Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 38 of 38
  1. #21

    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Partying with Oda
    Posts
    4,133
    vCash
    699
    Rep Power
    17018
    If we're going by "actual" falls (meaning your butt lands on the ground), I thought I heard that Trixi Schuba fell in her 1972 Olympic free skate, although I've never seen it and for some reason it's not posted on YouTube. Anyone know for sure?
    "I hit him with my shoes... if he had given me the medal like I told him to, I wouldn't have had to hit him!" -- 8-year-old Rhoda Penmark in "The Bad Seed"

  2. #22
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    1,125
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by skateboy View Post
    If we're going by "actual" falls (meaning your butt lands on the ground), I thought I heard that Trixi Schuba fell in her 1972 Olympic free skate, although I've never seen it and for some reason it's not posted on YouTube. Anyone know for sure?
    AFAIK Schuba did not fall. Janet Lynn, who won the free skate (and bronze overall) did in fact fall (on a spin).

  3. #23
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    1,249
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    In her Malaguena fp, Kristi did put a hand down and then her backside swooped down barely touching the ice ...
    No, it didn't. Kristi is in a sort of squat, but her bum is clearly several inches above the ice and her weight is on her feet and blades.

    The errors were kind of similar, but Kwan's 2002 flip error was a little worse and I think could more arguably be called a fall. Kwan's second foot slipped out and, in addition to the hand, her weight was on the side of the boot instead of the blade.

    http://youtu.be/xGnnCUHWiTc?t=2m37s

    In other words, they both had 3 point landings, but two of Kristi's ice-touching points were her blades, while Kwan landed mostly not on her blades.

  4. #24
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,013
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Susan M View Post
    No, it didn't. Kristi is in a sort of squat, but her bum is clearly several inches above the ice and her weight is on her feet and blades.

    The errors were kind of similar, but Kwan's 2002 flip error was a little worse and I think could more arguably be called a fall. Kwan's second foot slipped out and, in addition to the hand, her weight was on the side of the boot instead of the blade.

    http://youtu.be/xGnnCUHWiTc?t=2m37s

    In other words, they both had 3 point landings, but two of Kristi's ice-touching points were her blades, while Kwan landed mostly not on her blades.
    ^^ Seriously, has fs lowered itself to this kind of fall, not fall analysis?!!! (Sigh) I guess it has.

    CoP, oh CoP my one and only IJS CoP... (in an off-tune singing voice)

  5. #25
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Jani-Ayil
    Posts
    3,315
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by skateboy View Post
    If we're going by "actual" falls (meaning your butt lands on the ground), I thought I heard that Trixi Schuba fell in her 1972 Olympic free skate, although I've never seen it and for some reason it's not posted on YouTube. Anyone know for sure?
    She most certainly did not fall. Her 1972 Europeans FS, which is posted on Youtube is remarkably similar to what I remember watching during the Olympics.

    Question: Why am I dating myself, when I could be dating other people?

  6. #26
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    1,249
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    ^^ Seriously, has fs lowered itself to this kind of fall, not fall analysis?!!! ...
    What did I ever do to you to deserve such a mean spirited and insulting post?

    When the question under discussion is who fell, then to me it does seem kind of relevant to define the term.

  7. #27
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    230
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    She most certainly did not fall. Her 1972 Europeans FS, which is posted on Youtube is remarkably similar to what I remember watching during the Olympics.
    Oh yes, this performance...YEESH. Oh well, at least she skated to "Man of La Mancha," which makes her program very pleasant to listen to.

  8. #28

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    8,895
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    19112
    Quote Originally Posted by Susan M View Post
    What did I ever do to you to deserve such a mean spirited and insulting post?
    Consider the source, and then don't sweat it.

  9. #29
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,013
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Apologies, Susan M -- not intended to be "mean-spirited" toward you -- just unhappy with a lot of what CoP has wrought. And I do think it's kind of excessively way over-analyzing to try and examine minute detail by minute detail the Olympic "falls, not-falls" of Yama and Kwanita.

    And actually, I was tongue-in-cheek referring to myself singing, not you -- the is directed toward CoP, not you.
    Last edited by aftershocks; 07-21-2012 at 02:59 AM.

  10. #30
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    236
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Susan M View Post
    I don't think so.

    ISU Rule 353 defines a fall. The present wording is:

    "a fall is defined as loss of control by a Skater with the result that the majority of his/her own body weight is on the ice supported by any other part of the body other than the blades e.g. hand(s), knee(s), back, buttock(s) or any part of the arm"

    By that test, I wouldn't call it a fall. It was one hand down and a quick turn and step out onto the second foot, but I don't think there was any point where the majority of her body weight was not on her blades. She kept skating directly out of the jump and continued with her choreo pretty much on the beat, and I don't think that would be possible if a majority of her weight didn't remain on her blades.

    Here's the move in question:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dozwFZ5NoNs&t=2m59s
    That's a fall in my books. If it weren't for the hand, Kristi would have fallen flat on her face.

  11. #31

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    3,467
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    1553
    Quote Originally Posted by PUNKPRINCESS View Post
    That's a fall in my books. If it weren't for the hand, Kristi would have fallen flat on her face.
    But she put her hand down. All her weight was one both her blades, according to the rules it was not a fall.

    If it weren't for the hand, Kristi would have fallen flat on her face.
    But she DID use her hand, and didn't fall so in no book can you call it one.

  12. #32
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    9,762
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    You know the old saying that "if it looks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck, then it's a duck" ? Kristi fell.

  13. #33
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Michal Brezina's pants
    Posts
    272
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Didn't look like a fall

  14. #34
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    Age
    24
    Posts
    9,017
    vCash
    1529
    Rep Power
    0
    If Sasha's second mistake in 2006 wasn't considered a fall - and the judges did not give her a -1.00 deduction, so they did not call it a fall - then Kristi's wasn't, either.

  15. #35
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Holland - Land of the Dutch
    Age
    36
    Posts
    392
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Bereznaiah/Shikhuralidze fell in 1998, twice if I remember well. They still won silver.

    A bit off topic, since it didn't happen during the Olympics (as far as I remember), but Gritchuk/Platov had trouble with falls in the years between their two flawless Olympic wins. I remember even reading how some people began calling Platov "Splatov" and thinking 'how unfair, they have some of the most difficult footwork'. Some of my favourite fd programs ever are from Gritchuk/Platov.
    Last edited by sadya; 07-29-2012 at 11:01 AM.

  16. #36
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,013
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by julieann View Post
    But she put her hand down. All her weight was one both her blades, according to the rules it was not a fall.


    But she DID use her hand, and didn't fall so in no book can you call it one.
    What rules and what book(s) are you referring to? No retroactive going back to apply IJS regulations to other eras please.

    In any case, since she won gold, I don't think Kristi even recalls the obvious backward leaning down and grabbing the ice with her hands (IOW "fall") that happened in an otherwise lovely program.

  17. #37

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    3,467
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    1553
    Quote Originally Posted by aftershocks View Post
    What rules and what book(s) are you referring to? No retroactive going back to apply IJS regulations to other eras please.

    In any case, since she won gold, I don't think Kristi even recalls the obvious backward leaning down and grabbing the ice with her hands (IOW "fall") that happened in an otherwise lovely program.
    I don't know what the rules were back then ( I went by what was already posted) maybe someone can post it if they have it. At any rate they didn't count at as a fall so it wasn't one.

    I'm sure Kristi worried about that mistake until she knew she had the gold, any skater would have.

  18. #38
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    4,013
    vCash
    500
    Rep Power
    0
    ^^Under 6.0, I'm fairly certain it was viewed as a fall (certainly an imperfect jump landing ). It's just that they were still working under the imperfect fairly antiquated but traditional brand system of 6.0 in which judges did not necessarily have to pick apart every element of what a skater did -- they were more looking at the whole and artistry counted more ironically enough than it does now under IJS. For example, the second mark under 6.0, I believe was supposed to serve as the tiebreaker, and therefore took some precedence over the tech mark, but of course both were important.

    Now fs is judged under the schizophrenic, forever rules-changing, anonymous judging, points-grabbing, falls/ non-falls count IJS/ CoP .... and the beat goes on (still an antiquated political-based system).

    As far as Kristi, yeah I'm sure she was a bit worried at the time about that one flaw in her program (I forget whether Midori had already skated and Kristi already knew that Ito had fallen on her first 3-axel attempt). But I happen to know for a fact that as time passed, Kristi had completely forgotten about her backwards leaning grab for the ice, and she doesn't deem it as a fall either.

    ETA: I mean who would ever think about such a minor forgiven by judges/ mostly forgotten moment ever again, when you are in possession of Olympic gold (and in fact had a very good skate overall)?
    Last edited by aftershocks; 07-30-2012 at 02:40 AM.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •