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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky166 View Post
    And Keegan Messing,
    Too inconsistent and skating looks like a mess.

    and as much as I hate to say it, even Brandon Mroz if he manages to land some of those 3 different quads he's reportedly training.
    That would be a true miracle since Mroz can't land one singe type of quad with any consistency. Skating career-wise, I'd say he's 100% cooked.

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by orbitz View Post
    Too inconsistent and skating looks like a mess.



    That would be a true miracle since Mroz can't land one singe type of quad with any consistency. Skating career-wise, I'd say he's 100% cooked.
    If you think Mahbanoozadeh, Farris, and Aaron have a shot then I don't see why those two shouldn't also be considered. Domestically their PCS marks will likely all be comparable if they skate well.

  3. #243

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    The men's team needs Evan AND Johnny at this point.

  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex View Post
    The men's team needs Evan AND Johnny at this point.
    I agree. Everyone here keeps talking about everyone who could possibly play spoiler but guess what, there is NO ONE in the US right now who has anywhere close to a decent record at Worlds other than Evan (yes, if he comes back), and Johnny. We have all these people who have gone and done poorly, or who have no experience at all at that level. Yes, it will come down to who does the best on that day (Nationals), but something has to be said for the people who can be relied on to have a decent showing at worlds (no medal guarantee-all I ask is decent). Frankly, I've given up on Abbott at Worlds at this point and everyone else is too inexperienced.

  5. #245

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex View Post
    The men's team needs Evan AND Johnny at this point.
    No.

    No team NEEDS anyone.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    No.

    No team NEEDS anyone.
    unless it's josh amirite? Someone had to say it.

  7. #247

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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkFeathers View Post
    unless it's josh amirite? Someone had to say it.
    Not at all.

  8. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkFeathers View Post
    unless it's josh amirite? Someone had to say it.
    lol you're forgetting jason!! with his flutz and almost 3a

    although, josh did score almost 17 points higher than Johnny at Finlandia at a JGP, so if the US men's team really NEEDS Johnny Weir than i'm a bit worried

    the fact that there are so many guys who could play spoiler but have no experience, are inconsistent, look like they're about 12, still compete in juniors, etc. but still have the ability to land big jumps and potentially score well is exactly why the team doesn't NEED anyone....it's a crap shoot either way. what it really comes down to is a rusty has-been, proven headcase, rookie on the rise, consistently inconsistent wild card, baby boy, or one-trick wonder all probably have the same chances to win a medal at worlds this season and gain 3 spots for the olympics next season, let alone medal there, and those chances are... pretty slim.

    YUP

  9. #249
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    Why anyone thinks Johnny is likely to play decently enough at Worlds to help the U.S regain 3 spots at this point is beyond me. Skating his best in Vancouver he came 6th when the caliber of skating was much lower than now. Even with his usual mediocre and dissapointing Worlds perforamnces Abbott would probably place as high or higher at this point. Dornbush would probably place higher than Johnny at Worlds at this point too. With any team the U.S is unlikely to get 3 spots though unless someone like Abbott surprises by performing better than usual at Worlds.

  10. #250

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    Got bored so I spent time looking up records on Icenetwork.

    Ricky as the youngest has only skated in 39 competitions, he medaled in 22 of them.

    Of Johnny's 65 competitions, he medaled 38 times,

    Jeremy medaled 30 out of 56 and Evan 59 out of 78


    Johnny and Jeremy's medals are spread over their skating career while the majority of Evan's podiums have been since Torino. Ricky has only been skating th senior level a short time and he has two senior medals so far, the rest are spread among his juvenile, novice and junior years.


    I wasn't bored enough to count how many of the medals were gold, silver or bronze.
    Last edited by judiz; 10-12-2012 at 06:22 AM.

  11. #251

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    But how many are international vs. domestic, Senior vs. below Senior? Abbott never competed on the JGP, for example.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  12. #252

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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
    But how many are international vs. domestic, Senior vs. below Senior? Abbott never competed on the JGP, for example.

    It would be interesting to classify the medals by international/national and by skating levels and maybe one day I will be motivated enough to do it - but not tonight.

  13. #253

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    Quote Originally Posted by judiz View Post
    It would be interesting to classify the medals by international/national and by skating levels and maybe one day I will be motivated enough to do it - but not tonight.
    This could be an interesting Trash Can thread topic...

    ETA that Lysacek currently is scheduled to perform in Vail, Colorado in December: http://www.planetski.eu/news/4236
    15) Enjoy Vail Family Holidaze in the mountains from Dec. 16-25 and 31, featuring fun family activities, including free ice skating performances from Olympic and World champion Evan Lysacek.
    The dates for Golden Spin of Zagreb are Dec. 13-16.
    Last edited by Sylvia; 10-12-2012 at 06:50 AM. Reason: To add Vail info
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

  14. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.Cooper View Post
    Frustrating for who, leafygreens? The fans? Think about the athletes....they are the ones who put in the work, day in and day out, abusing and punishing their bodies with injuries, trying to determine what level of pain can be managed...what is a new ache and pain. Skating in 2012 is far different from 20 years ago. COP has changed how skaters train, and I for one, believe that the athletes are dealing with more debilitating injuries now than ever before; chronic injuries that their work, school, training schedules just don't allow for complete recovery. And once a chronic injury takes root, it starts to play with the psychological side of training and performance. The athlete's frustration must sky-rocket!
    Yes, frustrating for fans. It would be nice if skaters didn't quit in Oly years so we wouldn't have a "drought" the following season. I can certainly understand for the skaters how hard it must be, though.

  15. #255

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post

    ETA that Lysacek currently is scheduled to perform in Vail, Colorado in December: http://www.planetski.eu/news/4236

    The dates for Golden Spin of Zagreb are Dec. 13-16.
    Per the Vail.com website, Lysacek is scheduled to skate in Vail Dec. 20-22.

  16. #256

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    Quote Originally Posted by foreverkwanfan View Post
    So Evan is pulling a Sasha......
    BINGO! NBC just wants to be able to point to Evan for Nationals and, thus, charge more per advertising minute. Just like they had Sasha in all of the ads in Fall 2009, in the run-up to Olys. Potential casual viewers (not skating fans like ourselves) will tune in expecting to the see a star from the last Olympics. (Who can blame the industry for doing what's necessary to bring in more viewers? Can't complain there. I just hope that Evan really wants it too...not just a marketing ploy.)

  17. #257

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    Quote Originally Posted by skatefan102 View Post
    I agree. Everyone here keeps talking about everyone who could possibly play spoiler but guess what, there is NO ONE in the US right now who has anywhere close to a decent record at Worlds other than Evan (yes, if he comes back), and Johnny. We have all these people who have gone and done poorly, or who have no experience at all at that level. Yes, it will come down to who does the best on that day (Nationals), but something has to be said for the people who can be relied on to have a decent showing at worlds (no medal guarantee-all I ask is decent). Frankly, I've given up on Abbott at Worlds at this point and everyone else is too inexperienced.
    So true. I can't remember when the US men have been so inadequate. And I too have lost all faith in Abbott. If he were a mediocre skater, it wouldn't be so bad. But there is such beauty in his skating when he skates clean, it's all the more disappointing when he chokes on the international stage.
    Quote Originally Posted by misskarne View Post
    No.

    No team NEEDS anyone.
    This team does. A bit of divine intervention would help as well.

  18. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Willowway View Post
    Groin injuries are typically very stubborn and very easy to reinjure. This really up-ends Evan's proposed season but being very cautious is the only way to get to complete healing with this particular problem.
    the consequence for our quad jumpers Happened to many of our top male skaters - the torque on their groin especially for the quads..
    Thanks to PI .. I discovered I'm actually a Nontheist

    "Love is better than Anger, Hope is better than fear" Jack Layton 1950-2011

  19. #259
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    Quote Originally Posted by judiz View Post
    Got bored so I spent time looking up records on Icenetwork.

    Ricky as the youngest has only skated in 39 competitions, he medaled in 22 of them.

    Of Johnny's 65 competitions, he medaled 38 times,

    Jeremy medaled 30 out of 56 and Evan 59 out of 78


    Johnny and Jeremy's medals are spread over their skating career while the majority of Evan's podiums have been since Torino. Ricky has only been skating th senior level a short time and he has two senior medals so far, the rest are spread among his juvenile, novice and junior years.


    I wasn't bored enough to count how many of the medals were gold, silver or bronze.
    Interesting, but IMO, the above isn't really a predictor of anything. Also, counting Richard's stats from juvenile, novice and junior years is also not too relevant to a total medals won in X number of overall competitions comparison. You'd probably need to separate out senior and junior from anything that occurred prior. All these numbers/ stats maybe might be used by oddsmakers if this were a horse race. IMO, figure skating is a strange sport, and the politics of it all and the way it is judged these days make it even more weird. Too many factors are involved re how well a given skater will perform on a given day. Added to that conundrum is skating order, ice condition, athlete condition, mood, temperament, quality of music and choreo, perhaps even how the costume plays into the performance. When you throw in politics and judging system, and past reputation of the skater, and how well they are known or have performed internationally, it's a mixed bag. Add to that of course that Nationals (particularly in the U.S. is completely different from how an international event is judged, re politics and overindulgent scoring).

    Too bad the sport can't be judged on who is the best period, without the limitations of how many can be sent to Worlds from a particular country, especially when there are countries like Japan and the United States with so many skaters with top level talent who have to sit at home because the competition at their Nationals is so deep. This makes the career opportunities so very slim and time-limited. The young up-and-comers in the U.S. will be pushed back even more on their timeline due to veterans like Evan and Johnny coming back. Some will say: Evan and Johnny have more experience and rep with international judges. Others will say: Send one veteran and one up-and-comer. Not sure how U.S. judges will play this out, but they kinda flubbed it in 2011.
    Last edited by aftershocks; 10-12-2012 at 06:44 PM. Reason: Prob'ly should take my rehash to U.S. men thread, tho' its unlikely to be welcome their either. ;)

  20. #260

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    So WHY did you have to re-hash this in a Lysacek news & updates thread?

    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFan66 View Post
    Per the Vail.com website, Lysacek is scheduled to skate in Vail Dec. 20-22.
    Thanks for confirming the Vail dates.
    "Randy [Starkman (1960-April 16, 2012)] lived by the same motto as the rest of us. The Olympics isn’t every four years, it’s every single day. He just got it." --Canadian Olympic kayaker Adam van Koeverden

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