Figure Skating Champions SURVIVOR: Ladies ROUND 5

[Alex Forrest]

If I am not mistaken, Christopher Dean was reported to have washed his hands of that program because Kwan had taken out so much of the choreography in order to try for a clean program. I'd have to look back, but by the time Worlds came around there was almost no mention of Dean as the choreographer.

[Marco]

I thought Maria Butyrskaya was 3rd going into the long program at Nagano?? Chen Lu got some awful tech scores and Irina Slutskaya did a double-double combination. (Surya Bonaly was 6th after the SP)

That's correct. But if she had skated a bit later, there could be a case for her to place second. Lipinski's scores in the short program were not very high. Chen was clearly fourth at best due to her weaker elements, despite her superior presentation. Slutskaya only did a 2lutz2toe but was placed fifth correctly simply because no other medal contenders (Bobek, Gusmeroli, Hubert) stepped up.

[kwanatic]

Is this round over yet?

[npavel]

........., but I don't respect her as an athlete.

How can't you respect her as an athlete? I respect every athlete entering in a competition, they are all working hard for deliver, but some can, others struggle. I respect them and enjoy something of the most of them. I never could say something like that for an athlete

[Triple Butz]

That's correct. But if she had skated a bit later, there could be a case for her to place second. Lipinski's scores in the short program were not very high. Chen was clearly fourth at best due to her weaker elements, despite her superior presentation. Slutskaya only did a 2lutz2toe but was placed fifth correctly simply because no other medal contenders (Bobek, Gusmeroli, Hubert) stepped up.

I'm personally okay with Chen's bronze because I did think she was better than Maria. Two-foot landings vs under-rotations...we know which is worse under the current system, but it wasn't so cut and dry in 6.0...wasn't there something about two-footed jumps receiving NO CREDIT in 6.0? Although I would have placed Slutskaya 3rd in the free, you can't deny that Chen's presentation was light years ahead. I also thought Slutskaya was lucky to overtake Bonaly in the sp (not that that would have impacted her chances for bronze the way things turned out.)

[smarts1]

^ In all honesty, you guys can argue that Lulu was gifted with her bronze medal in Nagano, but the presentation mark is the tie breaker in the FS and that's exactly how Lulu won her bronze medal. She was behind on the technical mark in the LP when compared to Maria and Irina, but beat them on the second mark (where Irina was clearly marked the lowest of the three despite having the strongest jumps of the three).

In fact, if I remember correctly, Lulu was actually ranked 4th by most of the judges and placed 3rd in the LP simply because Maria and Irinia both were evenly split among the 5th place ordinals (and Lulu only had one 5th place ordinal).

So she was not given a gift. Her superior artistry pushed her through to that bronze medal. Either way, Lulu was past her prime at that point and I don't know if there would be this much question to her as a champion had she retired after 96 Worlds. Her performances post 96 is no reflection of all that she accomplished from 92-96, with her Olympic bronze medal, 2 World bronzes, 1 World silver, and 1 World gold. That's certainly more that's been accomplished than a ton of other skaters on this list.

On top of that, Lulu's best quality as a competitor was always skating clean programs and peaking when it really counted. The same can't be said of skaters like Maria, Irina, or Carolina (even if they occasionally did).

[centerstage01]

If I am not mistaken, Christopher Dean was reported to have washed his hands of that program because Kwan had taken out so much of the choreography in order to try for a clean program. I'd have to look back, but by the time Worlds came around there was almost no mention of Dean as the choreographer.

I think at that point Michelle's injuries were getting so that she could either have jumps in a program and little content, or lots of content and bad jumps. I think she still thought at that time that the jumps were all the judges wanted, so Bolero got severely watered down.

[RD]

Finally...Bye bye Kostner!

Decision gets MUCH tougher from here on out.

[smarts1]

I thought Tara was going to be next... People have been trying to get rid of her since like round 2.

[RD]

IMHO it is not her time to go yet. There are others on the list...next round I might have to use my vote strategically...

Although it APPEARS Lipinski is next, we'll have to see where the Kostner voters shift. That could potentially change the entire dynamic.

[briancoogaert]

I chose those two performances since those were their best ever performances. If you disagree then post Kostner's best ever performance in a long program.

I asked that because if you compare both Lu Chen and Carolina Kostner's World title (1995 and 2012), Carolina is better, IMO.
Of course, I tried to find a better performance by Carolina, and didn't find it. We can take her early years, when she did two 3/3 combos, but she didn't have the artistry she has today. And afterall, Lu chen at her debut was also a jumpin' bean !

The thing is that, in theory, Carolina Kostner's best could have won over Lu Chen's best, but in reality, Carolina never did what she can do at the practices. Too bad
And anyway, both are very good and beautiful !

[kwanette]

Deleted...Wrong thread, duh..