ice almost at every jump (even a double and most of the throws)
    the throw was cleanly landed.
    her double sal, okay, we have seen that many times, you´re right

    but the mistake at the beginning and the death spiral? come on, such mistakes happens to you once or twice during your career and now it happend to them. remember savchenko/szolkowy with their olympic program at teb 2009? few weeks later they bounced back.

    i agree that a skate lake that don´t give too much confidence for rostelecom cup, but let´s wait and judge until then. now it´s time for them to prove on the big stage.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    OMG, Martiusheva and Rogonov!!! Two freaky falls that could have been avoided. What is going on with them? I really like this pair, but the competition just a few days ago shows that they skate worse than ever! (Usually she struggles with jumps. Here she doubled, but lands throw jump. But the fall on nothing and another one on death spiral!)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCyKL0OzzII&feature=plcp
    this was at Cup of Russia III I think a week ago ? , they placed 2nd, I posted it above
    I hope those freak falls wont happen especially that fluke on the death spiral
    landing of throws looked improved

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