View Poll Results: Who is the weakest link?

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  • John Curry

    96 51.61%
  • Alexei Yagudin

    90 48.39%
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  1. #21

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    Oh, he has beautiful lines. He's gorgeous. That particular skate just didn't capture me but that's just me.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holley Calmes View Post
    Yes, it was. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

    Sorry- I love him too, but that really put me to sleep. I had to bail 3/4 of the way through. Give me some Yags passion! I know Curry did many other skates that were more dynamic. Just a matter of personal taste! I think I watch so much ballet and see so much similar - I think I expect skaters to be more forceful, fast, explosive because they CAN. Skaters have the ability to use so many other physical gifts and resources to make different kinds of visual images than gently wafting about the rink, lovely though it is. Of course, wafting around is perfectly legitimate and beautiful. Maybe I'm easily bored.

    Don't get me wrong-I'm not criticizing Curry-I think he's one of the greatest skaters of all time. But it did make me wonder about the differences between skating and dance, and how skaters have this glorious freedom to fly higher, faster, and with more excitement because they ARE skating and they can use the physics of skating to propel them! Which to me, dance fanatic though I am, puts skating in a very special place. And yes, I saw the jumps, but it looked like Curry was trying too hard to be a ballet dancer than a skater, and to me, that wastes a lot of opportunities. But nothing wrong with it-in fact, very lovely. But...Don't mean to offend anyone! Don't mean to trample on sacred territory. No disrespect.
    I like your post! (Particularly 'to make different kinds of visual images' part.)

    What I too have always thought similarly.
    A reason why I am not impressed by balletic skaters except Curry.
    Last edited by t.mann; 08-21-2012 at 03:53 AM.

  3. #23

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    I almost always give very high marks to difficult jumps, athleticism, but Curry's skating is transcendental. It just flows, and he pays attention to the minutest detail. I can never get bored watching perfection like his.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipforsynchro View Post
    I like him so much because of his lines. Some people who are generally perceived as really good artists have the most disgusting positions and it just kills the mood. ^
    As I remember it, artistry doesn't mean much to you at all, so.... I don't think you're the one to speak about it.

    I would have wanted Curry to win. Yagudin - that's so predictable. But not only that - I too am one of those who think that his artistry and skating skills are overrated, although otherwise he was really impressive indeed. About Curry - I do understand Holley Calmes, and partially agree, but I think the thing is that Curry is deeper than just balletic. It's not just the form, it's also content.
    Last edited by lauravvv; 08-21-2012 at 01:44 PM.

  5. #25

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    I totally understand what you are saying. I do not know the intricacies of skating like I am sure you do, and therefore I can't appreciate the finer elements of Curry's skating. But I believe you that they are there! Also, I am sure seeing him live would've made a huge difference. I have watched other of his vidoes, and although he is totally beautiful, I find him somewhat bland.

    Also, although I am a huge Yagudin fan, I do not think Alexei was so much of an artist as an interpreter of choreography, and there is a difference. However, I connected with Yagudin's heart-he threw it out there. You could see his passion clearly, his determination and his fighting spirit which connected to his choreography by the choices that were made for him. It made me love him and want him to win. Curry is beautiful but I'm not connected. It's just a personal thing-no judgement on "who's the best!"

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by lauravvv View Post
    As I remember it, artistry doesn't mean much to you at all, so.... I don't think you're the one to speak about it.
    I said lines, not artistry. I've always loves extension and pointed toes, which Curry always has. And I'll admit I really do like his artistry, since it's more simple and less random arm waving and bending over.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipforsynchro View Post
    I said lines, not artistry. I've always loves extension and pointed toes, which Curry always has. And I'll admit I really do like his artistry, since it's more simple and less random arm waving and bending over.
    I was refering more to this: "Some people who are generally perceived as really good artists have the most disgusting positions and it just kills the mood." I don't think you're the one to say about positions killing the mood, since creating the mood is also about artistry, and, as you don't care about artistry much, you shouldn't be caring about the "mood" either.

    Quote Originally Posted by flipforsynchro View Post
    And I'll admit I really do like his artistry, since it's more simple and less random arm waving and bending over.
    Artistry is not just positions, lines, and so on.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by lauravvv View Post
    Artistry is not just positions, lines, and so on.
    I know that. I'm just saying that some people who are "artistic" portray it through random arm movements and unnecessary bending over

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipforsynchro View Post
    I know that. I'm just saying that some people who are "artistic" portray it through random arm movements and unnecessary bending over
    I, for one, don't regard most of such skaters as artistic. I suspect that Takahashi is one of those skaters in your book, but there are many programs where he doesn't do that, and even when he does, those "random" arm movements are surprisingly musical . As for "bending over", I am not sure if I understand what you mean by that. Is that what Chan does sometimes? I personally have nothing against that type of movement, but I don't cosider him artistic either - at all.

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by lauravvv View Post
    Artistry is not just positions, lines, and so on.
    True, but Curry was not just about lines and positions. He interpreted the music wonderfully, while weaving the moves seamlessly, and holding the positions and lines which added to the musical interpretation.

    Yagudin expressed the music very well and had great speed, power and athleticism, but that little component of lines, positions and seamlessness was a bit weak in his skating. May be the jumps had something to do with it. Chan is better at it, but he does not express the music as well as Yagudin did, and he is inconsistent with the jumps.

    They all have their own strengths and weaknesses, but it is hard for me to find any weakness in Curry's skating (of course he did not have to do that many jumps back then).

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    True, but Curry was not just about lines and positions. He interpreted the music wonderfully, while weaving the moves seamlessly, and holding the positions and lines which added to the musical interpretation.
    I know all of this. I was not trying to argue that Curry was not artistic. It's just that some people seem to equate pointed toes, lines, positions, etc. to artistry.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by lauravvv View Post
    I, for one, don't regard most of such skaters as artistic. I suspect that Takahashi is one of those skaters in your book, but there are many programs where he doesn't do that, and even when he does, those "random" arm movements are surprisingly musical . As for "bending over", I am not sure if I understand what you mean by that. Is that what Chan does sometimes? I personally have nothing against that type of movement, but I don't cosider him artistic either - at all.
    I don't think Chan bends over much, but I'm not sure since whenever I watch him I usually just watch his edges. And takahashis arm movements are very musical, I agree. I think I'm being very hypocritical though since Michal my bby does a lot of random face touching and arm reaching in his slow section and I love it. But maybe that's because I find him so sexual.

    Eta: I don't equate pointed toes, lines, etc. to artistry, if you were talking about me.^ Lambiel IMO doesn't have great lines at times but he is artistic

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipforsynchro View Post
    I don't think Chan bends over much, but I'm not sure since whenever I watch him I usually just watch his edges. And takahashis arm movements are very musical, I agree. I think I'm being very hypocritical though since Michal my bby does a lot of random face touching and arm reaching in his slow section and I love it. But maybe that's because I find him so sexual.
    Then who, pray tell, are those "artistic" skaters with random arm movements and lots of bending over ?

    Eta: I don't equate pointed toes, lines, etc. to artistry, if you were talking about me.^ Lambiel IMO doesn't have great lines at times but he is artistic
    I was not referring to you in particular, although for a moment there it seemed that you are one of those people.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by lauravvv View Post
    Then who, pray tell, are those "artistic" skaters with random arm movements and lots of bending over ?

    I was not referring to you in particular, although for a moment there it seemed that you are one of those people.
    I seem to remember Lambiel and Abbott doing them. They are wonderful but in my opinion the OTT emoting is meh

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipforsynchro View Post
    I seem to remember Lambiel and Abbott doing them. They are wonderful but in my opinion the OTT emoting is meh
    Maybe they did/do some "bending over" in some programs, although I personally call it "choreographic moves". But I don't remember any random arm movements. In their case (especially Lambiel's) all arm movements are absolutely and carefully choreographed. If you are calling what they do "OTT emoting", then obviously for you any kind of emoting is "OTT". Because I've seen OTT emoting, and their kind of emoting is far from it.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by lauravvv View Post
    Maybe they did/do some "bending over" in some programs, although I personally call it "choreographic moves". But I don't remember any random arm movements. In their case (especially Lambiel's) all arm movements are absolutely and carefully choreographed. If you are calling what they do "OTT emoting", then obviously for you any kind of emoting is "OTT". Because I've seen OTT emoting, and their kind of emoting is far from it.
    And this is why figure skating is subjective and it also kinda explained why I love Curry. He seemed like a more simple skater, although that might be because he didn't compete COP
    Last edited by flipforsynchro; 08-24-2012 at 01:01 AM.

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