Rank the Jumping Technique of These Senior Ladies

[JanetB]

...and if you added a sixth triple, you'd end up with Tonya Harding and Midori Ito. Still the best jumpers ever, it's amazing what they accomplished so long ago.

Over the last 20-25 years only 4-5 ladies have actually been able to do all 5 jumps technically correct.

[Triple Butz]

Over the last 20-25 years only 4-5 ladies have actually been able to do all 5 jumps technically correct.

You mean without the axel? There are 6 jumps.
If you just mean toe through lutz and a 2a, I'd say:
Maria Butyrskaya, Tatiana Malinina, Irina Slutskaya (first lutz entry), Miki Ando (2007-2009ish), Carolina Kostner (when she did lutzes), Susanna Poykio, Alisa Drei, Joannie Rochette, Rachael Flatt(after late 2009), Emily Hughes (when she did the loop), Kiira Korpi (though she rarely lands them)

add Ito and Harding to the list and that makes 13 and there are probably more.

[krenseby]

Some skaters can naturally jump very high because of their body type and can also rotate quickly. So they are able to complete harder jumps more easily, at least some of the time. (They may be inconsistent at these jumps if they're relying on physical gifts and skimping on technique.)

Both those skills can be learned and improved, but ultimately the skater's physical makeup is going to limit the maximum height or rotational speed she can achieve.

Other skaters do not have the fast-twitch muscles or body proportions necessary to jump as high or rotate as quickly. They have less room for error. In order to do triple jumps at all, they need to have better technique than the skaters who are more athletically gifted in the relevant areas.

So are we asking who had the biggest, most impressive jumps, or who had the best technique?

I'd actually like examples of both cases.

[query5]

i would also add michelle kwan to that list,
i would agree with most of the people other people have listed .

[query5]

as far as placing them in order it depends on various factors, age, development.
mirai jumps at beginning werent as good now-they are okay.

kostners some jumps better younger, some older,
joanie kinda of improved with age,
both michelle and irina depended upon how hurt they was.
kiira sometimes good sometimes not,

but michelle and irina couldn't have long careers with bad jump technique. both had decent jump technique
alissa depends

depends on skaters, hurt, age, sometimes better when younger , sometimes better when older.

[gkelly]

I'd actually like examples of both cases.

How about Kristi Yamaguchi as an example of a skater with small jumps who got them done pretty consistently on the strength of technical control, and Oksana Baiul as an example of a skater who relied more on height and speed on the jumps but was less consistent with her technique.

[EricRohmer]

You mean without the axel? There are 6 jumps.
If you just mean toe through lutz and a 2a, I'd say:
Maria Butyrskaya, Tatiana Malinina, Irina Slutskaya (first lutz entry), Miki Ando (2007-2009ish), Carolina Kostner (when she did lutzes), Susanna Poykio, Alisa Drei, Joannie Rochette, Rachael Flatt(after late 2009), Emily Hughes (when she did the loop), Kiira Korpi (though she rarely lands them)

add Ito and Harding to the list and that makes 13 and there are probably more.

I would add Yuna(when she did 3Lo : Junior, 07~08 season).

[smarts1]

^ You mean 05-06.

[invierno]

^ You mean 05-06.

No Eric means junior years AND 07~08 season.

[smarts1]

Some skaters can naturally jump very high because of their body type and can also rotate quickly. So they are able to complete harder jumps more easily, at least some of the time. (They may be inconsistent at these jumps if they're relying on physical gifts and skimping on technique.)

Both those skills can be learned and improved, but ultimately the skater's physical makeup is going to limit the maximum height or rotational speed she can achieve.

Other skaters do not have the fast-twitch muscles or body proportions necessary to jump as high or rotate as quickly. They have less room for error. In order to do triple jumps at all, they need to have better technique than the skaters who are more athletically gifted in the relevant areas.

So are we asking who had the biggest, most impressive jumps, or who had the best technique?

We're going on best technique. Not on consistency or impressive jumps. Generally though, it seems to me that most people think that impressive jumps go with excellent technique (which is true in most but not all cases).

[smarts1]

No Eric means junior years AND 07~08 season.

Oh... Nevermind then...

[l'etoile]

Great technique always leads to good scores/GOEs so I'd look at those numbers when determining this criteria.

[orbitz]

I would like an explanation as to what's wrong with Czisny's technique. Besides the fact that she falls all the time. When she does jumps cleanly, they look nice.

Czisny never looks comfortable with her 2a entrance; Her upper body is too square stepping into the jump.

[t.mann]

...and if you added a sixth triple, you'd end up with Tonya Harding and Midori Ito. Still the best jumpers ever, it's amazing what they accomplished so long ago.

But didn't Midori do often flutzing&lipping unlike Harding who had clean 3Lz&3F?

[spikydurian]

Some skaters can naturally jump very high because of their body type and can also rotate quickly. So they are able to complete harder jumps more easily, at least some of the time. (They may be inconsistent at these jumps if they're relying on physical gifts and skimping on technique.)

Both those skills can be learned and improved, but ultimately the skater's physical makeup is going to limit the maximum height or rotational speed she can achieve.

Other skaters do not have the fast-twitch muscles or body proportions necessary to jump as high or rotate as quickly. They have less room for error. In order to do triple jumps at all, they need to have better technique than the skaters who are more athletically gifted in the relevant areas.

So are we asking who had the biggest, most impressive jumps, or who had the best technique?

Relevant question. Otherwise, we won't be comparing apples with apples. This will imply that if one has natural athletic abilities plus best technics is likely to be formidable jumpers?

[npavel]

very similar to Triple Butz, took some of her comments too

Excellent
1)Kostner (many have seen her great lutz in practice and warm up last year, and we are talking about teknik and not who brings it in competition ...)
2)Kim
3)Rochette
4)Slutskaya
5)Ando
Good
6)Kwan (iffy lutz)
7)Suzuki (iffy lutz)
8)Asada (flutz, weak salchow)
9)Nagasu (iffy lutz, salchow MIA)
10)Wagner (flutz, sometimes toe-axels)
11)Meier (lip, no loop)
Ok
12)Meissner (lip, toe-axel)
13)Hughes (Loop went MIA, heavy landings)
14)Korpi (sometimes they are better than other times, her jump arch is very odd)
Not so good
15)Nakano (often under-rotate, iffy flip AND lutz, wrap distracts me a lot, loop went MIA)
16)Czisny (she looks scared going into the jump and I get scared with her)

[Triple Butz]

very similar to Triple Butz, took some of her comments too

Thanks, but I'm a him...at least during the weekdays

[Geh]

In the past skaters, Josée Chouinard had a perfect technique on every jumps (minus the triple axel); OK, she was far from perfect in a lot of performances, but her technique was excellent!

[leafygreens]

Czisny never looks comfortable with her 2a entrance; Her upper body is too square stepping into the jump.

Well, she lips and even when she was doing the sal many years ago it was cheated and awkward. Aside from that, her rotation is somewhat slow, she has low height, and enters her jumps without much speed. Her air position is usually a bit tilted causing her to land a little forward and usually has difficulty completing the rotation.

Ok - but what is wrong with "looking" scared, or having slow rotation? If she gets it done, why does it matter? I'm going to have to go and watch some videos, but in her good year (2011) I remember her technique as pretty flawless. As far as her body position in the air, on successful attempts, I would compare it to Yu-na (seriously).

[Marco]

Ok - but what is wrong with "looking" scared, or having slow rotation? If she gets it done, why does it matter? I'm going to have to go and watch some videos, but in her good year (2011) I remember her technique as pretty flawless. As far as her body position in the air, on successful attempts, I would compare it to Yu-na (seriously).

But that is exactly the difference between good and bad technique. She does not produce good quality jumps, (partly) because of her technique.

For Czisny, everything has to be perfect for her to land an average jump. Even on a good day, her jumps never get enough height and border on UR BECAUSE of her slow rotations. A skater with good technique achieves sufficient height with a tight air position for quick rotation even if she isn't built like a Cohen or a Kirk.

And whenever she isn't focused enough, her body tenses up, her setup goes all wrong, she doesn't stay anywhere near vertical in the air and there's no chance at landing cleanly. A skater with good jumping technique will be more capable of saving jumps even if things are slightly off.

And her technique was never flawless. Her axel technique is never correct like orbitz said.