Shpilband/Zoueva Split Aftermath: What Happens Next?

[Sylvia]

Here's a chronological compilation of North American article and press release links to date...

Detroit Free Press articles by Jo-Ann Barnas that broke the story:
Sunday, June 3: Coach Igor Shpilband out at Canton's Arctic Figure Skating Club
June 4 (includes excerpts/quotes from USFS' press release): U.S. Figure Skating confirms top American teams to stay in Canton after Shpilband dismissal

IceNetwork article (June 4): Shpilband searches for new rink in Michigan

Associated Press article (June 4): U.S. endures ice dance shakeup

Skate Canada press release "Olympic Champions Virtue and Moir Confirm Plans for 2012-2013 Season" (June 7): http://www.skatecanada.ca/AboutUs/Ne...S/Default.aspx

Canadian newswire article by QMI Agency (June 7): Virtue, Moir split with coach

Carry on...

[Autumn_girl]

There are rumors (Artur Verner again, I'm not sure if this source is reliable, but still) that the Shibutanis want to join Krylova's group

[cruisin]

There are rumors (Artur Verner again, I'm not sure if this source is reliable, but still) that the Shibutanis want to join Krylova's group

I hope it's true, they should make a clean break.

Responding to Allezfred's comment on the other closed thread. Part of the reason for the Shib's less than awesome programs was the fact that they are brother & sister. Very limiting.

[pingu]

Cruisin in the first thread wrote:

I have met Igor, and he is the definition of arrogant. So, I can see where he would be tough to deal with on a daily basis. But, I completely agree with your post.

I just would like to say that when I interviewed him he seemed a very down to earth man. I was a 21 years old girl who was (is, and will always be) no one in the figure skating world, and he treated me very respectfully, making compliments about the website I work for and being very nice and calm. I have never had the chance to talk with Marina but she looks like someone with a strong personality, who can have a deep influence in people, and I can understand why the top three skaters decided to stay with her.

[Twizzler]

Some of the posts in the previous thread are really confusing me. Someone mentioned Igor as a great technical and developmental coach. Igor was always known as the creative force and choreographer back in the Coates/Shpilband days. She was the technician. That was why many people were scratching their heads when Igor teamed with Marina- two "choreographers" and no one to teach proper technique on compulsory dances, etc.

I also don't consider him a developmental coach. Skaters go to him at the Junior or Senior level usually. Someone else does the developing. I can think of two skaters he had a a very low level: Shannon Wingle and Jamie Silverstein. To me, a developmental coach takes a skater from the ground up (Juvenile-??) and builds a successful skater/team. Yasa and Yuri did that and the Wheaton coaches are doing that now.

Maybe Igor was distancing himself because he's burned out being the "technical coach" as that was not what he was originally known for. Perhaps he wants a fresh start doing what he loves: creating.

[Ziggy]

Part of the reason for the Shib's less than awesome programs was the fact that they are brother & sister. Very limiting.

That's a very bad excuse.

If anything is limiting, it's doing the usual romantic shtick that has been done to death.

Look at Kerrs. They thrived on having to come up with various other concepts and showed us some very original and creative routines.

[leafygreens]

Part of the reason for the Shib's less than awesome programs was the fact that they are brother & sister. Very limiting.

But why is this? D/W are "just friends" but their programs are not limited...

[rvi5]

But, I can't think of any other coach who has had the level and longevity of successful politicking that Igor has. I think that many of Igor's teams were over marked and given unfair advantage, but he got the job done. Marina does not have that level of politicking.

If Marina did get Igor ousted from AE, her politicking must be improving

[TanithandBenFan]

I just would like to say that when I interviewed him he seemed a very down to earth man. I was a 21 years old girl who was (is, and will always be) no one in the figure skating world, and he treated me very respectfully, making compliments about the website I work for and being very nice and calm. I have never had the chance to talk with Marina but she looks like someone with a strong personality, who can have a deep influence in people, and I can understand why the top three skaters decided to stay with her.

I've had the same experience. I have no idea what he's like with his students or other people in the skating world, but he's always been very kind and appreciative of the support my friends and I have given to Team Canton. He seemed very proud of his group and excited to see such a strong show of support for ice dancing.

[RumbleFish]

That's a very bad excuse.

If anything is limiting, it's doing the usual romantic shtick that has been done to death.

Look at Kerrs. They thrived on having to come up with various other concepts and showed us some very original and creative routines.

I agree.
They should try something voidy.
Then again, North American ice dances never do.
I guess they will be back doing some fox trots routine again. blah

[arakwafan2006]

Cruisin in the first thread wrote:

I just would like to say that when I interviewed him he seemed a very down to earth man. I was a 21 years old girl who was (is, and will always be) no one in the figure skating world, and he treated me very respectfully, making compliments about the website I work for and being very nice and calm. I have never had the chance to talk with Marina but she looks like someone with a strong personality, who can have a deep influence in people, and I can understand why the top three skaters decided to stay with her.

I have seen him work with his teams and he is intense but not anything like what you would imagine a mean Russian coach to be (see Johnny Weirs account of Galina or Tarasova)with his students. He does demand excellence and does not like to see people repeating mistakes and not being serious. Again, he's intense. I can imagine that there are prospective teams that think that what he does is magic and he knows its hard work that gets them to the top level. He is confident, organized and committed to his craft. Confidence, being self assured and demanding excellence is what he's supposed to be. People think that coach/pupil relationships are supposed to be warm and fuzzy.Thats not Igors thing...

[cruisin]

Cruisin in the first thread wrote:

I just would like to say that when I interviewed him he seemed a very down to earth man. I was a 21 years old girl who was (is, and will always be) no one in the figure skating world, and he treated me very respectfully, making compliments about the website I work for and being very nice and calm. I have never had the chance to talk with Marina but she looks like someone with a strong personality, who can have a deep influence in people, and I can understand why the top three skaters decided to stay with her.

Different experience. I did not interview him

Some of the posts in the previous thread are really confusing me. Someone mentioned Igor as a great technical and developmental coach. Igor was always known as the creative force and choreographer back in the Coates/Shpilband days. She was the technician. That was why many people were scratching their heads when Igor teamed with Marina- two "choreographers" and no one to teach proper technique on compulsory dances, etc.

I also don't consider him a developmental coach. Skaters go to him at the Junior or Senior level usually. Someone else does the developing. I can think of two skaters he had a a very low level: Shannon Wingle and Jamie Silverstein. To me, a developmental coach takes a skater from the ground up (Juvenile-??) and builds a successful skater/team. Yasa and Yuri did that and the Wheaton coaches are doing that now.

I totally agree. I actually touched on this myself, in the last thread. Though your post has more information than mine .

That's a very bad excuse.

If anything is limiting, it's doing the usual romantic shtick that has been done to death.

Look at Kerrs. They thrived on having to come up with various other concepts and showed us some very original and creative routines.

But, that's my point. As original and creative as the Kerrs were, they were consistently under marked. I think the judges like the romantic shtick. There is also this mentality that there has to be passion in ice dancing, and that brother/sister teams can't show that. I'm not saying I agree, just that its there.

But why is this? D/W are "just friends" but their programs are not limited...

They don't have to actually be romantic, they just have to make it look like they're "in love" on the ice. Brothers and sisters can't do that. And I know it's unfair and ridiculous, but...

If Marina did get Igor ousted from AE, her politicking must be improving

You make a point.

Just heard some :secret: info. I can't reveal much, because it is hearsay, but it came from a source who is connected. The kids were NOT involved with pushing Igor out. They knew nothing about it. The problem was between Igor and Marina, but it goes beyond what we've seen in articles. There are other people involved. I can't say who, because it would not be right. Suffice it to say that it was a big mess and Marina got what she wanted.

[Sylvia]

Re-posting Charlie White's mother's comment in reply to the person who likened the ice dancers to "spoiled brats" and "egotistical athletes" (posted in the Comments section of the June 3rd Detroit Free Press article):

Jacqui White · Detroit, Michigan
Gary, I'm afraid you don't know what you are talking about. This wasn't initiated by the skaters, they are obviously only trying to hang on by the skin of their teeth to continue training while the coaches battle to the death and when convenient, use them as pawns in the fight. This is an old story of "who has control", where egos come into play and team cooperation erodes. The skaters in this scenario are not brats, but victims caught in the crossfire.
3 June at 22:59

[allezfred]

But, that's my point. As original and creative as the Kerrs were, they were consistently under marked. I think the judges like the romantic shtick. There is also this mentality that there has to be passion in ice dancing, and that brother/sister teams can't show that. I'm not saying I agree, just that its there.

The Kerrs were marked fairly enough and mainly suffered on their technical score rather than PCS. It was always a struggle for the teams who had to adapt to IJS from 6.0 to get the technical levels.

The Shibutanis have the opposite problem. Technically great, but very limited artistically. Judges are like the audience. They want to watch something that is interesting and not a repeat of a previous year's programme.

[cruisin]

Re-posting Charlie White's mother's comment in reply to the person who likened the ice dancers to "spoiled brats" and "egotistical athletes" (posted in the Comments section of the June 3rd Detroit Free Press article):

Jacqui white's comments, re: the kids being put in the middle and being used as pawns, were validated by my source.

[Anjelica]

Igor arrogant? No I don't think that I agree with that statement. He can be the most charming man on the planet when he wants to be and he does demand commitment and hard work from his students. I would not call him mean, moody at times but not mean. No offense intended to anyone but he is Russian and thinks like a Russian coach! The guy is a genius at what he does and he is a Master politician; again, this is simply his pattern repeating itself ~ after his teams have 'peaked' he always loses interest in them and focuses on his up and comers. So no surprises at all here; ask B & A and L & T if you want confirmation of what I said.

[VIETgrlTerifa]

The Shibs need to go all Duschenay-like to win over the judges and audience again. Then the talk of being limited will stop.

[Ziggy]

There are rumors (Artur Verner again, I'm not sure if this source is reliable, but still) that the Shibutanis want to join Krylova's group

As much as this could help them develop artistically, the Krylova/Camerlengo camp seems full as it is.

But, that's my point. As original and creative as the Kerrs were, they were consistently under marked.

No, they weren't.

They just totally failed on technical elements time and time again and their basics weren't as strong as those of other top teams.

I think the judges like the romantic shtick. There is also this mentality that there has to be passion in ice dancing, and that brother/sister teams can't show that. I'm not saying I agree, just that its there.

Duchesnays lacked passion?

[barbk]

The Kerrs were marked fairly enough and mainly suffered on their technical score rather than PCS. It was always a struggle for the teams who had to adapt to IJS from 6.0 to get the technical levels.

The Shibutanis have the opposite problem. Technically great, but very limited artistically. Judges are like the audience. They want to watch something that is interesting and not a repeat of a previous year's programme.

The Kerrs are exciting, but technically sloppy skaters. I can't think of a single program of theirs that I didn't enjoy, but when even someone in no teknik on ice dance can see multiple errors per performance, they've got problems. I was hoping they would go into choreography.

[MacMadame]

I also don't consider him a developmental coach. Skaters go to him at the Junior or Senior level usually. Someone else does the developing. I can think of two skaters he had a a very low level: Shannon Wingle and Jamie Silverstein. To me, a developmental coach takes a skater from the ground up (Juvenile-??) and builds a successful skater/team. Yasa and Yuri did that and the Wheaton coaches are doing that now.

He's had many teams at lower levels. I have seen him at Sectionals coaching Novice teams, for example. We just don't hear about it because those teams tend to break up 10x before they get to the Jr. and Senior level. Also, it's been less and less true over the years and I think that's part of the problem. He likes working with those younger teams but right now he only has Senior teams. (Well, had. )

The last time I saw him with a Novice team was 2004 or 2005?? I can't remember. I bet Sylvia does.

I have seen him work with his teams and he is intense but not anything like what you would imagine a mean Russian coach to be

He can be a steamroller when he's working. If you've been run over by him, you won't necessarily like him.