View Poll Results: Who is the weakest link among these past ladies champions?

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  • Lu Chen

    9 3.61%
  • Michelle Kwan

    3 1.20%
  • Tara Lipinski

    47 18.88%
  • Maria Butyrskaya

    43 17.27%
  • Irina Slutskaya

    3 1.20%
  • Shizuka Arakawa

    9 3.61%
  • Miki Ando

    62 24.90%
  • Mao Asada

    8 3.21%
  • Yuna Kim

    4 1.61%
  • Carolina Kostner

    61 24.50%
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  1. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    How can any injury be considered a weakness? Every athlete is susceptible to an injury. Why should Tara's hip injury be held against her when even Yagudin had a career ending hip injury too? Abt had numerous injuries which kept him from getting ahead in his career. Even Carolina struggled with a knee injury and had to leave out the lutz and flip from her programs.

    To me, Tara appears highly competitive and mentally tough, not to mention a very consistent jumper.
    Abt and Yagudin aren't in the poll -- and if there was a similar poll for men, the fact that Abt's injuries interfered with competitive success may be responsible for his getting a certain number of votes. That all atheletes are susceptible doesn't alter the fact that injury imposed limitations are as much limitations as are limitations imposed by other factors.

  2. #62
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    I can't believe Kostner could be out already.

    Can I rescind my Ando vote and give it to Lipinski?

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by casken View Post
    I can't believe Kostner could be out already.

    Can I rescind my Ando vote and give it to Lipinski?
    Buck up, casken. According to , Kostner is going to be invited to the All Stars edition.

  4. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by casken View Post
    I can't believe Kostner could be out already.

    Can I rescind my Ando vote and give it to Lipinski?
    Lipinski's not that far behind. She can still overtake Kostner.
    My job requires me to be a juggler, but that does not mean that I enjoy working with clowns.

  5. #65
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    At one point Lipinski was pretty far ahead. The gap has closed considerably though, and now people seem to be divided among her, Butyrskaya, Ando and Kostner. Out of those four I think 2 are fair game- after that, it gets a little tougher among the rest of the field.
    Last edited by RD; 06-05-2012 at 03:27 PM.

  6. #66

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    I think a lot of people who were shocked at the beginning to see Tara leading voted for Carolina so Lipinski can stay another round. That's the fun of the game!

  7. #67
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    No!!! Caro has some of the best skating skills of all time imo. She's such a fast skater. And she has been working on consistency so when she brings back the triple lutz she'll be amazing.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by orientalplane View Post
    I don't think Lipinski would have as many votes had she not beaten Michelle at the Olympics. If Kwan had never existed, Lipinski would be celebrated as a fine and outstanding skater, and her one or two flaws would be forgotten.
    so true! You never once ever see anyone question Baiul's wc or ogm wins. Never! That's because Kwan wasn't there. That's why Oksana is worshiped like a god and none of her faults are ever discussed here at fsu, EVER.

    seriously, get a grip.

  9. #69

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    WTH, Ando is still here?

  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by berthesghost View Post
    so true! You never once ever see anyone question Baiul's wc or ogm wins. Never! That's because Kwan wasn't there. That's why Oksana is worshiped like a god and none of her faults are ever discussed here at fsu, EVER.

    seriously, get a grip.
    Have you been living under a rock? Oksana is one of the most bashed skaters on fsu. The reason you don't see her in the discussion in this thread is her name is not on the list.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    Have you been living under a rock? Oksana is one of the most bashed skaters on fsu. The reason you don't see her in the discussion in this thread is her name is not on the list.
    Vash01, in case you hadn't noticed, berthesghost frequently uses heavy irony in her posts. This was one of those instances.

  12. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    Vash01, in case you hadn't noticed, berthesghost frequently uses heavy irony in her posts. This was one of those instances.
    That may be so, but I don't see how her comment relates to the quote by Orientalplane. I will take your word for it though.

  13. #73

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    Well I'm shocked that Carolina's about to beat Miki for one of the "weakest ladies champions" category.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple Butz View Post
    I actually think Tara was an extremely polished skater. She had nice posture and her positions were above average. She didn't have the emotional depth of a Michelle Kwan in terms of performance, but I don't think any of the ladies on this list had that, save maybe Lu Chen (JMHO).

    I think Ando or Kostner should be the next to go. Ando had consistency but never really showcased an understanding of music or choreography and Kostner didn't have the killer instinct in the big competitions (including her win this year).
    As much as I am not an Ando fan, Butyrskaya is really the weakest skater of this group. She won her World title in a super weak transition year where other than Kwan and Maria herself everyone substantial was either retired, slumping or out entirely (eg- Slutskaya), or not emerged or contending yet (eg- 13 year old Hughes). That Malinina was that years GP final Champion, Maria in her World title year even failing to beat someone like Malinina to win that title she could never win, and one of the heavy favorites going into Worlds, says it all (and I loved Malinina and really wish she had snuck a medal at those Worlds, but lets be real here). Nobody ever considered Maria a gold contender for Worlds or Olympics any year besides 2000, the year she was defending Champion. Heck other than 1999 and 2000 she was never regarded as anymore than a bronze contender, and usually a long shot at that. She didnt stand out for either technical (not great jumps, inconsistent, no great elements), or artistic (jerky, stiffy, cold emotionally, nerves affected performance level and smoothness), and wasnt a strong or consistent competitor.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    Now it's getting interesting, with no single obvious 'winner'.

    I voted for Carolina. Not that I dislike her; actually I have enjoyed watching her skate last two years, but she won worlds in the weakest field, where she did not even need a 3lutz.
    Interesting.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    As much as I am not an Ando fan, Butyrskaya is really the weakest skater of this group. She won her World title in a super weak transition year where other than Kwan and Maria herself everyone substantial was either retired, slumping or out entirely (eg- Slutskaya), or not emerged or contending yet (eg- 13 year old Hughes). That Malinina was that years GP final Champion, Maria in her World title year even failing to beat someone like Malinina to win that title she could never win, and one of the heavy favorites going into Worlds, says it all (and I loved Malinina and really wish she had snuck a medal at those Worlds, but lets be real here). Nobody ever considered Maria a gold contender for Worlds or Olympics any year besides 2000, the year she was defending Champion. Heck other than 1999 and 2000 she was never regarded as anymore than a bronze contender, and usually a long shot at that. She didnt stand out for either technical (not great jumps, inconsistent, no great elements), or artistic (jerky, stiffy, cold emotionally, nerves affected performance level and smoothness), and wasnt a strong or consistent competitor.
    Personally, I find her artistry beautiful. She was the most feminine skater out there, a true lady on the ice IMO. But I agree she should be out.

    It was very sad that she lost her momentum after 2000 Worlds. However, if she had skated there cleanly I think she would've won. Following season, the judges gave up on her and she didn't even win the bronze at 2001 Worlds where she should have won IMO. 2000 NHK was also telling a lot where she lost to Slutskya. However, Maria herself said that she had lost because she had already qualified for the GPF and Slutskaya had needed points to qualify. Maybe that was true but I still think that at that point the judges just gave up on her.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vash01 View Post
    That may be so, but I don't see how her comment relates to the quote by Orientalplane. I will take your word for it though.
    It's been explained to us. Skaters are being eliminated based on how big a threat they were to Kwan. That's why irina was the first to be voted off and kimmie, a weaker skater who never faced Kwan at worlds, is still here with very few points. Oh, wait.....

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by berthesghost View Post
    It's been explained to us. Skaters are being eliminated based on how big a threat they were to Kwan. That's why irina was the first to be voted off and kimmie, a weaker skater who never faced Kwan at worlds, is still here with very few points. Oh, wait.....
    Actually, Kimmie was voted off first and Irina is still in the running!

    Sarcasm, I know, but couldn't resist

  19. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by l'etoile View Post
    Well I'm shocked that Carolina's about to beat Miki for one of the "weakest ladies champions" category.
    How can Miki be the weakest? She is a two time world champion, who landed all the difficult jumps except the 3A. Miki won in strong fields. Carolina won in the weakest field.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgejudy27 View Post
    As much as I am not an Ando fan, Butyrskaya is really the weakest skater of this group. She won her World title in a super weak transition year where other than Kwan and Maria herself everyone substantial was either retired, slumping or out entirely (eg- Slutskaya), or not emerged or contending yet (eg- 13 year old Hughes). That Malinina was that years GP final Champion, Maria in her World title year even failing to beat someone like Malinina to win that title she could never win, and one of the heavy favorites going into Worlds, says it all (and I loved Malinina and really wish she had snuck a medal at those Worlds, but lets be real here). Nobody ever considered Maria a gold contender for Worlds or Olympics any year besides 2000, the year she was defending Champion. Heck other than 1999 and 2000 she was never regarded as anymore than a bronze contender, and usually a long shot at that. She didnt stand out for either technical (not great jumps, inconsistent, no great elements), or artistic (jerky, stiffy, cold emotionally, nerves affected performance level and smoothness), and wasnt a strong or consistent competitor.
    Maria Butylskaya skated 2 beautiful programs at 99 Worlds IIRC and won ther world title convincingly that year. I also remember that she was considered the main rival to Kwan before Slutskaya got her act together around 99 GPF.

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